Maybe fin rot?

[Mahoney]

Looked up a bit on fin rot, but not sure if what I see is that. And, unfortunately, it's really hard to take a picture of the moving fish....

The A List

1. Fish: Yellow Tang, green clown goby (both appear unaffected). 6-line wrasse. A mated pair of black clown fish
2. Tang--3.5 inches, Goby-1.5 inches, Wrasse--2.25 inches, Female clown--3.5 inches, Male clown 3 inches
3. Tang--3 mo, Goby--2mo, Wrasse--2mo, Clowns--1yr+
4. All in display tank (thats all i have... I know, I know... but no room or $$ for a quarantine)
5. Wrasse--2-3mm sized small chunk out of center of tail fin, Female clown--same, Male clown--1-2mm chunk out of caudal fin. No unusual behavior--all eat, all swimming normally. No flashing. All soft corals in the tank are fine. Peppermint shrimp x 3 are fine.
6. Food--seaweed chunk (1x2.5 EOD, frozen omnivore food 2x daily--just enough for all fish to get a few bites)

The B List

pH-7.8
Kh-10gtt's
Nitrates--about 40ppm

Thats all I can test for unfortunately for chemistry

Salinity--1.023
Temp--78-79 degrees.

It is interesting that I just did a 10 gal water change yesterday (55 gal tank), when my nitrates were at 40ppm, and it hasn't changed. :/ I did rearrange a few things while I was changing the water, but I didn't muck up the sand too much or anything. Just mainly moved a few rocks around and some corals.

The C List

1. Sand bed about an inch to maybe 2 inches in a couple places where the sand has drifted a bit. No sump, no refugium. Bak-Pak 2 protein skimmer. 4 power heads, I in each corner. 55 gal system. 100lbs of live rock?... not sure on that... you are welcome to guess by my picture.
2. I currently have a bag of carbon hanging in front of my protein skimmer output to treat for 1 dose of abx (Seachem Kanaplex, 1.8 grams total used) I put in a week and a half ago for a chalk bass with pop-eye that I lost.
3. None of the fish appear to have the white stuff on their fins as I have seen described in fin rot. Maybe they are all just having a go at each other? As I said before, the Tang and the goby appear to be just fine.
There are also two feather dusters in the tank. One that shed it's head about 1.5 months ago and hasn't come back, the other seems just fine.


Thanks so much!
Amanda





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[Mahoney]

No one? Not a single thought/suggestion/comment?

 

[N1Husker]

Looked up a bit on fin rot, but not sure if what I see is that. And, unfortunately, it's really hard to take a picture of the moving fish....

The A List

1. Fish: Yellow Tang, green clown goby (both appear unaffected). 6-line wrasse. A mated pair of black clown fish
2. Tang--3.5 inches, Goby-1.5 inches, Wrasse--2.25 inches, Female clown--3.5 inches, Male clown 3 inches
3. Tang--3 mo, Goby--2mo, Wrasse--2mo, Clowns--1yr+
4. All in display tank (thats all i have... I know, I know... but no room or $$ for a quarantine)
5. Wrasse--2-3mm sized small chunk out of center of tail fin, Female clown--same, Male clown--1-2mm chunk out of caudal fin. No unusual behavior--all eat, all swimming normally. No flashing. All soft corals in the tank are fine. Peppermint shrimp x 3 are fine.
6. Food--seaweed chunk (1x2.5 EOD, frozen omnivore food 2x daily--just enough for all fish to get a few bites)

The B List

pH-7.8
Kh-10gtt's
Nitrates--about 40ppm

Thats all I can test for unfortunately for chemistry

Salinity--1.023
Temp--78-79 degrees.

It is interesting that I just did a 10 gal water change yesterday (55 gal tank), when my nitrates were at 40ppm, and it hasn't changed. :/ I did rearrange a few things while I was changing the water, but I didn't muck up the sand too much or anything. Just mainly moved a few rocks around and some corals.

