Calcium too high?

[Detri]

I second all that is said, but, I do recommend you try another test kit. You may have gotten a faulty one. I have never seen levels that high on a newer tank. cheapest way would be take a sample to your LFS and get them to test it. If it is that high your kit is good. If not then you may want to buy a new kit.

Just my 2 cents.


Oh and Welcome to RF glad to have you here/

 

[DonW]

It is a 3-part drop testing with a test tube, so I feel it should be fairly accurate. When I use it, the solution is supposed to turn purple, so I add drops until it does.
Monty

Salifert start kind of pink and end at clear blue. Are you adding more than one full syringe of part 3 to get a 600 + reading?? If not then something is wrong with the test or test procedure.

Don

 

[plack]

You can make a new small batch of I.O. but don't add anything to it. Then test for ca with your test kit and see what it reads straight out of the can. This will prove or disprove the other reading. Let us know soon because if it is correct you need to take action very soon.

Paul

 

[sytnom]

I tested over the weekend. Here are the results:

Nitrates: 20 ppm
Nitrites: 0.5 ppm
Alk: 240 ppm
pH: 8.0
Phosphate: 0.5 ppm (hagen test)
Calcium: 600 ppm (hagen test)
SG: 1.0255
Temp: 78
Ca Harness: 1500 ppm (hagen test)

I can't test for Magnesium, I don't have a test kit for it.

Anywho hope that helps.
Monty

 

[Boomer]

Ed asked are you using tap water. So are you ?

600 ppm Calcium = 1500 ppm Calcium Hardness. They are the same. It is like comparing 1 ft to 1 meter . 1500 ppm CaCO3 x 40 % (conversion #) = 600 ppm Ca++

 

[sytnom]

Yes, I am using tap water (well water). My previous tank was the same, well water. I ran great for 2 years before I had to get rid of it. (long story) I am just getting this new one up and going. As I recall, my other tank had high calcium all the time also.
Monty

 

[steve-s]

I'm guessing your house does not have a water softener either?

Cheers
Steve

 

[sytnom]

Actually, It does have a softner.

 

[steve-s]

You might want to have that checked then. The softener should be reducing your Ca/Mg content dramatically. If your not adding anything to the tank and it's not the salt mix, your source water is the only thing left.

Test your tap water for alk, Ca and hardness.

Cheers
Steve

 

[sytnom]

Will do. (hopefully tonight)

 

[sytnom]

Tested both the aquarium and the tap water, here are the results:

Aquarium:
Nitrates: 0
Nitrites: 0
Alkalinity: ~120
pH: ~7.9
Calcium: ~600

Tap Water
Nitrates: 0
Nitrites: 0
Hardness: 0
Alkalinity: ~180
pH: ~7.2
Calcium: 0

Can anybody give me some thoughts on why Calcium would be around 600?
As a reminder, I have some crushed oyster shells in my sump and I am using aragocrete rocks. This is the only place I can guess that the calcium is coming from.

Thanks, Monty

 

[steve-s]

Your using IO salt and only adding Seachems Reef Builder for alkalinity, no other additive?

If so, the main thing that would make sense here is heavy buffer additions are precipitating with the Magnesium somehow allowing for the higher Ca reading. Your previous alk reading from the weekend was 240 ppm (4.8 mEq/l) which is rather high. This suggests you are dosing in large weekly corrective (?) dosages rather than daily maintenance. This could be resulting in a severe "yo-yo" situation. Within 5 days, the alk has dropped from 240 ppm to 120 ppm, that's a pretty hefty draw if you don't have a good amount of scleractinians/clams/waste producers.

You didn't happen to test the saltmix chemistry recently did you?

Your aragocrete theory doesn't hold up much, it tends to spike pH/alk if not cured properly not boost Ca. What materials where used to make it? Oyster shell dissolution won't add much either unless your pH is falling lower at night. I am assuming the pH reading of 7.9 was taken the same AM? If not, that is dangerously low.

Personally, I would mix up some new salt, test that, tweek as needed (usually low Ca) and rely soley on water changes for the next few weeks as apposed to using additives. This will also give you time to guage your rate of depletion and determine if there are any additions issues that may be masked by the use of the Reef Builder. I'm suspecting you also need to address CO2 build up.

