Overflow/sump question

[N1Husker]

Okay, I have my sump in and it is purring like a cat. Check the loss of power, and it doesn't overflow. Now my question is, what if I lose suction from the overflow tube on the overflow box? Is there anyway to stop the flood of water if water is still being pumped in from the sump, but no water is going out of the tank to the sump? Is there any device that I am not aware of to prevent this from happening? Next time I will drill holes in the new tank or buy one that is predrilled but that is way down the road. My son helped me build, install the sump and get it running, and he told his mom that dad needs a bigger tank. She could have killed him when my ears perked right up! Not going to happen, for a long time. Thanks everyone for you tremendous help, your the best. Also can I drill a small hole in the apex of the tube and put an air hose in, then hook up like a Tom's Aqualiftr to keep the air out of the tube?

 

[Krish]

What type of overflow are you using? Let us know. The eshopps style overflow (the ones that use that j shaped tube) never lose their siphon once primed in addition to a lot of others with the exception of a cpr style overflow. With those, they require a powerhead or aqualiter to help keep it primed so all it takes is a pump failure to lose your siphon. Let is know though which overflow you have. If not sure, post a picture.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[ac7av]

Your concerns about overflowing the tank are valid. When I was running and overflow box I flooded my tank at least a couple three times. My final solution was To drill the side of the tank Since the bottom of most tanks are tempered. I have the local glass shop cut me the panels to build a overflow box inside the tank, cost less than $20 for the Glass. I Silicon the box together waited for that to dry and then silicon the box to the side of the tank at the appropriate height. I never had a problem with the overflow again And it probably cost less to do that Then The overflow box I put on the tank to start with. If I had to do it again I probably would drill two holes in the side of the tank just add in the security of if one got plugged up by something the other one would continue flowing.

 

[T1tan360]

there is no real way to prevent you pump from pumping water into your tank after the failure in siphon of your overflow box. it will pump all the water in the return chamber in to your display tank. i agree with ac7av you are better off drilling the tank. i can drill any tank that is not tempered its simple even my first drilled tank was a 100g.
glass-holes.com kits are pretty awesome and you get the drill bit. i let the weight of the drill do the work. i also drill outside with a garden hose. but if this is not an option you can have a friend with you and you can drill the tank with stuff in it. just drain the water down to the bottom level of where you are going to place your overflow box. here is where you friend comes into play they are going to hold a spray bottle and continuously spray water on the drill bit. you can youtube this as well to get a visual.

 

[N1Husker]

Thank's. I wish I could drill it but unfortunately this is not an option. I live in a apartment and the tank is a 36 gallon corner tank, with two 24" backsides at a 90 degree angle to each other. It is sitting in a corner of my living room which places both sides up against the wall. The overflow box is an Aqueon 110, and is supposed to be rated at 962 gph, which I think is a bit much. It seems to have trouble keeping up with 480 gph at 4' head height, that the Mag 7 is putting out. I even put an extra u tube on the overflow to try and bring in more water to it. I may need to get a smaller pump. Next tank will definately be drilled. I am kicking myself now because I didn't get the 50 gallon tank that I wanted in the first place.

 

[T1tan360]

Put a valve on the output side of the mag 7 to slow it down to optimum flow rate so you don't need to buy another pump. I ran a 9.5 like that for a few years no problems

 

[N1Husker]

That's a good idea, you're talking about a ball valve, right? I will go get one tomorrow at Lowe's. Oh how I hate going out on black Friday, but hey it's for my fish and corals. Thank you T1tan360.

 

[ac7av]

Maybe I missed the obvious but you say the tank is a corner tank and the sides are up agents the walls and they meet at a 90 in the back. How do you have the over flow box hanging on your tank? On the front of the tank is the only way I can see this happening if the glass is up agents the wall.

In any case I have access to low clearance plumbing that would take up less space then your overflow box. In fact you would only need ½ inch of clearance on the side of your tank for a built in overflow capable of over 1000 gph depending on your other plumbing. If you’re interested I can send you the part number and a place to purchase this drain pipe.

I really would like to here how your existing overflow is hooked on to your tank. It could help to figure out some other way if possible to accomplish the same task but be built into the tank and take up less space.

 

[ac7av]

Is there some reason you can not have the tank at least ½ away from one wall?
You could always put up a trim piece to fill the gap if you really just don’t want to see the gap.

