Howdy, a couple questions about my 55g

[tsintse]

Hello, been lurking a few days after some people at reefcentral pointed me here since there are a lot of Washington folks. Basically my daughter saw my friends reef tanks and has now got me converting 2 of my 3 tanks from big american Cichlids to reefs Heheh had to keep my old Oscar...

Anyways I have one 55 gallon running for about 3 months now with nothing but some live rock, few hermits, cleaner shrimps, damsel and an inch of crushed coral on the bottom. I have about 30 lb's of live rock that I had curing in my garage with a skimmer and was going to add it to the tank but it still seems to have a bit of detritus and stuff on it. Will I see a big spike in nitrates/ammonia when I put this in? I don't want to scrub it or rinse too hard again because some small polyps and stuff have started to grow.

Also I wanted to add a little sand to mix in with coral on the bottom basically for looks and maybe for a goby I want to get in a few months when I have a better feel for the tanks chemistry. If picked up a 40lb bag of caribsea and slowly added would I damage anything? I was told rinsing it was pretty much worthless but adding it the tank slowly would keep the cloudiness down. I added one small Zoo colony last week and it is looking very nice, I wouldn't want to mess with his new home if the cloudiness will harm it.

My water param at the moment are

calc 400
alk 5eq
ph 8.6
nitrate in tank 0
ammonia 0
sp.g 1.026
temp 84 @ day 78 @ night

Thanks and nice forum... my daughter and I may have to look into the PSAS

 

[DonW]

Welcome,

It seems your on the right path. As far as substrate goes I would only go with sand or no sand. CC is a pain, its going to collect everything that your trying to skim out. While the system is still young and mostly empty it seems easy to keep up, its later that your concerned with.
If you must have sand I would take out all the CC and just put in fresh shallow sand bed.
Your new rock might cause a spike, so just go slowly and add it a little at a time. You can always rearrange it later.
In your water params you have a 6 degree temp swing. I would try to get that into check also.

Hope this helps
Don

 

[johnehr]

Another thing thats pretty amazing about salt water tanks is that cloudiness really doesnt hurt anything. Things are used to storms that will kick up a lot of sand into the saltwater... The only problem occurs when detritus accumulates in the sand (but if you clean/stir it every once in a while) you should be fine. At least thats what I heard. (Im a newbie too).

 

[NaH2O]

tsintse, Welcome to Reef Frontiers!!! Glad you have found us

Putting sand on top of crushed coral....the sand will eventually settle to the bottom of the tank, leaving the crushed coral on top. Something to think about. If you want to avoid a sand storm, you can pour the sand in through a PVC pipe....sometimes that lessens the storm.

You can test the water you are curing the rock in for ammonia, nitrites, and nitrates, to see if it has completed the curing process. Get in there and blast the rock with a powerhead or turkey baster in order to free up the detritus. I really wouldn't worry too much about scrubbing the rock...you want to free it of all the gunk.

As Don said, you seem to have a large temperature swing. Do you have a sump to add a fan, or can you add a fan to your tank somehow? That would help to reduce the swing you are experiencing.

 

[Katchupoy]

Tsintse, WELCOME!!!!

what are your lights right now... im trying to know why you have so much big temp swing...? What do you inted to keep?

Going bottomless or with DSB is another big topic for you to research... but yes...like donw mentioned. CC is a no-no... And if you are a DIY maybe you can further use those CC to make your own aragocrete... or something...

In my case, Im using it to make my own plugs...

 

[tsintse]

Thanks for the info guys!, hmmm I think what I am going to do is pull the CC out and then put in a layer of sand and sprinkle a little of the coral on top just for looks. I am using a 4 x 65w 48" PC Coralife fixture, the temp swing is mostly due to the fact the kitchen is largely a series of holes going outside while I remodel so it gets coooold at night After reading this though I grabbed another heater I had to throw in my sump, hopefully that will keep thing a bit closer.

I think I'll do what was recommended by nah20 and donw, im gonna give it a good shoot with a spare pump and tank water and add the rock one piece at a time to prevent any shock to the system. Man oh man lol patience is a virtue in this hobby

 

[dnjan]

I agree with the "don't mix fine sand and crushed coral". Go with one or the other. With crushed coral, you can easily vacuum it periodically to keep it clean. Plus it won't blow around as much. But the particles are probably too big for a goby.

With fine sand the goby will be in his element. But, you have to be careful with water flow or the sand can blow around a bit. Plus, vacuuming fine sand is much more difficult (it just sucks up into the vacuum hose just like the detritus you want to vacuum out).

By mixing them together, you end up with the problems of both (fine particles blowing sround, difficult to vacuum, yet the cc pieces are hard on any sand-sifting gobies).

 

[Angelscrx]

I wouldn't mix it even for looks. I have a CC and sand mix and it is a royal pain. When I upgrade tanks I am just going with a shalow sand bed for looks and a remote sandbed for filtration. No more crished coral for me. The stuff that accumulates feeds red slime and green hair something awful. My .02 cents

 

[tsintse]

Well I want to pull the coral out and put sand in but I don't know how bad that will affect the tank, I can already see a ton of critters and stuff in the coral and I would hate to just ditch whatever has grown there. I think I may have to decided a bit more what to do. I did add two large pieces of the rock that's been curing in my garage the past couple weeks and the hermit crabs went to town on the small polyps that had grown on what of the pieces...%!#@$. Oh well! Another small polyp type thing though was ignored and is almost half a centimeter in diameter, can't wait to see what it turns out to be.

