Im not use to major equipment on smaller reef tanks system, who could help in this?

[OldManOfTheSea]

I will stay for now until after the holidays into the start of next year with the 175 MH lights on the 180 and will see about getting one the Euroreef skimmer working with the calcium reactor and I will have Thong check the lighting that it properly operating and I only will have to add on timers.

I say that because i will not be getting any major SPS corals for more then 6-7 months and I feel that its more important to me that I have the 40 gal breeder setup as I original wanted it for corals and fish.


So, I spoken to thong on the phone and he needs for me to tell him of the model of the skimmer and so that I would want on the 40 gal breeder. Like skimmer and chiller and im guessing the calcium reactor as well. So please give some help in this for I never done so small a tank with a calcium reactor and all and with a chiller no less.

I need info on the small reservoir as well so as soon as I get this all together for thong, im to email him this and I already told him that I wanted an all glass custom build sump to fit under the tank as tight fitting as possible, to fit under the tank. I hope that I explained this well enough, for I hope to get this together by Tuesday and email to Thong. Thanks in advance.

So I will need a:

(1) skimmer model
(2) Calcium reactor model (small model)
(3) chiller model (I think with the sump will be a total 70 gal water volume)
(4) water reservoir (A small system in which will be outside of the tanks stand)
(5) heater I have
(6) T-5 model lights

And do help list what I not thought of here, Thanks

 

[ret25yo]

Aqua-c remora pro with mag7

 

[Maxx]

I will stay for now until after the holidays into the start of next year with the 175 MH lights on the 180 and will see about getting one the Euroreef skimmer working with the calcium reactor and I will have Thong check the lighting that it properly operating and I only will have to add on timers.

I say that because i will not be getting any major SPS corals for more then 6-7 months and I feel that its more important to me that I have the 40 gal breeder setup as I original wanted it for corals and fish.


So, I spoken to thong on the phone and he needs for me to tell him of the model of the skimmer and so that I would want on the 40 gal breeder. Like skimmer and chiller and im guessing the calcium reactor as well. So please give some help in this for I never done so small a tank with a calcium reactor and all and with a chiller no less.

I need info on the small reservoir as well so as soon as I get this all together for thong, im to email him this and I already told him that I wanted an all glass custom build sump to fit under the tank as tight fitting as possible, to fit under the tank. I hope that I explained this well enough, for I hope to get this together by Tuesday and email to Thong. Thanks in advance.

So I will need a:

(1) skimmer model
(2) Calcium reactor model (small model)
(3) chiller model (I think with the sump will be a total 70 gal water volume)
(4) water reservoir (A small system in which will be outside of the tanks stand)
(5) heater I have
(6) T-5 model lights

And do help list what I not thought of here, Thanks

Not sure if I understand you right....
but it sounds like you have a 180 and for one reason or another you are only going to be keeping SPS and fish in a 40 breeder, so you would like suggestions on equipment that you can use on the 40 until you're able to go ahead with the 180 in the next couple of months?

If this is correct, I would suggest the following....

Skimmer
If you have room in the sump, I would usggest going with a used skimmer, either a Euroreef model or an ASM rated for the water volume you are estimating. If no room for one of those skimmers, I would suggest a Aqua C Urchin Pro skimmer.

Calcium Reactor
I owuld go ahead and get a calcium reactor sized for the 180 if your going to be switching over anytime in the forseeable future. You can easliy turn down the reactor's flow and CO2 bubble rate to match your smaller tank, and still use it later on the larger tank. This way you are only buying an expensive item like this only once...

Chiller
Unless you are absolutely positive you need one for a tank that size, I would find away to avoid using one. You will most likely be able to get away with using fans to keep the tank cool. I would avoid using submersible pumps if possible, (like the Mag 7), since they add a large amount of heat to the water column. If you lessen the amount of heat being added to the tank, you might avoid needing a chiller. The only way you will really know if you need a chiller is to get the system up and running, and monitor the temps with everything on. Then you will know how much of a temp pull down you will really need. I doubt very seriously you will need more than a 1/10th hp unit if at all.

Water resevoir
I would just go to the local hardware store and pick up a Brute/Rubbermaid trashcan w/ a lid.


One thing I have noticed is that you are leaving out any plans for a closed loop or circulation in the tank. Have you kept SPS before? SPS require heavy flow to bring them nutrients and remove waste, without it they will not survive.

What are you planning on using for water circulation?

Nick

 

[OldManOfTheSea]

Hi Nick and Thank You, I was however was to upgrade the 180 and 240 gals lights from 175 to 250 watts MH and on the 240 I need to change the sump that is in there for because that the stand has only 24" of height, my skimmer choices are few.

The thing also is I not manage my money all that well and when I have a B-day or so in the family, I spend. Its a bad habit I guess, but just the same it gives me great feelings.

