Bioballs or not

Reef Aquarium & Tank Building Forum

Help Support Reef Aquarium & Tank Building Forum:

darklcd

darklcd

nursing eel
Joined
Nov 30, 2004
Messages
547
Location
Thunder Bay
good evening all

I am wondering. I am studying sump systems and trying to design one for myself and I have seen some with and some with out bio balls and I am wondering if there is one set up that is better then the other. Before I got my fluval I had a hang on system that had bioballs and I have seen some of the same system tht they were taken out and I am wondering which is the better of the two or are they both good and bad at the same time.

I am also wondering if a 55 gal tank converted into one would be a good enough size for a 240 or 300 gal tank.

I found a system on Ebay and I was wondering if its a good system heres the link

http://cgi.ebay.com/400-Gallon-Aqua...1045926QQihZ015QQcategoryZ46310QQcmdZViewItem

any one have any info on them. I have looked on melsreef and started to read a little but I find that I pick up more from other people telling me about these things then any other way.

any info would really help

thanks
 
In a nut shell, the end product of bio-balls in a wet/dry environment is nitrates. The reason why, is because there are no anaerobic zones for the necessary bacteria to grow to perform denitrification (ie nitrates converted to nitrogen gas) so you end up with an accumilation of them (nitrates). Bio-balls just basically provide you with surface area for nitrifying bacteria to grow to convert ammonia into nitrite then into nitrate, but it stops there. Live rock, on the otherhand, is a much better alternative as nitrification and denitrification takes place on and within the rock it as has the surface area for the necessary bacteria to grow for nitrification to take place and also deep within the rock, there are anaerobic zones for denitrification to take place. HTH:)
 
For a reef tank bio balls only give you nitrate readings off the charts, which is very bad. You really don't need biological filtration if you have enough live rock and do water changes regularly. That sump setup looks fine, the refugium light is a little white to grow chaeto with IMO, yellow lights grow macro algae better but other than that it looks fine.
Hope this helps,

Tim
 
First off, I am a bit bias here, glass sumps bite the big one! especially ones butted together with 1/2" bulkheads !!!!!!! if you only want 300gph flow or less go for it. Also, other than the skimmer, that is the cheapest equipment available (the skimmer is cheap too, but they work well). Pondmaster pumps work good in fountains and ponds but not in a marine environment. The PCX40 pump is a good pump though and that wasn't a bad price. But with the shipping and handling you can find one for less.

As far as the bio-balls go, they are used as a bubble diffuser in the Berlin style fuge/ sumps but can have the same problem as normal wet/dry filters. In a reef tank, eventually the bio-balls turn into a nitrate factory. If you go with a filter like that, yank out the bio-balls and put live rock and rubble in their place.
 
I didn't notice the sump was two tanks connected, I would agree with Brian in that case. I have a glass sump so I can't knock them too much.

Tim
 
Lots of people use glass sumps and they work fine. I just think acrylic is better. I completely understand why some people don't want acrylic tanks because of the potential for scratches, but I think everyone should buy my sumps! --- ok, so not everyone, I guess I can't build that fast. :p

Seriously, I'm not pimp'in my sumps here, I think acrylic is the only way to go for sumps whether it's one of mine or not.
-they are easy to drill, modify and change.
-acrylic has great thermal properties including holding heat and in the same realm, holding off heat (staying cool)
-are easily made in any shape, color and configuration..........ect.....

If your not local, Melv's reef sumps seem pretty cool, Presision Marine's are nice, Pacific Coast and Sunlight supply have some from a California company that they ship, so check around for an acrylic sump.
 
well that was a lot to take in a little bit of time lol

I am glad to hear that I was thinking the right thing in going with no bio balls. Switching to live rock would be a good idea I know but in the hang on sump that I have I can't get all the live rock wet enough to keep it living I don't think. I will make a pic for everyone to see and see of you think that on my 55 it would be a good idea and just use my fluval as a very big pump lol.

as for my other 55 gal that I want to convert I saw a pic in the members pic section of a sump that was very close to the size of my 55 and I am still wondering if that would work ok for a 240 or 300. the reason I say or is that I am not sure if I want to go with 24 or 30 or 36" height and go from there.

I am also wondering if a grow light is a good idea and if the copa podcs I think they are called with maricle mud is a good idea. I have read a little about them and there is a company on the west cost that I can get stuff from for a good price. I live in ontario canada and I can get stuff from www.jlaquatics.com and they seem to have good stuff.

I am just not up to par with you guys on sump systems and I want to set one up on my new tank. they seem to be a good way to go and I want to get all the info I can on them before I build my own.
 
Switching to live rock would be a good idea I know but in the hang on sump that I have I can't get all the live rock wet enough to keep it living I don't think.
Click to expand...