The C List

1. Sand bed about an inch to maybe 2 inches in a couple places where the sand has drifted a bit. No sump, no refugium. Bak-Pak 2 protein skimmer. 4 power heads, I in each corner. 55 gal system. 100lbs of live rock?... not sure on that... you are welcome to guess by my picture.
2. I currently have a bag of carbon hanging in front of my protein skimmer output to treat for 1 dose of abx (Seachem Kanaplex, 1.8 grams total used) I put in a week and a half ago for a chalk bass with pop-eye that I lost.
3. None of the fish appear to have the white stuff on their fins as I have seen described in fin rot. Maybe they are all just having a go at each other? As I said before, the Tang and the goby appear to be just fine.
There are also two feather dusters in the tank. One that shed it's head about 1.5 months ago and hasn't come back, the other seems just fine.


Thanks so much!
Amanda





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Do you have any crabs in your system? Are the voids where the chunks missing ragged like there is tearing or disintegration of the structure or do they look like clean voids?

 

[IPisces]

IMO its not fin rot. The tang would be the first one to get it if it was. I think your PH needs to be a little higher. Otherwise the tank looks good. I too think you have a bully in the tank.
It is a small tank for the tang. It's not very big yet, but it may possobly be showing others his dominant side.
The only other one I would suspect would be the wrasse. He is picking on the clowns and one of them got back at him.
Its hard to say. Keep a close eye on them. See if you can see any aggression. And get a test kit for all pertinent parameters and let us know what you find.
We need ammonia and nitrites for sure.

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[N1Husker]

IMO its not fin rot. The tang would be the first one to get it if it was. I think your PH needs to be a little higher. Otherwise the tank looks good. I too think you have a bully in the tank.
It is a small tank for the tang. It's not very big yet, but it may possobly be showing others his dominant side.
The only other one I would suspect would be the wrasse. He is picking on the clowns and one of them got back at him.
Its hard to say. Keep a close eye on them. See if you can see any aggression. And get a test kit for all pertinent parameters and let us know what you find.
We need ammonia and nitrites for sure.

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Lorrie, she said that the wrasse also had a small chunk out of his tail, so that's why I was thinking a crab. It could be the tang. If he is in too small of a tank, could be stressed and getting aggressive.

 

[Mahoney]

Hmmmmmm. Good to know everyone I don't see any serious aggression from anyone. If any of the fish, it's the male clown that will snap at other fish if they are in his (and the female's) territory for too long.

I do have hermit crabs in the tank--not too many. I think they are killing each other off, or maybe my nitrates being elevated, they may have died off? I didn't think 40ppm was toooo terribly bad.

Anyone have any opinions as to why my nitrates would have stayed the same even with a slightly moderate water change?

The wrasse seems to be kept in check fairly well. Any reason why he isn't eating all my red round worms? I've tried cutting back on feedings (also to help with the nitrate levels) to see if that will stimulate him to do so. We had a wrasse before that did a superb job of eating them all. But, when we moved, we lost him.

Aren't nitrites eventually converted into nitrates---so wouldn't that be double testing? Or do I have it backwards. I'll see about picking up an ammonia kit tomorrow if I can get a chance. Otherwise it will be a little while (I work 6 days on--night/graveyard shift, and then have 8 days off where I'll be out of town for those 8 days this next time around).

What can I do to increase the pH?

Thanks so much!

 

[Mahoney]

Oops--and the ends of the tails/fins do not appear ragged, but a smooth/clean half-circle clip out of them.

 

[N1Husker]

H'mmmm? Yes, you have it right, Ammonia>Nitrites>Nitrates. Your nitrates are a little high, but not in the dangerous category, except that 40 ppm may start affecting your crabs. I don't know what could be causing the fin problem, maybe the crabs are taking fin samples at night. As to why your wrasse won't eat the worms, who knows, just personal preference.

 

[Mahoney]

H'mmmm? Yes, you have it right, Ammonia>Nitrites>Nitrates. Your nitrates are a little high, but not in the dangerous category, except that 40 ppm may start affecting your crabs. I don't know what could be causing the fin problem, maybe the crabs are taking fin samples at night. As to why your wrasse won't eat the worms, who knows, just personal preference.

