Opening up corals & Nitrate Issues

[raschafer]

on August 30th I filled and stared my 125 gallon tank. I currently have the following fish:

Yellow Tang
Atlantic Blue Tang
2 Bengali Cardinal Fish
Cleaner Wrasse Yellow
Corus Wrasse
Foxface Rabbit fish
Koran Angelfish
Royal Dottyback
Mandarin Goby

I have been trying to get corals going in my tank now for about 6 weeks but I am having trouble getting them to open up and it is driving me nuts!!! I have a 55 gallon sump running a 15 – 20 gallon refugium, dual reactor running GFO & Carbon, 3 Hydra LED Lights, Diablo 150 protein skimmer, 2 mp40 pumps, 4 stage RODI water system, and 125 pounds of Pucanni Live Rock. All of my equipment was bought brand new. After doing a lot of troubleshooting, test kits, and begging people for advice I think I have concluded that my corals are not opening up due to my nitrates being too high. Over the past month I have been doing 1 to 2 30 gallon water changes a week to try to get them down but it doesn’t seem to be doing the job. They keep hanging around 15 – 25 depending on how long after a water change I have done. Yesterday I did a 35 gallon water change and started using filter socks to help the process. I have a feeling that my refugium is not setup well enough. It currently has red seaweed and 1 softball size chaeto algae. I was thinking of running to the store and grabbing a bunch of chaeto but I wanted to know if you can put too much in your refugium? I figured for now the more the better and I just wanted to make sure there was nothing wrong with this. I would appreciate an advice on my current issue.

Thanks.


​

 

[Ichthys]

what, how much, and how often are you feeding your tangs and other fish? My tangs are HUGE piggies and poop factories.
I am so so not an exert and i am sure others will chime in with good advice, but to get the ball rolling, I will say this. Something I have read over and over in this forum is that the biggest problem we have is not the equipment or processes, but the guy in the mirror. For a subject that is so important it gets way to little attention, i think we all tend to overfeed, and overfeeding and waste production can lead to poor water chemistry and in turn problems with corals. Just my 2 cents.

 

[raschafer]

I'm feeding my fish once a day along with putting in an algae strip every other day. Its a pretty small pinch of flakes, or 1 cube of bryne shrimp.

 

[raschafer]

Tangs are still relatively small.

 

[N1Husker]

Your refugium is relatively small for a 125 gallon tank. It should be around 40 or bigger. I also had a problem with my corals not opening, especially my zoa's and I started useing, Brightwells Amino Omega and they opened right up. Tangs are little poopers and that can cause your nitrates to elevate. I know when I got rid of my tang, my nitrates were much more controllable. If you can keep them at 20 or under, you are doing okay. Some of your corals require nitrated to survive, so you don't really want them at zero according to wetwebmedia.com. I am not an expert but this is what I experienced.

 

[raschafer]

Thanks for the advice N1Husker but a 40 gallon refugium on a 125 is overkill. I've seen plenty of tanks at 125 gallons and bigger thriving on sumps smaller than 40 gallons. I agree 40 gallons would be nice, but how in the hell would you ever be able to fit a sump under a 125 with a 40 gallon refugium under it.

 

[dawguy]

were you rocks actually live or dry? were they cured? whats your phosphate levels at?

 

[raschafer]

Rocks were cured for a month. Phosphate is 0

 

[dawguy]

The amount of food sure doesn't sound like to be the problem, and that amount of food shouldn't equate to that much waste. So something else seems to be the cause. What is your ammonia and nitrite levels? Do you have an algae problem now? or had a bloom previously? With that much nitrate, and assuming the proper lighting for your chaeto, that thing should be growing like crazy. Some perhaps dump question, but have to ask the "is it plugged in" type questions sometimes.
What kind of salt are you using? Have you tested your freshly mixed water for nitrate as well to verify? are you rinsing the brine cube before feeding?

