Do I really need all this!

[straycat]

I am trying to accumulate all the info I can before starting my empty 55 hex salt water tank. This one will be mainly for salt water fish and live rock, etc. The next one I start will be a reef. I have been to the GARF site and have talked to them on the phone getting some great info BUT also have some questions. If I am reading this rite GARF exclusively uses a plenum, grunge, live rock and power heads. They only test for salinity nothing else. No skimmers, sumps, etc. Now I get on this site and read about all the equipment I need to run a sucessfull marine tank, what am I missing here? Can someone explain to me in a way I can understand why I need all the expensive equipment? I am not trying to but heads here just looking for the best, simplest and least expensive way to get into this great hobby or is that statement an oxymoron! Thanks in advance, Lon

 

[MarineTeng]

personally, sumps and skimmers give some lazy room, for the lack of better terms, sumps have a number of benefits (taken from Melev's reef)
Increased total water volume - This dilutes your water of accumulating pollutants, and helps avoid issues that occur quickly in sumpless tanks.
Skims the surface - No more surface scum, just crystal clear water.
Lowers temperature - I've observed a 2° F drop after the sump is installed.
Hides equipment - Heaters, protein skimmers, monitoring probes, grounding probes and more can be moved to the sump & out of the display tank.
Consistent water level - The display tank will maintain the same water level all the times; evaporation occurs in the sump over time (see auto top-off).
Safe place to pour in additives - Adding chemicals or new (Reverse Osmosis De-Ionized) water in the sump allows it to mix before entering the display tank.
Increased circulation - The return water from the sump is yet another way to move water in your tank. You can point the return outlet(s) in different directions to create flow, instead of putting more powerheads in your display tank!
Increased oxygenation - As water drains into your sump, air mixes in the water, allowing beneficial gas exchange, releasing CO2 and adding fresh O2.
though they have an increased chance of water going everywhere or flooding, if you plan right it shouldn't happen though things do do weird things
Skimmers, just improve water quality, i think they're valuable cause they take out some of the reason to do water changes, though you should do them i believe u don't need to do them as often, plus they oxygenate the water well with all those bubbles,
in terms of testing, i really only do salinity pH and temp, temp is a probe, pH is rarely done as i've never had trouble with it and salinity for water changes mainly, also i've never had a really high bio load so nitrates haven't been a problem, i did test for ammonia and nitrites though during the cycling stage
take your time to set the tank up for now and what you want to do in the future, watch the little things, like room beside the tank, do you want a lot of hang on equipment or all in sump stuff, or just very little period, many methods work, just got to try stuff out sometimes
i'm not sure what else is in etc but things like what you want to keep is important, i'll try and help you as much as i can, a tip would be use the selling equipment forums as a lot of used stuff is there in terms of cost
buying a whole set up might be your best bet for all costs
i thought of an etc, sources of nutrients, foods and water, RO/DI is very popular and probably worth the investment though i've never had the money to, or water conditions depending on how the quality of the water is in your area, also salt brand often makes a big difference, the most common is Instant Ocean (IO) which has been a long time company, personally i use oceanic which is a bit cheaper at least where i've gotten it and i've been satisfied

 

[Krish]

A friend of mine is into the "Garf" style setup. He introduced me to their website, but I've never really gotten into it that much. The problem with giving people advice on "which way is best" kinda thing, is a bit difficult because what works for you may not work for me. I tend to look around and see what the most "popular trend" or what the majority of reefers are doing, and then try to figure out what will work best for me. Personally, I don't think you can be all that successful with a reef setup without a good skimmer, good lighting and good flow. I find them to be the foundation of a good system to me. Just my opinion though...Best of luck.

 

[mmkeeper]

I have a dsb and a sand bead in my sump and Garf grunge gave my sand a great boost. once I added it my coraline (sp) algae really started to grow. It also help increase my copod population.

 

[Casperson]

Hi Guys.
I've talked to Leroy on many occations, I purchase hermits and snails from them every so often. Bought some coral frags from them too. Odd that you were told they don't use skimmers or have sumps?
I know they use both. However, I know they have experimented lots over the years with different methods. IMO, I would never set up a tank without using a skimmer unless it was a 10gal. and changed 90 percent of the water weekly. I'm a fan of DSB, sump, refugium, GOOD skimming, 20% weekly water change.

Tom C.

 

[wrightme43]

Not knocking GARF, there are many many many ways to get a reef tank to work. It depends on what you want to keep.
I like the sump, skimmer, fuge, bare bottom tank and sump, and fuge way. Thats me, it works for me. Others like the no skimmer, lots of sand and that way works for them.
The best advice I can give you is to look at the tanks you want yours to look like, and do what they do. I can tell you this.
After going Bare Bottom, my corals grow faster, and have better color. If you wanna know why, just help someone tear down a sand bed.

 

[Scooterman]

Best advice I can give anyone is read, not just at one particular site either!

 

[Skimmy]

definately be wary of anyone who says "this is the best way to set up a reef"
and frankly garf does alot of stuff that i think is kinds fool hearty, like run a tank with tap water and no skimmer. especially if you dont have alot of experience to troubleshoot the inevitable noob mistakes, if anything it would be better to error on the side of caution. i agree with krish, try to research and read as much as you can, speak to as many experienced people as you can, and you will start to notice common threads of information reoccuring in different people's methodology. the major one's you will find would probably be;

1. use purified reverse osmosis water, NOT tap water.

2. a protein skimmer is probably singularly the most important piece of equipment for your saltwater fish/reef tank.

3. live rock is probably the best biological filter there is, the simple formula of a pound per gallon to get started is most common.

4. high water flow within the aquarium and filtration will increase your water quality and keep your livestock of fish and/or corals happy.

from there things kinda fan out into peoples own variation based upon their personal experience, concerning sandbeds, chemicals to dose, lighting, maintenance, etc..
keep reading and searching, and form your own opinions based on common sense, logic, and experience.
you will find many of the good folks on this site to be a wealth of information

and finally, WELCOME! glad you found us.

 

[liveforphysics]

I have been sucessful with many differnt types of tanks with nothing more than circulation and cheato.

I think it has to work together as a system. Either you can do what all the retailers would like you to do and keep your tank on life support, OR (not a half and half, its all or nothing) you can setup a refugium with slow circulation and cheato (the display itself obvously needs high circulation).

The natural tank will provide more food for your corals and things, which they obvously are designed to eat(hence grabbing polyps etc.) I belive that this natural feeding can provide nutrients for corals and things with out needing to be quite as dependent on photosynthsis for algae makeing sugars to sustain them.

Reefcentral member "garf volenteer" can show you some pics of amazing growth and colors in clams, SPS, LPS etc which are only seeing light from 4 NO florecent tubes.

There are many ways to skin a cat, I personally like the method which lets it all happen naturally.