Dwarf lion in a reef?

[afilter]

Everything I have read says with caution. I am aware of the obvious caution...."if it will fit in its mouth it will eat it". I have never owned a lion due to the fact that I have always had smaller fish and did not think they were reef safe.

LFS did not think they would bother any invert other than small shrimp.I am looking for a new fish to replace my lost tangs.

Anyone have one in a reef with success?

LFS just received some juvenal spotted dwarfs in (2-3")and I have one on hold until I can do a bit more research. From what I have found this species can get 6-8". LFS thinks that could take 2-3 years. I know oscars are cute as juvenals, but do not stay that way long, what about lions, how fast do the grow?

I think all my fish would be safe to start out. Chromis is about 2.5-3" and could be at risk down the road. Clowns are both 3-4"+ and growing. The cleaner shrimp I have is huge.

Anyone have any thoughts?

TIA,

 

[jetaero]

The shrimp would most definitely get attacked and eaten. The clownfish are what species? The chromis would get eaten as well most likely. I would say you could do a coral tank with a lionfish, but not a "reef" tank, with reef fishes.

-Josh-

 

[afilter]

The clowns are maroons. The male would be about twice the size of the lion right now as it was pretty small. Anyone know how fast dwarf lions grow?

My hope is that the clowns keep growing now that they have a bit more room. I recently saw some maroons over 6".

I realize the chromis and even the shrimp could be at risk in time. Any other concerns I should be aware of if I try it?

Does diet/feeding schedule change/reduce the risk of the lion attacking tankmates?

I do have a lot of rock work and hiding places.

TIA,

 

[jetaero]

They're a carnivore... If it's there, they can eat it, they will eat it. I've seen some lions take quite large amounts in their mouths. It's not worth risking the lives of other fish to do it. The shrimp WILL get eaten though, no matter what size. The maroons if large enough, could be housed with it though.

-Josh-

 

[afilter]

Thanks, definately some more reading to do.

 

[dpaynter]

Possibly worse than having a lion eat one of your other fish is having a lion eat half of that fish.

 

[morgan]

my lfs breeding maroons are over 10inches u could always get rid of the chromis for a wrasse or larger fish
imo the dont think the lion fish would eat the cleaner shrimp as it has a symbiotic realtionship with fish but it could happen i wouldnt put a $120 shrimp in with it
id be more worryed about the deadly venome that all lionfish possess its a pretty fish and fairly cheap but if u have ur hand in ur tank often how many times do u want to go to the ER

 

[SWPlantedTank]

I have an antennata in my 75 aga reef, along with a porcupine puffer, a scopus tang and a lawnmover blenny. I do have a strong refugium that sucks up the waste products, so I am able to feed them a lot. My lionfish eats out of my hand ! (Don't try this at home).

I can not keep a peppermint shrimp in with them, but they do seem to leave hermits alone. They have not picked on the blenny since they grew bigger than him, but, like I said, I keep them well fed.

I think a large clown would be safe, but a chromis? I dunno...

I would try to catch the chromis (fish trap outta DP bottle works great) and get the lion. They are cool fish. Mine really has personality. He treats me like my dog does!

 

[steve-s]

Another thing to consider is that there are various species of lion that do not get as large like fuzzy dwarfs. Many would make fine additions with the exception of decorative inverts (crabs/shrimp) or very small fish. With the list you have so far, the only iffy inhabitant would be the cleaner shrimp.

A properly fed lion (about 2-3 times/week) would be less likely to opt for tank mates but it's not a guarantee. Does your LFS know the species name, spotted dwarfs a little veige?

Cheers
Steve

 

[afilter]

Does your LFS know the species name, spotted dwarfs a little veige?

Cheers
Steve

I will have to check. I do not own the book we were looking in at the LFS. I believe it was this one:

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/A...14573&adid=0KB4W5YYG07QRXDN0B7S&link_code=as1

I have been stumped finding it on the Web. Best way to describe it was a tiny zebra with a large black spot on eack pectoral fin. The book stated up to 7". I will see if I can get the species name.

Thanks,

 

[afilter]

OK, I think I may have found it:

http://www.scuba-equipment-usa.com/marine/AUG04/Spotfin_Lionfish(Pterois_antennata).html

Pterois antennata (spotfin lion)

 

[steve-s]

The shrimp would definately be a goner with that guy. The other fish would be okay as long as you keep the lion fed, none of the current fish are less than 2" and the lion is still a juvi as you indicated above. The main thing to remember is if the fish/tank mate is small enough for it's mouth (even close to), it will try to eat it.

The only other concern would be is there enough swimming room if you have live rock aand the dimensions of your tank for manuvering room. There should also be a sizable cave where it can hang out when it needs to. Also a high flow tank is not a good idea.

