Need controller advice.

[ssgatbliss]

Murphy's Law strikes again! I just started to get back into the hobby because I hadn't taken any long duration travel/TDY in almost two years and my company goes and loses the contract to the lowest bidder (oxy-moron in Govt. work). That means I'm going to be on the road for periods of longer than two weeks for the next year.

My tank (29G long) doesn't warrant the cost of outside weekly maint and no one is home during the day (other than two over protective dogs) to let the person in. I can make and store enough top off water for up to two weeks and I can arrange for my daughter to come home from school to do water changes/maint the wife won't do (says she will and means well but past experience says otherwise).

So, I need a controller that will take care of the day to day stuff. I need something that will control the lights in main tank (4 24" T5 on two separate ballasts, 1 Aqauabeam 600 (separate transformer), 2 Truelumen Pro 12" strips (separate transformer, should have gotten another Aquabeam 600), 4 moon lights (separate trans), and the 18W JBJ light on the sump (may take Truelumens and move to sump).

I also have a Vortech MP10 Es wireless (plan to get another soon), SWC BH 300 HOB skimmer, JBJ ATO, Ehiem 1260 return pump, 200 W heater, and a single small circ pump pushing water low across the back of the tank. The wife can handle feeding and cleaning the skimmer. I can set up a web camera to peak in from time to time but I want the controller to be web enabaled to send info/control items if need be.

I received a nice severance check so there is money to spend but I don't want to waste money either. Eventually I will be getting a larger tank so I don't want to re-purchase a better module down the road.

At this point I want something to control the many lights and be able to monitor PH, control or monitor calcium, and control or monitor the ATO/salinity, (is there an ALK monitor other than a test kit?). I say control or monitor because if I can see or get alerts I can have some ESV two part or equivalent and tell the wife to add whatever. She's just as busy as I am so she will do small things but not what I do on a daily basis.

The web function of the controller here is key, it must be reliable. Whether it controls or just monitors it needs to be dependable otherwise I might as well just set up a bunch of timers.

Need your suggestions. :help:

 

[Bosco83]

I would just call these guys and see what they can do for you.

Digital Aquatics

 

[NC2WA]

DA, +1, just get the .NET Module so you can control it via the web.
you will be able to the DA ReefKeeper on your big system when you get it.

 

[trido]

I like the Neptune products. I have been using an AC Jr on my tank for over four years, just set up a large tank with the Neputune Apex and hooked it to the internet, and have had friends with the AC 3 and AC pro as well. From what I hear, (never needing it myself) neptune has great customer service.

 

[mcoomer]

I have a DA ReefKeeper Elite with a Net module. Trust me when I say that I know what you mean about being away from home and worrying about your tank.

Check this out.

Mike

 

[NWDiver]

I'm running the Neptune Apex and I'm really happy with it.

 

[ssgatbliss]

All,

Thanks for your suggestions. I was looking at the DA, Neptune, and the new profilux (doesn't come until May though, too late). I'm going to Reef Stock up in Denver in about an hour, there is supposed to be a DA rep there. Although the APex appears to be more robust I think I like the ease of programming the RKE.

Thanks for the help guys!

 

[ssgatbliss]

After researching the controllers I came to two conclusions 1). I couldn't decide between the Apex or the RKE and 2). I had a hard time justifying the cost of either once you buy all the accessories that you need. You are looking at close to $1000 for a small processor/display unit that controls a power strip and returns the readings from some probes. There has got to be a better/cheaper solution out there. These things just seemed to be another aqaurium hobby rip off ( a lot of money and little function in return). Just my opinion.

What I did decide to do was purchase an Octopus media reactor (wanted the PNS but everyone was sold out) so that takes care of my daily carbon dosing and I will get one of the better multi pump dosing units and set the amounts at very conservative levels to maintain the tank while I'm gone. The controller can't measure and therefore adjust either ALK or CA so essentially I see it as an expensive light controller. Granted I have a small tank with T5's and LED lighting so I don't have some of the issues that come with MH. As long as there is a supply of kalk top off water and the wife feeds the fish the two new pieces of equipment should handle the day to day stuff. ATO handles the water levels, powerstrip with timers handle the lights, and the ecotech pumps already have a feed and night mode built in. (Couldn't believe that Neptune wants $100 for the module to controll the ecotechs).

So now I need to find a decent set-up for dosing.