Do you mean you were thinking on putting live rock in your hang on filter? If so, you don't need to put any in there. The live rock in your tank is all you need:)
 
I see. I thought that having somemore in my filter might help things out a little but if I don't need it then I will not worry about it.

I just want to make sure that the 55 gal will be enough for a 240. That my main concern I just have to make sure that I can drill the sides but I don't know if I can or not. And if I can't can I run the pipe up and over the sides or sould I let everything up so that everything is in the sump.

Thats something else I wanted to ask. is there any real difference between having an in-sump skimmer and return pump vs. having them external. is there one that is better or are they both the same?
 
I see. I thought that having somemore in my filter might help things out a little but if I don't need it then I will not worry about it.
Click to expand...

Not necessarily...Sometimes having live rock in your sump or hang on filter etc can work against you if you allow the rock to shed and not remove the detritus which can degrage water quality. Also, if the live rock is in a wet/dry environment where water trickles over the rock and it is exposed to air as well, then you are back to square one as anything in a wet/dry environment works like bioballs:)

I just want to make sure that the 55 gal will be enough for a 240. That my main concern I just have to make sure that I can drill the sides but I don't know if I can or not. And if I can't can I run the pipe up and over the sides or sould I let everything up so that everything is in the sump.
Click to expand...

IMO, a 55gal should be fine for the sump depending on what all you plan to keep in it and if it is an all-glass tank, then you can drill the sides as only the bottoms are usually tempered:)



Thats something else I wanted to ask. is there any real difference between having an in-sump skimmer and return pump vs. having them external. is there one that is better or are they both the same?
Click to expand...


IMO, there's no difference at all...Some, like the AquaC EV series can be used either way...Internally or externally and no one way is better than the other. I guess the reason they make skimmers both ways I guess is to suit the consumers needs a bit better and give them more options as some people can only use a skimmer internally do to limited space under their stand whereas some can only use their skimmers externally due to lack of space in their sump. Main difference IMO is brand of skimmer:)
 
Last edited:
well thats good to know. I just want to make sure that I get everything right the first time and not waste all kinds of money and have things not work right.

Since you are here I have a question about in tank over flows. is there any size/placement in the tank that is better then any other. I am not sure how I am going to set my tank up but I think that I am going to use it between the kitchen and the living room or I might just set it up in the living room agains my sofa.

I was in a shop the other day and I saw one that was on a fresh water set up that was on the very end of the tank. I guess that the plan was to have it against a wall and it just didn't work out.

I just want to know if there is a better way then any other one
 
Since you are here I have a question about in tank over flows. is there any size/placement in the tank that is better then any other. I am not sure how I am going to set my tank up but I think that I am going to use it between the kitchen and the living room or I might just set it up in the living room agains my sofa
Click to expand...


With an overflow, size makes the most difference. Depending on how big the teeth are setup (tooth size, spacing in between etc) and how big the actual overflow is, will determine how much flow it can handle, then it will just be up the the plumbing size you use from there. However, where placement is concerned, it's mostly just a personal preference but you typically don't want to put it in an odd place to hinder flow and cause deadspots. I remember reading a few times where people were upset with the All-glass mega flow tanks with the built in overflows because the overflow was in a spot that created a deadspot hard to get flow in between the overflow and the glass, but some may not find that a problem. :)
 
would corner overflows me a good idea? if I put it behind the sofa I might go that route. That way I can avoid dead spots and it would look a little more uniform what do ya think
 
I like the thoughts of that. I thought that to coast to coast were all the way down to the bottom of the tank but that would work really well I think. I am just wondering how hard it would be to get water flow under them but I guess with a closed loop system ( if I ever figure them out lol ) would work ok with something like that.

you know anything about loop systems and how to set them up?
 
you know anything about loop systems and how to set them up?
Click to expand...


Yeah..Definately know a little bit:D Here's a closed loop I had on my old 38 gal cube. I ran (2) pumps that gave me around 3,000 gph from the closed loop alone. Each pump ran two outputs (one up and one down) Also, take a look at the teeth for the overflow. Basically coast to coast, but didn't take up any space in the tank because I put the overflow on the back which you can see in picture 3:)








 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

H
WiFi Fish Feeder
Replies
1
Views
503
JohnGreenCloG
JohnGreenCloG
alki
Reef Setup looking for new home
Replies
1
Views
587
Katchupoy
Katchupoy
J
Krish sighting?
Replies
3
Views
2K
burning2nd
burning2nd
darklcd
135 gal build
Replies
5
Views
3K
spieszak
spieszak
StacyS
Complete Reef Tank $1850
Replies
1
Views
525
StacyS
StacyS

Latest posts

Back
Top