Cheers
Steve

 

[Boomer]

Sytnom

What steve is getting at here to make things more clear.

Your aragocrete theory doesn't hold up much, it tends to spike pH/alk if not cured properly not boost Ca

It would have to raise the Ca++. It, if it was doing this, would be do to dissolution of aragonite (aragocrete), CaCO3. If the pH and Alk spiked there would be a large yield of CO3--, which must be followed with a rise in Ca++. For 1 meq / l increase of Alk there would be 20 ppm increase in Ca++. That means a real spike like say 2 meq / l or 100 ppm will only boost the Ca++ 40 ppm. No where near where you are. With all the buffer you have been adding and real 600 ppm there should be a snowstorm or a loss of C a++, not a rise.

Your Alk and pH pretty show this is not happening.

I think you have a testing error. As has already been suggested test a sample of IO in pure water, like distilled or take a sample to the LFS and recheck it with different kits.

steve

That buffer should not going to do anything to his readings. I know what you are thinin', I think. During the Ca++ test the Mg++ is being read as Ca++ ==> High Ca++ reading. In theory, I might buy that if he was using a General Harness test, which tests for both Ca++ and Mg++ but is expressed as CaCO3. But seawater, no just FW.

 

[sytnom]

I haven't used "Large amounts" of reef builder. I have dosed it twice, maybe three times since setup over a month ago. I understand (mostly) what you are saying about teh precipitation of calcium, etc. My entire Bio-load right now is this: One molly, one strawberry pseudochromis, one yellow clown goby, about 50 snails, 7 tiny hblue leg hermits. I also have a handful of blade caulerpa. That's it. Not a high waste producing bunch.

If I understand correctly, it would be better to add the reef builder daily, in small doses. Correct? Also, how do I stablize the pH? That reading was done in the evening - about 7:00-ish.

The aragocrete is made from portland type I & II cement, sand from the local sand dunes, crushed oyster shells, and a few misc. sea shells I had.

I don't have any idea as far as CO2 goes. THere is plent of airation in the tank, so I'd be suprised if there wasn't a lot of O2, not CO2.

Are the Hagen tests not good? As far as a testing error, unless the instruction are not correct, it's either a correct reading or the test kit is faulty. Does anybody else use a Hagen Calcium test kit? Can you share your method to see if I am doing it incorrectly?

Thank you everybody,
Monty

 

[shallowreef]

a lot of people prefer salifert for their test kits. They run a little bit more on the price side but are very accurate.

 

[Boomer]

As steve and I have mentioned I can not see it being your aragocrete, if so you wouldn't be getting that low pH and he Alk would/should be higher. In a normal batch of IO the Ca++ is only around 380 and you are at 600. That is a rise of 220 ppm Ca++and I can not see that.

As far as CO2 and O2 the are not related. The suppressed pH can only come from 4 sources; overstocked tank, over feeding, dying life forms or high room air CO2.

Here is something on high room air CO2
http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/apr2002/short.htm

and here is something on Low pH causes and cures.
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2004-09/rhf/index.htm


I'm not familiar with the Hagen kit but something is wrong with that reading or there is a piece of info we are not getting. The only thing would be if you were adding something like Kent Turbo Calcium but you say you have added nothing.

If I assume your readings are correct then one of the 4 must be happening

1. Test kit error or you are not using it right.

2. You have a bad batch of IO with high Ca++. I have never in 20 years seen this. 99.9% sure this is not it.

3. You are confused on the salt you are using, it is not IO but Oceanic, which has very high Ca++. I think you know what it says on the bag

4. The aragocrete did go into solution. It did raise your Ca++, pH and Alk but you never checked these for 2-3 weeks. During this time you had high room air CO2 and you or a child grossly over feed the tank or there was a large die off of life, like algae or combo of the two. I'm sue you will say no to all this.

Just so you know, this is not the first time you situation has come up. It has come up many times.

 

[sytnom]

Actually, there was a massive die off of the blade caulerpa at first. It has now taken back off. There are still bits of the dieing plants in the tank. I was going to let them just finish being eaten and or decompose. It sounds like I should remove them asap. Given this info, does that change the above replies? Thank so much for your help!
Monty