Krish
RF STAFF
Yeah...Just see how it goes. I know how frustrating it can get especially after spending so much and putting in so much effort, but just give it time. We'll do our best here to see to it that you get things sorted out
High Nitrates.. Need advice
- Thread starter dibblm
- Start date
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Yeah...Just see how it goes. I know how frustrating it can get especially after spending so much and putting in so much effort, but just give it time. We'll do our best here to see to it that you get things sorted out
ecobalance
lifetaper
miracle mud
I really think the whole concept of a deep sand bed in the sump[refugium]is being overlooked with the thought or need to cross methods.I am like many other people outt here nott a microbiologist and am a firm believer that sucess witth a marine aquarium can be achieved many different ways.I keep reading comments about acumalated detrites becomeing a problem due to not being able to syphen or remove it.I have read some very inttelagent comments and am by no means saying they are right or wrong.With outt babbleing on i just want to say tha a deepsand bed is a method borrowed from sewage treatment plants ,where due to enviromental reasons had to find a way to treat sewage on a biological level rather than a chemical one so water could be put back into lakes without hazordous effects on the life in and around it.To shorten this up a bit i will get to the itle of my thread.By accident a product now know as miracle mud was found as a end product of a very complex biological process in treatment plants ,old sumps and unmaintained aquariums and yes accient sumps and lagoons,by end product i mean what is left over when uneaten food decaying plants fish and fecees was converted back to basic[nott the kind u putt in your filter]carbon,and was usually discarded to to its black color.It is now known that it has the ability to bind and not leach once exuastted huge amounts of nitrates and phosphates,and is made in a sudo form for growing macro algaes in refugiums.So that detrites you keep talking about removeing is acttually the key ingreident to a sucessfull deep sandbed and will someday if left alone create a perfectly balanced eco-system.The power of a properly designed refugium is usually missed due to lack of confidence and the need to adjust.Yes it is the only system that will work better 10 years from now with no maintance than itt does 1 year aftter being set up.Itt is also the only way of running an aquarium thatt can be fine tuned without 10000 variables,by simply adding more or takeing away sand or rock from the main display.Ocasionally sand will have to be replaced one quater at a time maybe on a every year remove and replace one forth of the sand bed justtt as u do in the aquarium,and to trade sand with a trusted sourse will prevent inbread microlife and promote diversity.
I really think the whole concept of a deep sand bed in the sump[refugium]is being overlooked with the thought or need to cross methods.I am like many other people outt here nott a microbiologist and am a firm believer that sucess witth a marine aquarium can be achieved many different ways.I keep reading comments about acumalated detrites becomeing a problem due to not being able to syphen or remove it.I have read some very inttelagent comments and am by no means saying they are right or wrong.With outt babbleing on i just want to say tha a deepsand bed is a method borrowed from sewage treatment plants ,where due to enviromental reasons had to find a way to treat sewage on a biological level rather than a chemical one so water could be put back into lakes without hazordous effects on the life in and around it.To shorten this up a bit i will get to the itle of my thread.By accident a product now know as miracle mud was found as a end product of a very complex biological process in treatment plants ,old sumps and unmaintained aquariums and yes accient sumps and lagoons,by end product i mean what is left over when uneaten food decaying plants fish and fecees was converted back to basic[nott the kind u putt in your filter]carbon,and was usually discarded to to its black color.It is now known that it has the ability to bind and not leach once exuastted huge amounts of nitrates and phosphates,and is made in a sudo form for growing macro algaes in refugiums.So that detrites you keep talking about removeing is acttually the key ingreident to a sucessfull deep sandbed and will someday if left alone create a perfectly balanced eco-system.The power of a properly designed refugium is usually missed due to lack of confidence and the need to adjust.Yes it is the only system that will work better 10 years from now with no maintance than itt does 1 year aftter being set up.Itt is also the only way of running an aquarium thatt can be fine tuned without 10000 variables,by simply adding more or takeing away sand or rock from the main display.Ocasionally sand will have to be replaced one quater at a time maybe on a every year remove and replace one forth of the sand bed justtt as u do in the aquarium,and to trade sand with a trusted sourse will prevent inbread microlife and promote diversity.
burning2nd
Well-known member
WOW,
Ill entertain that one strongly....
Ive bin thinking of removeing my little peaces of LR and dumping abag of sand down there.
Ill entertain that one strongly....
Ive bin thinking of removeing my little peaces of LR and dumping abag of sand down there.