 

[mcoomer]

I'm not sure that I'd go so far as to call them a hobby rip-off but yes they are relatively expensive. I think I'm into my ReefKeeper Elite for $700-800 with the extra power strips that I've bought. When I first bought it I kind of thought along the same lines as you, not a lot of functions that were really useful for my setup, but after exploring I've found a number of very handy functions. My controller now handles my dosing pumps, controls all my lighting, functions as a backup to my heater controller in case of failure, drives my Tunze powerheads as a wavemaker, provides timers for feeding and different maintenance operations, controls my sump lighting, monitors water parameters, turns off ATO in the event of a high water level, and allows me to look in on the tank from anywhere that I have phone service or Internet. It will do more than that but I've been too lazy to dig into the programming functions.

If your hesitant about the initial expense go ahead and budget for it and buy a basic setup and add to it as you determine your own needs for a controller. Trust me, once you get it set the way you want it you'll wonder how you ever go along without it.

Mike

 

[ssgatbliss]

Mike,

Your right, ripoff is kinda harsh. Money isn't the issue, let's call it bang for the buck. Your probably right that after I got it I would wonder why I didn't get one before. Did the same with my Traeger grill. When I first saw the grill I said I would never pay $1000 for a smoker. Two years ago I got one as a BD gift for myself and now I'm kinda ticked I didn't get the larger one. Not only is convience a factor, the food came out perfect everytime. Never burnt, perfect amount of smoke flavor, up to temp in about 15 minutes, and BBQ in the middle of January is just the best.

Damn, now you have me second guessing myself.

V/r,
Chuck

 

[NWDiver]

If my Apex failed, I would purchase another the same day
While you don't get a reading for alk or Ca, you can indeed make dosing adjustments with the Apex remotely. More to the point, if you have your dosing setup correctly you will not need to make adjustments while you are away. Once dialed in, it stays really stable and requires only a very slow increase over time.
The early warning I got on my phone when my heater went sideways saved my tank for sure! Being able to set whatever safety margins that you want, and have the controller contact you if something is out of whack is worth the price alone.

 

[ssgatbliss]

Software questions. It looks like you have to pay for the APEX software but not the RKE. What does the software track and can you enter your own data for things like strontium levels, etc?

 

[NWDiver]

The Apex has a built in web server, so there is no software to purchase. I think the software you were looking at was for the older models.
The web server has graphs for the probes you are running (you can grab the raw data as well) so no, there is no way that I am aware of to add your tests to that data. you could keep a spreadsheet that would use the output from the Apex and allow you to keep track of whatever else you wanted, but it is not an "out of the box" solution.

 

[dubbly]

Which controller has a better programing language. Can you have conditional statements. Such if X then do Y?

 

[NWDiver]

I can only speak to the Apex, and you can indeed do conditional statements like:
If temp>80 then lights off

 

[NC2WA]

if you want that type of programmability, then Apex controller is for you.

 

[jrgilles]

I have a Neptune Apex and love it. It can do all you want, and you can check the web while you are travelling and have total control over all the outlets, see graphs of temp, pH, etc. remotely.

 

[ssgatbliss]

So after a lot of researching if I was going to purchase a controller it would be the Apex. All things considered it has the most functionality. The reefkeepers don't have the scripting type controlability and don't plan on having it. I saw a reply on their site somewhere where they believe the mainstream reefer would rather just have simple point and click functionality and they didn't see an overwhelming need to have that kind of controllability. Gee I don't know. If I'm dropping close to a $1000 on a controller I want it to have as much versatility as possible (even if I'm not going to use it). The end result is I decided to pass on the controller. I couldn't justify the expense. I figure if I add a decent dosing system (which I would have had to buy anyway) and another timer for my lights my needs will be met. Sure I won't get cool read outs on my PC but I just kept going back and forth on the expense.

 

[NWDiver]

I really hear you on the cost, it was far less than a grand though.
For me, the value is in the ability to get messages warning me of a problem.
It saved my tank once already when a heater ran away while I was at work.
All said though, it was (for me) money well spent.

-Todd

 

[trido]

Ya, unless your running ozone, you dont need the ORP probe. The Apex I just set up cost $599 with free shipping. I has a Ph probe and temp probe. The wave maker module cost near another $200 if your running tunzes but the Tunze controller costs the same.
Sure you can spend $1000 on all the bells and whistles for any of the controllers on the market but do you really need that on your tank?
Also, from what I saw.
Line script like "if temp >82 then lights off" is already built into the APEX programming as well as the "max change" statement. Meaning if the lights do go off due to the temp the computer waits for as long as you tell it, to check to see if its safe to turn the lights back on. Something none of the older versions had without the user creating them.