Microcanthus strigosus!!

[csababubbles]

I finally located a Microcanthus strigosus! Diving off Hawaii I was lucky enough to spot one of these guys by pure chance and ever since I've been in love. Well, I finally located one tonight and I will be bringing it home either on Saturday or Monday. I'll post some pics when I put him in QT.

Do you have any captive care advice for this fish Lee? I know they get to max size ~6"-8", they are said to be pretty peaceful and they do take to captive foods (including a lot of algae/greens), but that's about the extent of my knowledge.

Would my 220 tank with panda puffer, Idol, regal & potter angel, copperband, and anthias be a good home for him?

Or would my 125 with ~5" dogface, pajamafish group (five 1/2"), and 2.5" marine betta be a better fit?

I would rather put it in the 125 because I do not want to upset/stress my Idol and Regal Angel with a new addition even though it is a peaceful addition. I remember you suggested in the past that I do not add another fish once the Idol is settled in. So if thats the case, the other choice would be my 150 gallon sump (for the 220 display) that has a porcupine puffer and saddleback butterfly. Would that be better then the 125 display? I don't have a preference, I just want the fish to fit in with the tankmates and size of the tank. Both have lots of caves and hiding spaces in addition to free space to swim.

 

[csababubbles]

OK I re-read my bioload inquiry a few week back regarding my 220 tank and even though you said it can handle another 7" of fish, I do have to account for room in the future so I will not be adding this fish to that system. Just to be sure, is the 125 bioload proper for the new addition?

System:
125 display, 40 sump,
8" diameter LifeReef skimmer,
200 lbs live rock,
~9000 gph internal circulation, 1200gph return pump,
mechanical filtration (filter socks changed every 3rd day)
45 gallon water change every 2 weeks,
24/7 carbon run in a reactor.

 

[leebca]

These unusual Butterflyfish are reclusive and don't like to be disturbed. Fortunately, they are hearty and do well in a peaceful aquarium environment. There are actually three species in this Genus and they look a lot like each other.

I think the 125 would be a marginally good home, but the fish there now are going to grow out of that space.

The big downside to those tank mates is that they are mostly carnivorous and will not encourage the Butterfly to eat macro algae. This Butterfly is best kept with Angels and Tangs -- omnivores and herbivores. Still, things may work out since you are putting the fish through quarantine and can train it on eating and acclimating to captive life.

Feed it the omnivore diet including pods with the usual supplements and it should do well. You'll just need to work out the tank mate concern.

 

[csababubbles]

I did not realize that the fish currently there would grow out the space! I mean, I suspected that the dogface puffer would eventually need a larger tank. What size tanks do these particular puffers eventually need? Until what size will the puffer be good for in the 125 tank?

Is he the only concern you have of this tank?

As an alternative do you think the new fish would do well in the 150 sump with the saddleback and porcupine? The saddleback eats everything including macroalgae so he fits into the description of a recommended tankmate. Would the porcupine be too aggressive? He does not bother the butterfly, but he does go after food very quickly so even though he will not be aggressive to the new addition he might make him freak out with his eating habits. But I can resolve that because I place the food right near the pump and it spread it across the entire sump quickly. I also like to distract the puffer with a nice clam to work on for a few minutes while I feed the saddleback. Does this sound like it could work out? Or should I just stick with the 125 tank.

 

[leebca]

I've seen Marine Bettas that are over 10" long in captivity. I was thinking of this and the Puffer.

If you're willing to make such an effort with the sump feedings, it should be okay. The Porcupine may intimidate the new fish in general at feedings. However, it depends on the personality of the Butterfly. The Saddleback should be okay with it, unless it takes issues with a new Butterfly coming into its environment.

You need some flexibility -- learn about the fish during quarantine -- just how timid it is and how assertive it is at feeding time.

 

[csababubbles]

standard 55 gallon ok for his QT? he is just under 5"

i know you said they tend to be reclusive does that mean these fish don't need lots of space like a tang but instead several hiding spots like caves and overhangs?

I read the saddleback sometimes are aggressive towards newcomers. My concern is when he was in the display he chased around the copperband butterfly so thats why I put him in the sump. But I notice that fish in general become more aggressive when they are crowded and in a small space like my Idol was in my 125. When I moved the Idol to my 220 all the aggression stopped. So you think the 4" saddleback might pick on the new 5" stripey? the 150 gallon sump is 25"H x 39"W x 58"L rubbermaid stock tank and is filled almost to the very top.

I know you may say I just have to try it but that option would be such a hardship because if it doesnt work that I have to put him BACK into the QT for another 2 months if then I want to put him in the 125 since I don't want to transfer any nasties. I think 4 months would be not very optimal in a small 55 gallon barebottom qt so thats why I want to get it right the first time.

 

[leebca]

A 55 is okay -- a bit larger than I would prefer. A 30-40 would be my preference, but no problem with the 55 show tank.

Yes on the hiding places -- caves, etc. They aren't long distance swimmers, but do 'get around.' They are between the Tangs and Angels in this respect.

Older fish, like your Saddleback, become assertive and aggressive with age. That is my concern. 50/50 depending upon the personalities of each of the two.

Your concern is understandable. To do things right -- you need another tank. I think you've reached the limits of what you have and contracted a touch of the 'one-more-fish' fever. The envelope has been stretched already.

 

[csababubbles]

yea the fever is definately in play, i had no intention of adding another fish until I stumbled upon this rare find...oh the addiction!

The best place for him would be the 220 but not putting in new fish is very important for the Idol and Regal and CBB right? Definately don't do this Lee? If you confirm not to do this then I will put him in the 125 tank. When the betta and puffer get larger I will have to give one of them away. I would rather keep stripey then either a betta or puffer.