Anyway, because I will only manage around $2,200 or so I figured that why not do the 40 gal QT first with that. For i need this tank to age well enough before the other tanks are ready. So I decided this, that i will for the time being, leave the 175 watts MH on the 180 and I only have to get one the Euroreefs to work and the calcium reactor as well and then I will be able to do something within this tank.

Then after the holidays are over I will first get the money to upgrade the lights on the 180 and following prior to the 6th month of operations, I will then look to begin ordering SPS corals. I need to do this in this way because im the property tax to get up before Dec and two other main deals that I must take care of.

Also on the skimmer idea, im also starting to look at this model:
http://www.myreefcreations.com/psstandard.htm

I have thoughts to enlarge the hood, but im still in thoughts on the calcium reactor idea. The chiller however, I may have to go large as what is on the other tanks I have. For the smaller chiller models will only chill/cool the water buy like 15 degrees if that and the chiller cost like $350 and im thinking of getting the same as I on the larger tanks nd spend the $600 and not have to worry about it.

So in getting the canopy build taller, just how tall should I look for? The canopy that fish world put in is exactly 8 3/4" high from top to bottom. I knew with this that I was in for to do over another item jeff has done here.
So in raising the height of the canopy and that I will have a chiller, I might as well go with MH, but which?

I not keep the type of SPS corals im looking to do here and I know that lighting and currents are two major factors for them and im looking to keep the SPS coral with the highest requirements which is why I know to allow the main tank to age and why I need to start this 40 with a far greater setup then it has.

On the calcium reactor, they do make smaller models, I just have to locate them for the one I now have would be too much to manage to control on so small a system. And also on the chiller that you feel I might have no need for it. I live where it gets pretty hot in the warmer months and it might cost even more to have the AC set so low to keep the whole house very cool in order to control the tanks temperatures.

Also on the return pump, I would need some ides and if there be a great strong pump for the tanks currents that isn't as well so large a model.
I hope that I responded to every question you ask here>

Thanks

 

[Maxx]

With your self imposed budget of $2200, you're going to have to DIY somethings to make it work...

Couple of thoughts...
you've already got the 175 watt MH's? Use them over the 40 breeder. Its a 16 inch deep aquarium, and the 175's will be perfect for it. Save money there.

The skimmer you're looking at is a beckett injector skimmer. That means you need a large powerful pump to run the skimmer. This adds to your costs in several ways...
initial purchase pf the pump
electrical use of the pump, (def something to consider with the pressure rated pump needed to properly run a beckett skimmer)
heat added to the water from the pump, may require you to purchase a chiller.

I still think you should go normal sized on the calcium reactor, if not buy one large enough for the 180 since you can use it on the smaller tank quite easily just by dialing it down. But since money is an issue here, consider either going with a 2 part dosing system, or a kalk reactor. You could also use one of the many plans on the net to build your own calcium reactor, kalk reactor, or 2 part dosing system.

The chiller however, I may have to go large as what is on the other tanks I have. For the smaller chiller models will only chill/cool the water buy like 15 degrees if that and the chiller cost like $350 and im thinking of getting the same as I on the larger tanks nd spend the $600 and not have to worry about it.

The problem is that you cant do things that way....you need to size the chiller to the size of you tank. Too large a chiller for the system, and it will cycle on/off frequently and shorten the life of the chiller. Too small, and it will never shut off. The way to determine the correct chiller size for your tank is to get the system running, turn everything on, and see how hot the tank gets. Since SPS dont handle temps above 84 F well, and ideally, temps around 80-82 F is where you want to be, you can figure out how much of a temp pull down you need for you tank. Once you have that figured you can choose the right size chiller. Sadly, I know what I'm talking about here. I ahve a 58 gallon tank set up, (75 gallons total system volume) with a 1/4 hp chiller that I bought used. Its oversized and runs frequently. Without a chiller, my tank runs up to 87 degrees F. All I needed for my tank was either a 1/10 hp or a 1/15 hp unit...which would have been less expensive than my 1/4 hp unit, and used less electricity.

I have no idea what you're planning to run with the tank that would even remotely raisee the tank temp to the level where you need a 15 degree cool down. Are you planning on a cold water reef?

Nick

 

[OldManOfTheSea]

Nick, The budget as it is be only until after the end of the year in which I like to get all the best for the setup. But today I been thinking on this 40 gal QT and I came up with this>

Jeff of fish world set me up with crap and the canopy needs to be changed as everything else on the 40 for even the stand is missing a door since Jeff had set it up and I figure to trash this whole 40 gal setup and upgrade it to a 60 or 65 gal tank. The other idea in this is the smaller model chiller are limited to how well they will chill the aquariums water and I have still in its box an Aqua-chill 1/4 HP chiller and im thinking that the chiller part is taking care of here and all I need now is a all glass custom sump with a reservoir, both under the tank stand and the chiller will be on the outside. I Get the stand with a canopy and this time it be of a certain height, and on a 60 or 65, will one 250 watts bulb do and it burns on both ends?

