Low Ph

[scubamitch]

Hi, I'm suddenly having low ph isues, bad is low 7s, good is 7.8. Calcium 500, Alk 9.9 (Salifert). Don't test Mg, but added some recipe 1. I run make up RO through a homemade Kalk reactor, have a co2 calc reactor, home made 2nd stage. Electronic ph meter, lab grade calibration solutions. Skimmer is running good, house is all electric with air exchange. Recent aggressive water changes not helped (I OD'ed the Alk trying to raise it). Fish seem fine, corals so so, open, but not thriving. Well water is hard, keeps the Alk high, gut feeling, the aquafer may have changed recently. Anybody any thoughts? Any buffers which will raise ph only? Thanks, Mitch.

 

[DonW]

Hi, I'm suddenly having low ph isues, bad is low 7s, good is 7.8. Calcium 500, Alk 9.9 (Salifert). Don't test Mg, but added some recipe 1. I run make up RO through a homemade Kalk reactor, have a co2 calc reactor, home made 2nd stage. Electronic ph meter, lab grade calibration solutions. Skimmer is running good, house is all electric with air exchange. Recent aggressive water changes not helped (I OD'ed the Alk trying to raise it). Fish seem fine, corals so so, open, but not thriving. Well water is hard, keeps the Alk high, gut feeling, the aquafer may have changed recently. Anybody any thoughts? Any buffers which will raise ph only? Thanks, Mitch.

Low 7's, how low exactly?

Don

 

[plack]

Ok Your Alkalinity is low it is (in meq/l at 3.54) and should be at 6.95 meq/l.

I know ading alk buffer to much at a time will cause a reaction with the net result of having deposits on the glass in the motors on the filters and rock everywhere :-(

Test your new salt water mix by making 1 gallon and testing it before you do a water change if it is still a low ph and its balanced then to much co2 is present and you need to get it out and more fresh air in. ( I am currently working on the same problem and have outside air coming into my skimmer and a window slightly open behind my tank )


Here are some links. One about low ph problems .

Another is a calculator about calcium and alkalinity and if you put in a lower calcium than you have and then pick for a desired calcium amount the actual level you have and then pick any product in the drop down menu and click calculate it will tell you the balanced Alk. The rest I am sure you can get yourself

It also has another calculator for the Calcium reactor settup to keep it running with the proper amount of co2. (remember the reactor dissolves ca and alk balanced it gets out of balance from other things like water changes or addatives not from the reactor it just raises it either too slow or too fast)


And last a link to do it yourself addatives for ca and alk


ok finnaly here they are

http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/june2002/chem.htm

http://home.comcast.net/~jdieck1/chemcalc.html

http://home.comcast.net/~jdieck1/reactor.html

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2006-02/rhf/index.php

 

[DonW]

Ok Your Alkalinity is low it is (in meq/l at 3.54) and should be at 6.95 meq/l.

Plack,
His is alk is stated to be 9.9, this is just fine.
FYI
3.54 meg/l * 2.8 = 9.91 DKH
6.95 meg/l * 2.8 = 19.46 DKH


Don

 

[scubamitch]

Get a high of 7.8 end of photo period (14 compacts), drops as low as 7.2-7.4. I don't think it's a issue but I'll try the cup of for co2 water trick.

 

[DonW]

Get a high of 7.8 end of photo period (14 compacts), drops as low as 7.2-7.4. I don't think it's a issue but I'll try the cup of for co2 water trick.

7.2 is extremely low. It is nearly impossible to get that low without the help of co2 and I dont mean in the room.
Your carx is a source of that amount of co2. But honestly I would check the calibration of your meter. What meter and cal solution are you using.

Don

 

[scubamitch]

Don, Fisher Scentific instrument and cal fluids. Compared today, 7.7 morning at home, 7.8 at work (different instrument). Seem to be maintaining around 7.8 by increasing the make up water (+kalk). Can only do that so long. Any cleaning or activity in the tank seems to lower the ph. Have the skimmer cranked, air from outside the cabinet, giving light green dretrius. I'm going to shut down the calcx, maintain with recipe 1 for a while.

 

[DonW]

Don, Fisher Scentific instrument and cal fluids. Compared today, 7.7 morning at home, 7.8 at work (different instrument). Seem to be maintaining around 7.8 by increasing the make up water (+kalk). Can only do that so long. Any cleaning or activity in the tank seems to lower the ph. Have the skimmer cranked, air from outside the cabinet, giving light green dretrius. I'm going to shut down the calcx, maintain with recipe 1 for a while.