 

[N1Husker]

I have plenty of room between tank and wall for plumbing, the problem is that I don't have any room to use a hole saw and I fear drilling it from the inside worried that I don't want to get ground glass or slivers of glass in the water. Right now everything seems to be working. I went in yesterday and added a 1/2" tube to the 3/4" tube coming from overflow box to the tank. I cut the 3/4" about 4" from the bottom of the overflow box and put a 3/4" to 1/2" reducer on and that seemed to balance everything out. All levels in the sump are staying the same, the overflow suction tube sucked out the air bubble so it is solid water, no air. I will keep an eye on it but it seems much better. The pump isn't pumping it out faster than it comes in anymore, which was also the problem before because I had too much air coming in with the water going down to the sump and there is no longer that gurgling. It is quiet and balanced. Nirvana. Next tank (if there is one) will be drilled.

 

[ac7av]

See I knew there was a good reason. I just didn’t see it from here. Unless you’re an expert you don’t want to drill the glass from inside. A small chip or crack on the outside edge is not a good thing.

 

[N1Husker]

Yeah, I am the kind of person that if anything could possibly go wrong, with me, it's a definite. Hey, I really appreciate all of your info and help. By the way, beautiful tank, I checked out your link.

 

[N1Husker]

I changed my plumbing around yesterday and installed a ball valve in the line. I also put in a reducer in my inflow line, about 4 inches below the overflow box drain, from 3/4" to a 1/2" and put in a 1/2" tube the rest of the way to the sump. That seemed to do the trick, because now my overflow box fills to the proper level without letting air into the siphon tube or the tube to the sump, and all of my levels in the sump have stabilized. My pump no longer draws faster than inflow and no more gurgling sound. I will keep an eye on it, but I think I have solved the problem.

 

[jrgilles]

The way I deal with this is I have a backup drain. I have 2 overflow boxes. One is in constant use, one is never used, unless the first clogs then the second kicks in. Every month or two I check it and use an aqualifter to make sure there is no air in the second drain.

The other week a piece of nori got stuck in my main drain and I was, for the first time, saved by the 'backup' drain. Well worth it imo.

You can leave the second drain simple. Actually, you WANT it to be noisy, as the noise alerts you that it has kicked on so you can fix the problem.

I have a backup drain on all my tanks as flood insurance.

rob

 

[estanoche]

The way I deal with this is I have a backup drain. I have 2 overflow boxes. One is in constant use, one is never used, unless the first clogs then the second kicks in. Every month or two I check it and use an aqualifter to make sure there is no air in the second drain.

The other week a piece of nori got stuck in my main drain and I was, for the first time, saved by the 'backup' drain. Well worth it imo.

You can leave the second drain simple. Actually, you WANT it to be noisy, as the noise alerts you that it has kicked on so you can fix the problem.

I have a backup drain on all my tanks as flood insurance.

rob

Backup drains are a godsend! I have two on my tank In the end two drains running at 50% can handle 100% of your pumps output if they have to on that odd chance your favorite snail decides to go overflow surfing! Which is inevitable...

Show us some pics of your setup - maybe we can think of a way you can just add on to your existing overflow box instead of adding a second one

 

[N1Husker]

I will try to get some pic's tomorrow.

 

[leena2674]

Somebody... somewhere.... makes a device that works in the same manner as an auto top-off that will shut off the pump when the water level gets too low in the sump. So, before your tank overflows, theoretically, your pump should stop if your overflow loses suction or becomes clogged.

I just can't remember where I saw it at the moment

 

[jrgilles]

You can reverse float switches if you wanted to go that route to shut off the return pump.

Check out the aqua hub
Aquahub Homepage

In the directions for the deluxe kit, it shows you how to reverse a float switch (so while it is floating, the pump is on, but if it drops, it will shut off the pump.) Very easy to do, you just unscrew the float and put it on backwards. You would want to follow their advice and put the wires leading into it in a tube and seal it to the top of the switch so you don't get salt corrosion.

I would lean towards a second drain as it is a bit simplier I think. What if your ATO GFO trips, sump goes down, then return pump shuts off, water fills the sump back on, pump turns on, sump goes down, pump shuts off.... could go on forever. BUT, it is easy to do and the kit I linked above will do it.

rob