And if that be OK, one duel ballast will do>

NICK! You think perhaps two 175 would do on a 60 or 65? These can be taking off the 240 gal tank and leave those on the 180 for I said that the lights on the 180 will be change, but after the holidays are done with.

HA, Ha I just readied where you said that if I went with that skimmer I may require a chiller

So it that agreed? And do I get the MR-1 or the MR-2? The listing gal requirements shows the MR-1 be OK

Im going in the morning to talk on this idea to another lfs that I found that is nearer to me, it would be great if you show you either agree or disagree on the skimmer idea>

So this also changes the issue on the calcium reactor that it not have to be so small a model, lets hear a good model type for this>

The problem is that you cant do things that way....you need to size the chiller to the size of you tank. Too large a chiller for the system, and it will cycle on/off frequently and shorten the life of the chiller. Too small, and it will never shut off. The way to determine the correct chiller size for your tank is to get the system running, turn everything on, and see how hot the tank gets. Since SPS dont handle temps above 84 F well, and ideally, temps around 80-82 F is where you want to be, you can figure out how much of a temp pull down you need for you tank. Once you have that figured you can choose the right size chiller. Sadly, I know what I'm talking about here. I ahve a 58 gallon tank set up, (75 gallons total system volume) with a 1/4 hp chiller that I bought used. Its oversized and runs frequently. Without a chiller, my tank runs up to 87 degrees F. All I needed for my tank was either a 1/10 hp or a 1/15 hp unit...which would have been less expensive than my 1/4 hp unit, and used less electricity.

I certainly appreciate all you are trying and sorry for this sudden change of ideas, so now the system will be not less then 90 or 100 gals in water volume, is the 1/4 HP chiller suitable enough for this? And not forget that the pumps and MH will all only add heat to the system and im will be very concern to have a chiller that will be over task by it and would only over work in the attempt.

The tanks temp will be set at 78 degrees as the two large reef tanks will be as well>

Thanks a Million

Buddy

 

[Maxx]

Nick, The budget as it is be only until after the end of the year in which I like to get all the best for the setup.

Okay, heres another thought....why not wait til the new year and start the 180/240? I understand the need/desire to start up a tank immediately, but if you have $2200 to play with until January...I would suggest you consider buying equipment for the larger tank and then setting up the larger tank. My personal experiance with setting up reeftanks is doing things halfway gets frustrating fast....

have still in its box an Aqua-chill 1/4 HP chiller and im thinking that the chiller part is taking care of here

This chiller is ideally sized for a 120-180 gallon system , (based on my 1/4 hp chiller which is not the same manufacturer...so thats not really a fair comparison....but....)
Its too big for a smaller system, and I think it would be too smal for a 240 gallon system or larger. Remeber when talking about chiller sizing, you're not talking about the tank size, you're talking about total system volume....

You think perhaps two 175 would do on a 60 or 65? These can be taking off the 240 gal tank and leave those on the 180 for I said that the lights on the 180 will be change, but after the holidays are done with.

Dual 175's would work on a 60/65, but not as well. The 60/65 is 21-23 inches in depth which will significantly affect photo intensity. You could place acro's in the upper portions of your rockwork, and less light loving corals in the lower areas, and things would be just fine.

How long is this tank going to be running before you change over to the larger tank? if its less than a year, I'd really suggest you consider going with a fish only tank, or just holding off until you can get the big one up and running. Your tank will need to stable before you start adding corals and other sensitive inverts, and the maturation process will take pretty close to 6 months for that to work out right....so in a sense it would be cheaper for you to wait until you can just set up the bigger tank, instead of setting up the small tank, and then settting up the larger tank. I hope that makes sense. I'm not trying to talk you out of setting up the tank you want, I'm trying talk you into giving yourself the best chance to be successful. I've seen way too many newcommers to this hobby get excited and rush things, and then have tank meltdown, which causes them to be very discouraged, and they get out of the hobby.

HA, Ha I just readied where you said that if I went with that skimmer I may require a chiller
So it that agreed? And do I get the MR-1 or the MR-2? The listing gal requirements shows the MR-1 be OK
Im going in the morning to talk on this idea to another lfs that I found that is nearer to me, it would be great if you show you either agree or disagree on the skimmer idea>

I've never used a beckett skimmer, I've read several things about them that made me want to go another route regarding skimmers, but I do know several people who have used them on truly beautiful tanks, and are very happy with them. I'm using 3 different skimmers at the moment, on three different tanks...
A Euroreef CS6-2 on my 58 gallon tank , (75 gallons total)
An H&S AF 150-2001 re-circulating skimmer on my 120 gallon tank, (150 gallons total)
And an Aqua-C Remora Pro skimmer powered by a Mag 3 pump, on my 10 gallon tank. (A little less than 10 gallons, this overkill on this tank, but I had the skimmer and needed one for the tank...)

