Equipment question for new 55 gal reef system

[thecapn]

I'm looking to set up a 55 gallon reef aquarium.

I'd like a full reef system, with invertebrates, live rock, corals, fish, etc...

I'm starting to plan out what equipment to get but the selection is a little overwhelming, and I'm having trouble understanding the plumbing. Is there some sort of website that lays it out for newbies? (I Read all the articles at liveaquaria and the reefkeeper's FAQ at thekrib.)

For a 55 gallon reef, I was considering a 20 gallon sump, wet/dry filter, and in-sump protein skimmer.

To sustain a reef, are calcium/phos reactors neccesary?

Also, I'd like to use sand as a substrate to mimic real tropical reef conditions... any addtl equipment recommended?

Thanks for your feedback, so excited!

 

[DonW]

You need to decide what corals you intend to keep. Soft, Hard(sps) or mixed. This is a real equipment junkie hobby and can get confusing. Let us know what you want to house, so we can steer you in the right direction.

Don

 

[thecapn]

You need to decide what corals you intend to keep. Soft, Hard(sps) or mixed. This is a real equipment junkie hobby and can get confusing. Let us know what you want to house, so we can steer you in the right direction.

Don

Primarily soft corals.

 

[DonW]

Primarily soft corals.

As far as filtration goes. If you want a sump. You just need a good skimmer and a way to get the water up and down. NO wet dry in a reef system. 55g softy tank I'd go with a AM turbo floater t1000 and thats it, no need for reactors unless you want to run your carbon in one but not necessary.

Don

 

[thecapn]

As far as filtration goes. If you want a sump. You just need a good skimmer and a way to get the water up and down. NO wet dry in a reef system. 55g softy tank I'd go with a AM turbo floater t1000 and thats it, no need for reactors unless you want to run your carbon in one but not necessary.

Don

OK, so:

BIO filtration: Live rock, live sand.
MECH filtration: Protein Skimmer, in sump
CHEMICAL filtration: ?

Would you recommend any other types of filters?

Thanks for your patience.

 

[robo100]

Hi,
I am new to reefs as well. I have recently setup my first 80 gallon reef tank and have done a ton of research. Here are some of my suggestions for your setup I am sure others will come along to help you out more.

Cost:
Be very aware of how much you want to spend on a reef tank. I would outline a budget and choose your equipment. Make a spreadsheet to track your costs before diving into a reef setup. If you already have the tank and stand beware that the reef tank will still cost $1000.00 or more to setup.

Substrate:
I would go with a high quality live sand and agronite substrate. This will help the filteration. Stay away from standard sand! This will work for freshwater setups but not marine it will have an adverse affect on the PH balance of your system.

Live rock:
Go for the best. I would look into using only Fiji Live rock. For a 55 gallon I would start out with 60 lbs of live rock. In most cases live rock is $3/$6 per pound so expect to pay big $$$

Protein skimmer:
Get a good one! I can recomend the Remora or Remora pro skimmers as they seem to work pretty well. I have heard good things about all Aqua-C skimmers as well as ball-pak and turbo flor. I have not yet heard anything good about the Sea Clone or as a lot of people call it the Sea Clown. Most protein skimmers are in the $200.00 range.

Lighting:
Lighting is very tought in reef setups. There is a general rule of thumb that reef tanks need 5 to 8 watts per gallon of water. You want to have some Actinic light and a lot of 14000K light (for corals). Most reef tanks use metal halides because you just can't get enough light using standard CF bulbs. In my setup I use 260 watts of CF (Actinic and 10000K) and 350 watts of 14000K for the corals.

Water:
Use only RO (Reverse Osmosis) or DI water. This will require some additional equipment. I cheat a little on my tank and use the Aquarium Pharmecuticals Tap water filter (About $50.00). This filter will produce DI water at about 10 gallons per hour.

I hope this helps you out and welcome to the salty side... Its a lot of fun

 

[DonW]

OK, so:

Would you recommend any other types of filters?

Thanks for your patience.

Nope, just a skimmer and a bag or two of carbon.