 

[leebca]

So why not bite the bullet and take action now? Find another home for the Puffer now. Move the Betta into the sump -- better company for the Porcupine already there. Now, put both the Saddleback and the new Butterfly into the 125 at the same time. Them going in together should reduce or eliminate any territorial issues and, providing enough food and water quality is there, should be okay.

I would not make another addition to the Idol tank.

 

[csababubbles]

I don't like that plan at all because the sump is topdown view only so I don't think I will get to see a secretive marine betta at all. Its perfect for the porcupine & a fish like the bold saddleback though cause they always comes to the surface to interact with me, beg for food, etc. I think the marine betta would be content staying in a cave near the bottom and just come quickly to grab food. I would miss the whole hunting motions and territory defense actions they are known for (swimming backwards with their tail looking like an eel, etc.)

I would definately like to keep him in the 125 display, or what about the 220? Do you think the addition of a secretive betta would stress the Idol inhabitants?

Sorry for asking so many questions, but you are really good bouncing off ideas with and keeping me from making a stupid mistake because I overlooked something. How many fish have you kept? Seems you kept just about every species at one point or another with your intimate knowledge of them.

 

[leebca]

I wouldn't keep any fish in a sump. I like to look at the sides of my fish, front, back, top and bottom. Thought you obviously didn't care too much about that.

The Betta in with the Idol should be a good idea. I don't remember (too lazy to look) the sizes of the other fishes. As the Betta grows you don't want its tank mates to be meals.

I have kept thousands of fishes for: experimentation, research, store, and home (hobby). Some think the combo of them isn't a good answer to your question. As far as the hobby goes, I've keep about 400 species in my home aquariums over the decades. That would be a couple of thousand over the years being kept in my home aquariums. Many that I have kept are traded to others or ones I've trained for others to keep; given away when I move/relocate; etc. If I don't explain that part, it sounds like I've been killing thousands of fishes.

There are some species I feel strongly about not keeping. I may have kept one or more fish of a species nonetheless, to verify it couldn't be trained to eat processed foods or that its environment couldn't be maintained to keep it alive in captivity.

I've kept some Damselfishes, but for the most part, don't care for them, so have not kept the full species range of them. Come to think of it, I have only ever kept three fish from the Anemonefish group. One is 18 years old now. The other is a particularly dark Maroon I now keep. But other than a Maroon, never had much interest in that sub-group of Damselfishes.

No problem asking questions. That's how I share information.

 

[csababubbles]

So if the betta gets moved out of the 125, will that tank be good for the new stripey, dogface and cardinals?

which particular fish have you kept that you could not train to eat? the acro eating bf's and filefish?

 

[leebca]

My preference would be to not move out the Betta for that combo. It is the Puffer that would be too assertive for the others. All of this depends upon what you see in their 'personality.'

Best not to list failures. I'll have some conservation society all over me.

 

[csababubbles]

lol, but to your credit, its experts like you with the knowledge and patience that make the breakthroughs so that others may learn to keep those species, no?

 

[leebca]

No. Few (if any) are willing to do the things I've learned to keep certain species surviving. Few of that group will thrive.

 

[csababubbles]

I got the fish home the other day and its been settling in nicely. He definately likes to swim and moves so damn fast. I got to say he is the fastest eater I have ever seen. He absolutely devours anything I put in the tank and took out a clam I dropped in for him in 3 seconds flat. Even my puffers can't do that!

I have new concerns about his tank size requirements. His swimming seems akin to an Achilles tang. I think he may need an 8ft tank when he gets larger cause this guy can seriously move. Absolutely beautiful colors he has.

 

[csababubbles]

Lee I have an update and follow-up questions for you if you have some time...

I took your advice and moved the dogfaced puffer out of the 125 tank into my 450 gallon fowlr. The remaining residents are the Stripey, 4 pajama fish, a small filefish, and the marine betta.

The other tank in question is a 150 gallon oval rubbermaid sump thats filled to the top with a porcupine puffer and saddleback butterfly.

I think the 125 may be too small for the stripey.He is doing well but he seems a but cramped. Do you think the stripey would be happier in the 150 gallon with the porc and bf? There is much less live rock in there and tons more swimming space. The stripey is an extremely very aggressive eater. The saddelback can definately also hold his own with the porc. but I am unsure how the bf and stripey would react to each other since the saddelback is an established resident. The stripey is about 6" and very thick and saddeback is about 5" and much more thin.

Or do you think in the overal scheme of things it would be best to just switch the stripey and the saddleback (stripey in the sump with porc. and saddleback in the 125 with the betta, pajamas, and fielfish)?

 

[leebca]

Unless the 150 is longer than the 125, I don't see any advantage to making a move. It is length that is most important to a 'cramped' fish.

The Saddleback will most likely take to a change than any of the others. The switch of the Stripey with the Saddleback is not a bad idea, but I still see it as a more or less equivalent move.

 

[csababubbles]

The 150 sump is wider but not longer then the 125. The key difference is that the 150 sump only has a little bit of live rock structure in the middle while the 125 tank has 150lbs-200lbs in it.

Also, the stripey seems so aggressive towards the food that it hardly lets the betta and filefish get at the food. The saddleback bf seems to be more relaxed when it comes to feeding time so I thought it would be a better fit for the slow methodical betta, the tiny cardinals, and the somewhat timid filefish.

 

[leebca]

I can go along with that reasoning. Seems reasonable and to the overall benefit for the types of fishes/personalities involved.