So this also changes the issue on the calcium reactor that it not have to be so small a model, lets hear a good model type for this>

I've used two different models of calcium reactor...
Korallin C-1502
Geo 612

The Geo is MUCH MUCH easier to dial in and use. I definately prefer it over the Korallin. Both www.premiumaquatics.com and www.phishybusiness.com carry Geo calcium reactors. I've ordered from them both several times in the past and been very happy with them.

No worries about the change in plans...believe, your plans for this set up will change alot more as time goes on....



Nick

 

[OldManOfTheSea]

The thing with the 240 or both large reef tanks is that I will need a greater deal of money then $2200 and the main idea here is that I have the QT at least ready for fish before the corals come for if i were to go a head and do the 180 lights, I wouldn't then have any QT.

As you say Nick, doing things halfway gets frustrating fast but please think of it in this way. I been paying and planning to have these tanks, at least the new 240 gal reef tank for more then 7.5 years now and I paid jeff at fish world the full cost of what was on the contract and I what I have here is nothing near to what I wanted for if he done these tanks right, I wouldn't have to be going through this right now in order to enjoy just one of the reef tanks.

For from here on is all extra cost to get these tanks as I wanted them. You did understand that jeff placed on my 240 a stand with a height under the tank of just 24" and the sump he put in for this tank was not what I wanted as well for I was supposed to have a all custom all glass sump and I told him that I wanted it more then 75 gals and what he put in is a custom 60 gal tank. If you can realize this, the stand height is 24" and the tank sump is 17" high leaving some 7" of space to get a skimmer over the top of the sump.
Jeff place this same chiller on the 240, are you saying that I would have to do that as well over again?

I am talking about total system volume and not just the tank, isn't that the way its always suppose to be?

Dual 175's would work on a 60/65, but not as well. The 60/65 is 21-23 inches in depth which will significantly affect photo intensity. You could place acro's in the upper portions of your rockwork, and less light loving corals in the lower areas, and things would be just fine.

If that is a problem, it sounds to me from what you are saying that I would require stronger MH What you think about two 250 watts MH, and which be better of an idea, burn at only one end or burn at both ends

I'd really suggest you consider going with a fish only tank, or just holding off until you can get the big one up and running.

The 180 will be running with the 175 watts MH for not forget, I will not be getting any major SPS corals until after the upgrading to 250 and that it be the 180 would have age past six months. I will be going with polyps and Rec and zoas and so on. I also not need to get the MH right away on the new QT, just get it up and running as you said to manage F/O. I only will need at first the skimmer for this and sump and reservoir. The room has plenty of light so as a QT for the time, I not would need to get another reg FO lighting fixer or I use the one this 40 have until I get the MH lights in. Your guidance in this project is very helpful besides for the most part of it , is the only guidance I have right now. So please don't stop>

It do make sense for I wouldn't be right away needing to place corals in the QT for I not have to worry about hitch-hikers just yet for which my main concern be flatworms.

So maybe I even move this a notch, go up to a 75 gal tank, with the chiller and as large a sump I could mange in this with a small reservoir of course, does it ease your concerns of the 1/4 HP chiller?

And with that, all the lfs person has to put in for me at this time is the tank and stand with canopy, sump, reservoir, skimmer and i figure just a dusting of sand with a few LR that I would remove if have to medicate any fish.
But still I need a idea for the return pump? I need to get it as if the tank is a coral holding tank.

As being successful or not, I do expect some let downs to my part of some SPS corals, but then I been before now still until a while ago sticking it out with that Jeff person, I had all the patience anyone could have and still now, I have it in how to wait, the idea for right now is to get the 180 going and the QT and allow them to age.

I not expect on my part any huge failures and the word discouragement has no part of my life for after fighting in N. Korean and Vietnam Wars, this will seem much easier>

But the either 60 or 75 gal QT, it will be finished as in the desired way I like it to be setup, complete wioth everything for the SPS coral will be in this tank for as long as eight weeks.

You are very helpful Nick, VERY Thanks


PS. Nick, I already have the 1/4 HP chiller, i had it herer for almost two years now, I prefer to have it on being the tanks can get pretty hot. On the twin tanks system, I no MH and those tanks get real hot if I not have a chiller in place. On these tanks I not have the chiller running at all times, only during the times it be needed to help cool the tanks water>