Don

 

[thecapn]

Hi,
I am new to reefs as well. I have recently setup my first 80 gallon reef tank and have done a ton of research. Here are some of my suggestions for your setup I am sure others will come along to help you out more.

Cost:
Be very aware of how much you want to spend on a reef tank. I would outline a budget and choose your equipment. Make a spreadsheet to track your costs before diving into a reef setup. If you already have the tank and stand beware that the reef tank will still cost $1000.00 or more to setup.

Substrate:
I would go with a high quality live sand and agronite substrate. This will help the filteration. Stay away from standard sand! This will work for freshwater setups but not marine it will have an adverse affect on the PH balance of your system.

Live rock:
Go for the best. I would look into using only Fiji Live rock. For a 55 gallon I would start out with 60 lbs of live rock. In most cases live rock is $3/$6 per pound so expect to pay big $$$

Protein skimmer:
Get a good one! I can recomend the Remora or Remora pro skimmers as they seem to work pretty well. I have heard good things about all Aqua-C skimmers as well as ball-pak and turbo flor. I have not yet heard anything good about the Sea Clone or as a lot of people call it the Sea Clown. Most protein skimmers are in the $200.00 range.

Lighting:
Lighting is very tought in reef setups. There is a general rule of thumb that reef tanks need 5 to 8 watts per gallon of water. You want to have some Actinic light and a lot of 14000K light (for corals). Most reef tanks use metal halides because you just can't get enough light using standard CF bulbs. In my setup I use 260 watts of CF (Actinic and 10000K) and 350 watts of 14000K for the corals.

Water:
Use only RO (Reverse Osmosis) or DI water. This will require some additional equipment. I cheat a little on my tank and use the Aquarium Pharmecuticals Tap water filter (About $50.00). This filter will produce DI water at about 10 gallons per hour.

I hope this helps you out and welcome to the salty side... Its a lot of fun

Thanks for a very informative post. Can I ask about your filter set up? Thats the only part that confuses me.

If you could detail each piece, and where it goes, that would help a lot! Thanks!

 

[thecapn]

Ok, let me see if I got this right... bare with me:

I will need an overflow box with a siphon pump to get the water OUT of my aquarium. A line from the box will go to my sump, which can be another aquarium. I'll have a protein skimmer inside my sump, as well as a UV sterilizer and some active carbon. (Should I put my heater(s) in the sump?) From there, I'll use either a powerhead or water pump to move the water back up to the aquarium (the return) and I can use a wavemaker to oscillate the water return turbulence.

Does that sound accurate?

 

[alison]

My estimate for cost is about double what you spent on the tank. A GREAT book is the new marine aquarium; I have a dealer here in spokane, Wash. who won't even sell you something unless you've read the book. (Wierd guy, but helpful). It has great tank design suggestions to get your maximum water flow and easy access. Never buy a package system from the pet store, especially if you want to put your focus on soft corals. The best advice would set up a network of friends and suppport, and find one or two dealers you really trust that are very knowledgeable with corals. Kevin Pockell (reef Frontier member) is a good specialist.

Best of luck to you.

 

[DonW]

You got it. All gizmos and gadgets go in the sump. You need slow circulation through the sump so the skimmer can do its job. The flow in the tank can be handled with powerheads on a wave maker or a closed loop. The sump is just a place to hide the gadgets.

Don

 

[thecapn]

You got it. All gizmos and gadgets go in the sump. You need slow circulation through the sump so the skimmer can do its job. The flow in the tank can be handled with powerheads on a wave maker or a closed loop. The sump is just a place to hide the gadgets.

Don

Thanks, Don.

What's a good ratio for aquarium->sump? For a 50 or 60 gallon aquarium, would a 20 gallon sump be adequate?

Also, what is "slow circulation" relative to the volume of the tank/sump?

I've read that a good GPH will circulate your tank's volume 10 times in an hour.

 

[robo100]

Every setup is slightly different but yes the sump is where you put all the gizmos. My setup is slightly different as I have a wet/dry for my filter.