Cheers
Steve

 

[Krish]

Since you guys are on the topic, here's a photo I took here in the Bahamas of a lion fish tank with a few blue hippos in there with them. Sorry I can't add anything more, but I really know nothing when it comes to lions other than they are predators

 

[afilter]

The only other concern would be is there enough swimming room if you have live rock aand the dimensions of your tank for manuvering room. There should also be a sizable cave where it can hang out when it needs to. Also a high flow tank is not a good idea.

Cheers
Steve

Thanks, now that the tangs are gone the cleaner could be moved out. As for swimming area I am confident there is plenty as the tangs seemed happy. I have tons of caves in the rock work. From what I have read else where they like to camouflage themselves in caves and crevices in a defensive posture with spines out if threatened.

I think I may give it a try. Something different than what I have had before. As long as the maroon clowns and Coral Beauty and corals will be OK. I will watch the six line as the lion gets bigger(right now about 2").

What about QTing a lion? It has been some time since I added fish and I usually did QT. I thought I read that lions are similar to mandarins and are not prone to parasites?

As for feeding I am thinking my normal diet (cyclopese, greenlife line, mysis, daphnia andspectrum pellets) suplemented with frozen krill. Any other specific lion food that will not pollute. Kind of want to avoid live food.

BTW, cool pic of the lions, never seen so many together. Usually you see them alone.

TIA,

 

[Krish]

BTW, cool pic of the lions, never seen so many together. Usually you see them alone

Yeah...My first time seeing so many myself. It's very cool thing to see! Best wishes on trying a lion out yourself

 

[steve-s]

I thought I read that lions are similar to mandarins and are not prone to parasites?

Not true at all, not even a little bit. You will still need to Qt although be sure it's not too small or it will stress the lion severely.

As for feeding I am thinking my normal diet (cyclopese, greenlife line, mysis, daphnia andspectrum pellets) suplemented with frozen krill. Any other specific lion food that will not pollute. Kind of want to avoid live food.

Live food is avoidable but these food choices are not going to work. Be especially careful to avoid freeze dried foods. Lions are very prone to internal problems and vitamin deficiencies.

Stick to freshly frozen meaty seafoods. Shrimp, frozen (not freeze dried) krill, scallop, silversides and so on. Never ever feed FW feeder fish. Ghost shrimp will do in a pinch though. Thaw and cut to the appropriate size the lion will be able to injest easily. Mabye about 1" thin strips. Try soaking in a liquid vitamin accossionally as well. It may snub it's nose up at it initially but don't be discouraged, you may also need to experiment with different brands. I would hold off on that until it's accepting regular foods a little easier. While the lion is in the QT, it will make it that much easier on the both of you to train the fish to feed. Using a feeding stick, slowly approach the lion so your within about 2-3 inches from it's mouth. Gentley wave the food side to side in a slow continuos motion. No jerking or quick movements. You want to entice the lion into thinking the food is alive. It may take a few times and will take patience so don't get too discouraged, keep at it twice daily until it does accept the foods. Make sure you do not keep the foods from failed attempts. The longer the raw food is unthawed, the higher the bacteria will become and may cause a problem. Once the lion does accept the foods, only feed about 2-3 times a week and be sure the total portion is not big enough to swell the belly. Just enough so you know it's been satiated.

Cheers
Steve

 

[wrightme43]

How bought this one. The old whatever will fit in its mouth thing.
I had a fuzzy dwarf lion. I knew the giant chromis would never fit in its mouth. Just wasnt happening. Well it did. Folded sideways. It killed them both.

 

[steve-s]

True enough, as I said even something close to it's mouth size. I have however found, myself keeping several of these species, that if kept fed on a regular schedule it's a rarity unless a small fish.

Cheers
Steve

 

[afilter]

Thanks for all the great information. I decided to give it a try. I did ID it upon closer exam as a dwarf zebra lion with the two small white dots by the tail, not a spotfin as I originally thought.

It is in QT right now. So far it has not successfully feed. Tried frozen mysis, krill and silversides in the manner Steve suggested. I will keep trying. If no success by Wed I will break down and buy a few ghost shrimp.

Unfortunately no LFS carry SW feeder shrimp as that might be a good option as they can survive in the tank and not pollute it. Shipping is outrageous though.

Thanks again,

 

[Sparks]

i had a 2.5" fuzzy dwarf that would pick up small hermits by the opening of the shell while they were still in it, and then attempt to quickly suck in, then spit out the crab inside.

Like he was just trying to get the filling from a twinkie.

it usually only took him 1-3 tries on each hermit to get him out.