Scooterman
Well-known member
MM has to be replaced once it is full, Mike explains these methods as I posted in his thread, also other methods. The husbandry required & the pluses & minuses of each. This subject was discussed studied & researched throughly & still is to date, no argument here that either one of these will work. It takes through understanding, planning to keep any of these up & working well & that is where most will fall short. One thing about remotes you didn't get is the fact to feed them you need to get the food down to them, that is part of what they need to work. One other thing you mentioned about PH the PH in a sb or mud system can go overlooked, it will or can be very lower in the anaerobic areas & it could then be a problem not showing up in the main display until it is too late.
Krish
RF STAFF
With that being said...Nitrates and phosphates are key ingredients for macro algae's growth in a fuge for nutrient export. So...What people should try to accomplish in a system is not provide nitrates and/or phosphates for the algae to grow in the fuge or allow detritus to accumilate for the miracle mud to do it's thing, but do your best to prevent an accumilation of nitrates, phosphates or detritus in your system. Prevention is better than cure IMO. Now I'm not saying one method is better than the other, but I think Scooter made a key point when he said
Alot of people will read on how a dsb is the best thing known to man and how well it can reduce nitrates, but they don't really know how to care for one so they end up with more problems than they bargained for. Research is definately key in this hobby and doing what works best for you. I think you have to have a good understanding of each method of nitrate reduction or prevention in order to be sucessful. I've kept 0 nitrates for many months now and I don't have any sand in my system at all nor do I have a refugium or even miracle mud. However, that works well for my system as my approach is to remove "it all" before it has a chance to break down and cause water quality issues. Not everyone will be successful with this approach so I think it is great that we have many options out there all proven to work that we can choose from that suits us best. Maybe miracle mud may be "dibblim's" answer to his prayers so I think he should look at all of the different aspects and approaches of each method and what all is entailed in being successful with each and then make a decision on what method seems doable to him.
Murfman
Well-known member
Scooter et al; I have SPS, LPS, and softies. My SPS are millis, some stags, and some acros. I have Acan Lord and Enchinata as well as two trumpet/candycane and bubble coral for the LPS. For the requisite softies, I have GSP and Kenya tree as well as Zoos, Sun polyps, button polyps and metalic striped mushrooms.
I do test for Nitrates, when I do all the rest of my testing, once a month, and I have a spread sheet that I record everything in for trend analysis. When I first esblished the tank, my nitrates were off the scale. They were so high, I considered getting a nitrate reduction chamber and running one of those. After researching them, I decided that they were not worth the time for my application. After the tank was up and running for about a year, I noticed the nitrates dropping to what I consider an acceptable level. I know why my nitrates are where they are, I use the poly fiber to trap detritus in the sump/fuge.
My clowns spawn every 10 days and my anemonea is the size of a vollyball.
Krish
RF STAFF
What levels do you consider acceptable and also which test kits do you use out of curiosity?
Scooterman
Well-known member
Hey Murf that is cool, man I'd like to see pics of your tank! How long have you had your acros mixed in with the rest of your tank?
Murfman
Well-known member
What levels do you consider acceptable and also which test kits do you use out of curiosity?
Krish, for me <.20 PPM is acceptable. I know a lot of people will think that is too high but to me, its acceptable. I use the Salifert test kit.
Scooter, Here you go. I moved my tank from upstairs to downstairs in early Nov. The old tank had been set up for 2 1/2 years and pretty much mixed the entire time.
Dec 04;
Here is Dec of 05;
This is the new tank;
What is really noticable is the growth of the Yellow Candy Cane, in Dec 04, I bought it with 3 1/2 heads on it. Now it currently has over 20 heads and, I sold off one branch that had 16+ heads on it in Oct 06. The purple rimmed monti cap you see in the center of the new tank pic unfortunately was lost during the move. It started out in the Dec 04 pic as a small flat piece and grew into what you see now. I belive the loss was due to being exposed to 65* air while fixing two small leaks discovered on the bottom CLM intake two days after the move.
The anemonea is in the back of the tank in Dec 05. The tank was viewable on all 4 sides when it was upstairs. The album on photo bucket has pix of the front and back.
Sorry if it seems like the thread has been hijacked, but Scooter asked ;=P
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Krish
RF STAFF
Nice tank...Thanks for sharing the pics and the info
Scooterman
Well-known member
Ahh very nice, I'd sure like to see more of your tank & your set-up but your right I sorta hijacked. Ok you posted a .20 ppm is acceptable I'd really like to break down your tank set-up & see exactly why that works for you & the corals your keeping but I guess we can save that for a later date & a new thread. I think that may be a good discussion to share with everyone. Ok back to the thread!