Basically there is an overflow box inside my tank and a pre-filter box hanging off the back of the tank. A U tube is used to syphon water from the overflow box to the pre-fileter box (no pump required). The pre-filtered water then runs underneith my tank into the wet/dry filter. A pump is used to pump the water from the wet/dry to the main tank again. If the pump should quit the water will continue to syphon into the wet/dry filter, however when the level gets too low in the main tank the syphon action quits. In my setup the syphon quits before the wet/dry filter is filled up. This is the purpose of the overflow box. Without this setup if a pump should quit the wet/dry could overflow and make a big mess. I love this setup because there is no way my wet/dry can overflow in case of pump failure (and Yes it happens).

My protein skimmer hangs off the back of my tank. I don't use UV at all. I always thought they were not really needed if you have good filteration and enough live rock. But I could be wrong. If you like I could snap a couple of pictures tonight and re-post them on this thread so it's easier to understand. I bought my entire setup used so all of this was setup in the tank. I just played around with the different pieces until I figured it out.

IMG]c:\filter.jpg[/IMG]

 

[DonW]

Thanks, Don.

What's a good ratio for aquarium->sump? For a 50 or 60 gallon aquarium, would a 20 gallon sump be adequate?

Also, what is "slow circulation" relative to the volume of the tank/sump?

I've read that a good GPH will circulate your tank's volume 10 times in an hour.

You need to pick a skimmer first. I dont believe in the reef keeping rules of thumb. Match your circulation to the skimmer. Definately do not put in a J tube overflow box without some way to suck out the air. Either use a PH venturi or a aqualifter or you WILL have wet carpet.

Don

 

[thecapn]

You need to pick a skimmer first. I dont believe in the reef keeping rules of thumb. Match your circulation to the skimmer. Definately do not put in a J tube overflow box without some way to suck out the air. Either use a PH venturi or a aqualifter or you WILL have wet carpet.

Don

I'll look at protein skimmers right now.

 

[thecapn]

Looking at the Aqua Medic Turboflotor T1000 Protein Skimmer with Ocean Runner 2700 pump.

 

[DonW]

T1000 is somewhere close to 600 gph so somthing like a mag5 would be a good starting point.

Don

 

[thecapn]

Thanks Don!

What do people recommend for sumps? Would a 20 gal aquarium from the local pet store be fine?

 

[Electrokate]

Hi,
I just downsized from a 100 gallon tank to a 55 just so I could do it right. So hope I can help you avoid a few of my mistakes... If you want to see my full list of laments check my tank showcase forum:
http://www.reeffrontiers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11670

Don't do the U tube siphon overflow. Many people get away with them but the ones that don't are so aggravated or in trouble with spouses/landlords that they are lucky to keep the tank. Get a "reef ready" 55 (brand name of drilled glass tank) or an acrylic 50 and have someone fix it up for you, there are many helpful people on this board. The RR 55 overflow takes excessive space up IMO but is very safe. Drilled tanks can be made silent, they don't stop flowing, and they restart themselves after a brief power outage. U tubes fail most often while you are asleep or on vacation and make slurping sounds, again usually while you are trying to sleep . Even the expensive ones can cause trouble. Acrylic scratches like crazy and algae is hard to scrape out of bent corners, glass might be best, but that's up to you.

I am eternally grateful to Marty Finn for having Big T build me a sump for the 55. It's as big as humanly possible-takes up the entire stand and holds roughly 30 gallons. In the middle is a thriving refugium/coral frag attachment area. You can't buy a sump like this retail, they are usually too small and lame. Sump's just a box really, the dividers provide tons of support and it doesn't have to be pretty so you can build your own. My store bought stand from AGA has a vertical piece in the middle which is cosmetic and can be removed in the back to slide the sump in. Just don't make your sump wider than the opening . Once in place we put the vertical piece back and the bowing of the sump will be somewhat prevented by the wood, a bonus. I think building a stand is better, the AGA stands are usually pretty ugly and the hoods don't hold halides if you decide to use those later. Building a new hood and matching the stain to the stand is really really hard!

I don't know squat about the skimmer you are contemplating, might have to design your sump and stand around it as I did in the past. Some are too tall to accomodate in sales floor stands.