Fin samples eh.... I'll have to get on em for that. Haha. So, nitrates being higher could make the crabs go kookoo... kinda like when people's sodium levels get too low? Well, I'm trying to be conscious of feeding a little less to help out with the nitrates. I feel like my Tang is such a pig and eats EVERYTHING I put in the tank all at once! I do put in a small chunk of seaweed every other day or so and all the fish except the goby munch on that, but still, when I feed the frozen omnivore food, i try to scatter it all over the top of the tank, but the tang is so quick, he swims everywhere and gobbles up most of it. I try and scare him away to make sure the other fish get fed. And the clowns will feed out of my hand if the tang doesn't force his way and eat it out of my hand first. Despite the chaos at feedings, everyone does get a few bites.

 

[N1Husker]

When you feed, all of your fish will go after it, that is normal, especially with frozen. The classifications of herbivore or carnivore mean that is how that particular fish absorbs everything that makes him live and be strong, not necessarily what they like to eat. The tangs, I have noticed, IMHO, that they do love their veggies and anything else that you feed them, but they are also good little poopers. Great algae eaters too.
The higher nitrates don't make them cuckoo, it makes it so they can't survive. This may be why you are noticing a decline their numbers. But they also might be battling for each others shells as they grow.

 

[Mahoney]

When you feed, all of your fish will go after it, that is normal, especially with frozen. The classifications of herbivore or carnivore mean that is how that particular fish absorbs everything that makes him live and be strong, not necessarily what they like to eat. The tangs, I have noticed, IMHO, that they do love their veggies and anything else that you feed them, but they are also good little poopers. Great algae eaters too.
The higher nitrates don't make them cuckoo, it makes it so they can't survive. This may be why you are noticing a decline their numbers. But they also might be battling for each others shells as they grow.

Yes, I have noticed the tang eating everything everywhere--picking at rocks, and I had a random patch of cato (sp?) growing in my tank and he at it all in like the first few days I had him in the tank! I had liked it cause of the bright green color! Oh well.... haha

Awhile back (6mo ago or so) I did put in some varying sizes of shells for the crabs to try and help them out.

Well thanks everyone. I guess i'll just keep an eye on the fin status and for outward aggression.

 

[TJL]

Hey Amanda, I'm inclined to believe that is just aggression between 6-line Wrasse and Clownfish pair both being territorial by nature. Without having a sump/fuge you could look into getting some Halemida sp Algae or even adding additional soft soft corals such as Xenia, Sarcophyton and Lobophytum or Sinularia all are pretty efficient Nitrate & Phosphate consumers. Eventually plumbing in a sump to add volume and house mechanical equipment like your heater and a larger skimmer would be a great direction when time/money allows. It really is a nice looking Reeftank you are creating so far.

Cheers, Todd

 

[pandora32]

I would guess agression also. Would raise your alk, slowly. If your tang is racing around eating everything, let it. Dont chase it around...lol...so your other fish can eat, they need, and will, get food. You chasing it away from the food will stress the tang, and other fish, and if the tang is already stressed due to its surrounding, its going to get even more agressive. I have a yellow tang and a sailfin tang, both almost exactly the same size, in my wifes tank. They arent cramped in a small tank by any means, but the yellow tang has claimed pretty much the whole tank as his. Id like to catch the sailfin and put it in my tank at home, lots of room, but i have a yellowtang and sailfin tang that are 3x bigger than the lil one she has. Im worried the lil guy would get eaten!!...lol.

 

[N1Husker]

I would guess agression also. Would raise your alk, slowly. If your tang is racing around eating everything, let it. Dont chase it around...lol...so your other fish can eat, they need, and will, get food. You chasing it away from the food will stress the tang, and other fish, and if the tang is already stressed due to its surrounding, its going to get even more agressive. I have a yellow tang and a sailfin tang, both almost exactly the same size, in my wifes tank. They arent cramped in a small tank by any means, but the yellow tang has claimed pretty much the whole tank as his. Id like to catch the sailfin and put it in my tank at home, lots of room, but i have a yellowtang and sailfin tang that are 3x bigger than the lil one she has. Im worried the lil guy would get eaten!!...lol.

If you want to catch the sailfin I have the perfect trap if you want to borrow it. It has a mirror in it, it really ticks off the tang to see himself in the mirror. I had a sailfin tang in my tank before and when I was trying to catch my clownfish, which took forever, I caught the sailfin about 50 times. I had trouble keeping him out of the trap. Let me know and I can run it over to you. I use to live by the drag strip on Old Clifton Road, so I am fairly familiar with Port Orchard.