As long as your sure the calibration is correct. Your comment "any cleaning or activity in the tank seems to lower the ph" may very well be part of your issue but most likely its a combonation of the carx and excess nutrients. Nutrients and ambiant co2 alone is unlikely. Lets take a look athe the carx. There is no reason you shouldnt be able to continue its use, assuming its functioning propery. What are the reactor parameters?

Don

 

[scubamitch]

25 bubbles/min CO2, 30 drops/min, 6.3 ph output from 2nd tower of ARM media, homemade second stage

 

[DonW]

25 bubbles/min CO2, 30 drops/min, 6.3 ph output from 2nd tower of ARM media, homemade second stage

6.3 is to low bump it up to 6.9. Arm starts to dissolve at 7.0. Sounds like your driving down your ph. Bump it up and do some water changes.

Don

 

[scubamitch]

Give it a try, thanks Don

 

[plack]

Plack,
His is alk is stated to be 9.9, this is just fine.
FYI
3.54 meg/l * 2.8 = 9.91 DKH
6.95 meg/l * 2.8 = 19.46 DKH


Don

DonW --Not acording to these 2 different calculator !

http://home.comcast.net/~jdieck1/chemcalc.html

http://www.reefnerds.com/ChemPlot/ChemPlot.html

It shows that it's balanced at 6.95 meq/l at 500 ppm 9.9 DKH is not balanced !


If I am wrong I wanna know cause I have the same problem and Can't figure out why after calibrating my probe having fresh air come in etc. and my calcium reactor is replacing alk and kepping that stable !!!




Paul

 

[DonW]

DonW --Not acording to these 2 different calculator !

http://home.comcast.net/~jdieck1/chemcalc.html

http://www.reefnerds.com/ChemPlot/ChemPlot.html

It shows that it's balanced at 6.95 meq/l at 500 ppm 9.9 DKH is not balanced !


If I am wrong I wanna know cause I have the same problem and Can't figure out why after calibrating my probe having fresh air come in etc. and my calcium reactor is replacing alk and kepping that stable !!!




Paul

Balance ca to alk NOT alk to ca. At 500 your alk would be about 19.4 thats not going work. Let ca fall to a decent number and keep alk below 12.

Don

 

[DonW]

Take a look down at the bottom of this article. I tried to copy and past but it didnt format propery.
http://www.reefkeeping.com/issues/2002-04/rhf/feature/index.php


Don

 

[plack]

"Your not wrong about being balanced, you off about where you should be. Even though your ca may be 500 pushing your alk up to 19.4 to balance it is just plain dangerous and is going to cause precip. Balance your ca to your desired alk, but not more than 11 or 12. Do not balance your alk to your ca.

Set a alk number you want to stay at, I use 12 and keep it there. Then find the right balanced ca for a dkh of 12. Then multily that times 3 and that where your Mg should be.

Make sense
Don "

Yea I know this ca was to high to me but I have had precipetation from just bumping it back from 380 to 425 and adding supplements .

I responded before I read your Pm sorry I Got the flu and not exactly being my best.

Paul

 

[plack]

Hey Donw
I guess I need some help with my ph being low as well maybe you can help as I am about at witts end ready to change salts and test kits will add more info later
Paul

 

[DonW]

What your not getting is that you dont balance alk to ca. To be blunt at 500ca and alk of 19 yes you will be balanced, but your going to kill every coral in your tank. You run those numbers up as high as you want but it doesnt change the fact that running alk that high is going to kill everything. This is what happens when a ca reactor is adjusted to high.
Pick a number you like between 8dkh and 12dkh and balance the ca and mg to that alk but again dont go over 12.

Don

 

[DonW]

Hey Donw
I guess I need some help with my ph being low as well maybe you can help as I am about at witts end ready to change salts and test kits will add more info later
Paul

How low is it?

Don

 

[plack]

7.4/7.6
ca at 450
alk at 4.5
running a kalkwasser as well as a calcium reactor but it doesnt help much the kalk comes out measuring at the level it supposed to .
the ph probe calibrates at 7.0 and 10.0 correctly
the skimmer is drawing outside air 24/7
gotta go not feeling well

 

[DonW]

7.4/7.6
ca at 450
alk at 4.5
running a kalkwasser as well as a calcium reactor but it doesnt help much the kalk comes out measuring at the level it supposed to .
the ph probe calibrates at 7.0 and 10.0 correctly
the skimmer is drawing outside air 24/7
gotta go not feeling well

Get well. When your feeling better well get back to this.

Don