Get a very strong return pump without too much heat if you don't have air conditioning, the more flow the better. You can put a SCWD (pronounced squid) on it so that the return flow alternates from side to side, creates a wave action and the softies not only look great in it but grow great. Don't use too many right angles on the tubing, the softer you can make any bends in the line the less flow you will lose. 1000 GPH is not unreasonable-most would say it's minimal-for a return pump. You can't do that with a lot of U tube overflows, but you can't really grow fat softies without flow and one solid powerful return pump is better than 6 powerheads, and cheaper in the end. Even then you probably will still put a good powerhead like a seio in there to eliminate low flow areas. If you are like me and learn from mistakes this will be after buying 20 or more cruddy powerheads/pumps

I use a box fan face down on the sump for cooling and a pair of heaters with a temperature controller as heaters seem to fail often. One heater was stuck on and the tank got to 85 degrees, it still didn't turn off but was set to 78. El cheapo temp controllers I use are 15 bucks at Angelsplus.com or $120+ for digital ones elsewhere. The cheap ones are easily bumped up or down, the knob is too flexible. Tape it down where you want it.

Lighting on my setup is 2 96 watt pc bulbs and I get afternoon sun which most people frown on. Would be better to get no sun and add 2 or more 55 watt actinics for color and dusk/dawn. Would love moonlights as well. If you build an enclosed hood fans are in order. Again the RR overflow cuts into the area where I'd like to hang an actinic. No point lighting the inside of the overflow.

Don't pile too much rock in there, you need to leave room for the coral. I saw where one guy recommended 1/4 to 1/3 of the bottom space should be rock, rest will allow room to grow. Softies need flow and space, and grow they do...fast. I raised my liverock on platforms of pvc pipe and eggcrate so the flow goes under and around it, this also gives the fish hiding places. Looks ugly til it's covered in coraline but works well. Also try to avoid putting rock against a wall of the tank. You don't want any dead zones. I try to create caves when I place rocks and generally keep the structure open to flow.

Use fine aragonite sand, no chippy stuff or crushed coral-that's for freshwater tanks. Traps debris like crazy, gets nasty.

Dose your supplements from the beginning and learn to use the test kits. This will ensure that the maximum amount of coralline survives on the liverock and the bacteria that cycle the tank perform better/reproduce faster. Plus it's good practice and teaches you how a tank can get out of whack without risking the health of fish and coral. A 2 part system is good for softies, they don't have to have a ton of calcium. I like to emphasize the alkalinity, especially with xenia. SPS people push the calcium up but we softie people don't have to do that.

Last of all do get a quarantine tank set up. Nothing sucks more than losing all your fish because you added just one more. The FDA is in the process of pulling our access to over the counter fish meds containing antibiotics, so we will have to take fish to the vet (as if vets do tropical fish). Now is the time to get used to prevention. Apparently they think we are taking the fish meds. I did meet one person who does that so apparently the rumor is sort of accurate.

Kate

PS The bit about the FDA and fish is here, 2nd paragraph. I have been reading vet articles, they are interesting. Nothing new on ich but lots on diseases I didn't know existed, like "Naso tang disease".
http://edis.ifas.ufl.edu/VM108

 

[DonW]

Get a very strong return pump without too much heat if you don't have air conditioning, the more flow the better. You can put a SCWD (pronounced squid) on it so that the return flow alternates from side to side, creates a wave action and the softies not only look great in it but grow great. Don't use too many right angles on the tubing, the softer you can make any bends in the line the less flow you will lose. 1000 GPH is not unreasonable-most would say it's minimal-for a return pump. You can't do that with a lot of U tube overflows, but you can't really grow fat softies without flow and one solid powerful return pump is better than 6 powerheads, and cheaper in the end. Even then you probably will still put a good powerhead like a seio in there to eliminate low flow areas. If you are like me and learn from mistakes this will be after buying 20 or more cruddy powerheads/pumps

The sump not only stores your gizmos it is your processing plant. I leave the sump out of the equasion when it comes to flow. Passing to much water will only send waste back to the aquarium. Match your flow to your skimmer for best production. Passing to much water will also mean the heaters and or chiller will have to work much harder.
Internal tank flow is also very important but is a seperate system that you need to deal with.
The longer the sump the better, but a 20 aga would be fine.

Don