 

[N1Husker]

Thanks for the advice N1Husker but a 40 gallon refugium on a 125 is overkill. I've seen plenty of tanks at 125 gallons and bigger thriving on sumps smaller than 40 gallons. I agree 40 gallons would be nice, but how in the hell would you ever be able to fit a sump under a 125 with a 40 gallon refugium under it.

I have a 29 gallon sump on my 90 gallon and due to its height, it wouldn't fit under the tank either. I put it beside the tank but on the floor. I just made sure that the pipe went from the overflow to the sump intake declined all the way to the sump. I went to a website that had a calculator that would tell you minimum sump size according to tank size. I don't feel your sump is big enough, just my opinion.

The website for the sump requirement is: http://www.diyfishkeepers.com/SumpSizeCalculator.htm

 

[kevinpo]

Hello,
Nitrate control is a fairly simple process. Elevated nitrates are a result of adding more food or nitrates than are being exported. In mature tanks this can only come from food or the water change/top-off water (in a new tank nitrates can come from the curing process of the live rock). To bring the nitrate test reading to zero follow these easy steps:
1) Make sure your top-off water has zero nitrates by using distilled or DI water.
2) Have a marine algae with high intensity light over it ( I prefer a reverse photo period of 12-16 hours).*
3) Do not feed more than the fish can consume in a minute or less (I feed my tank twice a week).
4) Once a month 20% water change (10% every two weeks would be better but I don't like doing water changes so I do them once a month)

When I speak of high intensity lighting these will work fine with a good reflector: T5 HO, T12 VHO, T8 6500K from the hardware store, spiral power compact 6500K (something equivalent to a 150W bulb) . They should be placed no more than six inches from the algae.

One other note. The Koran angel is a coral eating machine and will have to go. A few of the Pomacanthus genus can be reef safeish but P. senicirculatus is not one of them. It will eat most corals.

Also you don't mention what corals you have in the tank. Many corals will do just fine in nitrate levels you have listed.

Cheers,
Kevin
PS: Your refugium size will work just fine. If your chaetomorpha is not growing about an inch a day and you have nitrates above 10ppm then light intensity is the limiting factor for its growth. Marine algae are the fastest growing things on the planet up to 24" in 24 hours.

 

[raschafer]

Right now I am feeding once a day & put in an algae strip in every other day for my tangs. I am feeding a pinch of flakes that are all eaten in less than a minute, or one cube of brine shrimp.

All of my top off water is RODI water which is also what I am using for water changes. I have never tested it but I will go ahead and do that to make sure it is clear of nitrates

http://www.petco.com/product/122156...ce-_-2171225&gclid=CPT38PzX87sCFeYWMgodwnkAJw

This is the light that I have over Refurgium which i run during my main tanks off time around 12 to 16 hours a day.

I have been doing a 20% water change every week for about 5 - 6 weeks to try and knock them down.

My Koran Angle has been in my tank for about 3 months. I have been keeping a close eye on him and he is yet to eat or nip at any of my corals. When / if he does I will be sure to get rid of him.

I currently have:

Star Polyp frag that is doing really well
Candy cane frag that is doing ok
Frog Spawn that is doing pretty good.
Branching Frog Spawn that is doing ok.
Yellow Hammer Coral that is doing ok.
Hammer coral that is completely closed and yet to open
Alveopora Coral that is completely closed but opens up every now and then.

I think the intensity of my Hydras might have something to do with the corals not opening up as well.

 

[kevinpo]

Hello,
A picture of the corals would be helpful. I think an additional light on the refugium would help too. For around $25 you could mount a clip-on light/reflector with a spiral compact florescent bulb (6500K) in it that would work very well. Sorry I haven't used or tested enough LED lighting to know how well they work. Over the last 40 years I have used almost all other types of lighting. I own an apogee quantum meter and know the corals you have listed do well in low to moderate lighting conditions (150-300 PAR).

Regards,
Kevin

 

[N1Husker]

I use a clamp on light from Home Depot and use a full spectrum bulb from the garden dept at HD. I have been using this for over three years an my chaeto grows like crazy.