Do I really need an overflow?

[xxkenny90xx]

Do I really need to buy an overflow? It seems to me if I put my sump pump just under the surface of the water and left the sump half empty, then drilled a couple holes in my siphon intake line just under the surface of my tanks water and left the tanks water level just a little bit low then then the pump couldn't overflow my tank and the siphon would stop when the holes were exposed and wouldn't overflow my sump. How does that sound? I don't really wanna pay for an overflow. Any input would be great, thanks.

 

[IPisces]

Not exactly sure what you are meaning by an overflow.
most refer to the overflow from the tank to the sump. I am guessing you are talking about an overflow from your sump to another container of sorts?
But yes you are correct in your assumption of how your return line with the holes would work, but I would drill the holes just above the tank water line, not below. And check them regularly and keep them clear.

 

[mfinn]

A overflow is a box ( built in or hang-on ) or a pipe that allows water to flow from the tank to the sump.
You need to place the sump pump at the bottom of the sump.
If your tank isn't drilled, then you do need a overflow box.

Pictures alway help when words don't.

 

[IPisces]

Definitely, pictures of what you have set up would help.

 

[xxkenny90xx]

Sorry I can't post pictures because I haven't set up the sump yet, I'm currently using a canister filter. I am looking to plumb a regular tank to sump and back set up. Why does the sump pump need to be at the bottom of the sump? The holes I want to drill would be in my tank to sump siphon line just below the water line of my main tank that way if my pump fails then my siphon will stop once the water drops to those holes and it won't flood my sump which will be half empty to account for that extra water. On the other end I want to put my sump pump close to the top of the sump so that if my siphon fails then the pump can only pump a small amount of water into my main tank before it is above water. The main tank will not be filled to the top so that it can hold that extra water. Hopefully I've worded it better this time, thanks guys. If needed I can draw a picture of what I mean

 

[IPisces]

Put a baffle in your sump so that the area the pump is in only holds a small amount of water. your water is going to evaporate, unless you hook up an auto top off system to it. if it evaporates below the top of the pump, it will pump air into the tank and create a lot of air bubbles which isnt good and could burn up your pump.

put the holes in the return line above the water line so it will not back siphon any water except what is in the return line, before breaking the siphon. we can post pics of how ours are set up for you to take a look at.
also check out Melevsreef.com | Acrylic Sumps & Refugiums

this will give you some ideas as to how to put together a sump.

 

[mfinn]

If your tank is drilled, then you will never have a syphon failure. If you use a good quality overflow box your chances of syphon failure are next to nothing.
With your sump pump near the top of the water, it will start sucking air in a couple days with normal evaporation.

 

[mfinn]

Also, if you end your return line just under the water line in the display tank, you will not need to drill any anti-syphon holes at all.

 

[mfinn]

I have a couple anti-syphon holes drill in a couple return lines, but they are just below the waters surface, so water doesn't get sprayed all over.

 

[xxkenny90xx]

So I think I will have my return line just below the water in my main tank for anti siphon purposes, and put a baffle next to my sump pump. I'd like my sumps intake/siphon hose to go to the bottom of my main tank because I believe that's where the dirty water is. That hose will have a couple holes in it just below my main tanks water level. Sound Ok? No need for an overflow box?

 

[mfinn]

No, if I read this right, what you are planning is wrong.

 

[mfinn]

The water coming from your display tank needs to be skimmed from the surface of the water. You put a syphon hose at the bottom of your tank and all the water will end up on your floor.

 

[mfinn]

http://www.melevsreef.com/allmysumps.html

Checkout the link that IPisces posted

 

[IPisces]

Tell us...is your tank drilled with an internal overflow for getting water from the tank to the sump?

 

[IPisces]

And you keep saying you want to put the holes just below the water line. You can put them just above the water line so if the power goes out or the pump fails, the return line will immediately suck air and break the reverse siphon. no need to let it suck a half gallon of water out of your tank back into the sump first.

 

[xxkenny90xx]

Thanks for the link IPisces, very good article. I do understand that since my tank isn't drilled I am supposed to use an overflow box. I'd like my return to be just under the surface which will at some point cause a small amount of water to be reverse siphoned because it will be quieter than having holes above the water. My tank is in the living room and a quiet tank means a happy wife. On the other end where I'll be siphoning water from the tank to the sump, wouldn't the holes just under the surface do the job of the overflow by breaking the siphon in case of pump failure? Thanks mfinn, I will leave this line near the surface instead of running it to the bottom of my tank

 

[mfinn]

You really need to have a drilled tank, or use a hang-on overflow box. Any other kind of homemade hoses, pvc pipe contraptions just don't make a dependable way to move water from the main tank to the sump.
Having things run smooth and steady not only contributes to a happy hobby experince, it helps keep things stable for the critters in the tank.

 

[mfinn]

There are alot of overflow boxes on the market. Some are fairly inexpensive and some cost more.
Some seem like a bargin, but have their flaws.
One manufacture that I have never heard complaints about is Lifereef products.
Check these out.
prefilter box, siphon box, overflow box, siphon overflow, Eurobrace, Euro-brace, Euro-tank

 

[IPisces]

Well Kenny, get things set up the way you want it and test it out. see how it works.
In my opinion, you are going to have problems with the system you have set up for water flow from the tank to the sump. but until you set it up and post pics, I dont quite know what it is you're doing. So maybe your plan will work. set it up post pics and test it out. I'd like to see what you're doing.

 

[blk822822]

One problem with home made setups is the power goes out and they keep siphoning till they are out of the water. So the sump has to be big enough to hold the extra water. Then when the power comes back on the over flow needs to start siphoning again by itself. If you just have some kinda pipe in the water and the siphon doesn't start it will over flow your tank and there goes the happy wife.