Adding the second heater in the sump helped a lot, I came down around 4 am to check the temp and it was around 82 to 84. On a bad note though one of the cleaner shrimp I had croaked this morning. I tested my water and both read 0 nitrate and ammonia leading to me to think my test kit is flaky. I hope this isn't to n00b a question but I can use the freshwater nitrate and ammonia kits I have on saltwater? I'm gonna feel like a idiot if I wasn't supposed to

Thanks for the responses so far

 

[NaH2O]

Read the test kits and see if they indicate whether or not they can be used on saltwater. Personally, I prefer Salifert kits - have been very reliable and worth the cost. In regards to your temperature...any reason you are shooting for the 84ºF mark? I wouldn't worry too much about the critters in your substrate....they will be repopulated before you know it.

BTW, don't feel like an idiot! We've all been there!

 

[wrightme43]

I still am. LOL

 

[tsintse]

I think I'll hit Blue Sierra omw home tomorrow since it's right down the street. I want to pick up some Salifert tests, just want to make sure ... I'll feel more comfortable getting two seperate results, especially since I am going to start putting some of our first coral pieces in. I floated the idea about changing the CC with my daughter and she was a bit traumatized since she has picked out a very small brittle star that has made a hangout in the bottom left front corner of the tank. It pops in and out of view and she can't bear the thought of losing her friend TT ! I may have to put the change off for a bit till that guy moves on to a less visible spot eheheh.

As for the water temp... that is just what I had my heaters set to, what would be a more recommended for the tank? I plan on mostly soft corals and SPS.

 

[big t]

Welcome to RF!

I would go with no sand, it is just a unnecessary pain in the butt later down the down the road. Trust me on this one. It took me about a year to get over having my sandbed turn bad on me.

Your temp is a little too high. 78 is ideal. If you can keep your temp right @ 78 all the time you will be in good shape. I would shoot to try to keep it under 80 for sure. This is a problem for a lot of people due to the amount of powerheads, pumps, and high power lights that most people have on their reef tanks. If you can not keep your temp at 80 or less you should look into using fans to start with to help keep the temp down. If you plan on running MH lighting you may be able to get away with just fans, but may have to go to a chiller.

On your rock issue... If you test your rock vat where your curing and you have 0 amm 0 nitrates, that means they are cured. It will be ok to rinse these rocks off with clean salt water and put them right into your tank. With the critters you currently have, the very minimal spike you could possably have they are not likely to be adversly affected. If there is anything other then 0's on those 2 tests that means they are not cured yet, and require more time.

Good luck

 

[NaH2O]

Here is a poll on Temperature: What Temperature is your Tank? This can give you an idea of the general temperature range most hobbyists keep their tank at. I like to keep mine right around 80ºF, but it does get up to 81ºF if I don't have the fans on (in the summer, it is upwards from there without fans).

If you don't want to remove the substrate because of a brittle star, and that is the only reason, then you could try and scoop it up. Add it back to the new substrate. Just a thought, you could also keep a bit of the crushed coral in a container (short term) and allow the critters to migrate, as well.

Tom's right on about the rock - test the water in curing container....that will tell you whether or not the rock has completed the curing process.

 

[Angelscrx]

I had noticed my water temp starting to go above eighty degrees and thought it was the climate change? I did some revemping of my flow by adding a SCWD and connecting it to my return pump eliminating to power heads and my temp stopped going over 80. Now stays around 78-79 degrees.

 

[tsintse]

The tests I was using were meant only for freshwater... DOH! And not only that I put off hitting Blue Sierra because I just picked up a 6800Ultra video card and went straight home to play Half Life 2. Everything was closed today so tomorrow first thing I'm picking up some Salifert tests, I just hope I don't have too bad of news. I turned my heaters down to 80 during the day so hopefully my critters will like that a bit more.

Is there some place local I can buy some chaeto? This tank came with a wet dry filter and I just finished removing the bio-balls over the past couple weeks. I want to fill it up now with some algaes and sand now that there is room. Also how much light should I keep over the new wet/dry turned refugium? Right now I just have a single 24" fixture.

Once again thanks!

 

[Elmo18]

Your temp is a little too high. 78 is ideal. If you can keep your temp right @ 78 all the time you will be in good shape. I would shoot to try to keep it under 80 for sure.

I will have to disagree with this one. Tropical reef temperatures are found at 82 degrees and higher. NIghttime fluctuations is about 80 degrees. HIgh temps at the day is around the high 80s, at 86 or 87.

In my opinion, it is better to keep a temperature of at least 80 degrees. This will help later on in the summer months, when/if you have heat problems. Temp spikes in the mid 80s will have little or no effect. However, temps with already rather low reef temperatures will surely have problems.

Many people keep their reef tanks at 82-86 degrees, and while it does seem high, it is actual reef temperatures in Bali...Cebu...Hawaii...etc...

78 Degrees is on the low side, imo and ime.

- Elmo

 

[johnehr]

Saltwater City in Bellevue sells Chaeto for $20 a clump. There are also some people that have it locally in their tanks. I do, but I dont have enough to spare right now. I just gave away a freezer bag full last week. I'm sure in 2-3 weeks Ill have plenty if you want some.

 

[tsintse]

I am checking Saltwater City this weekend, I JUST heard about it from our bookeeper at work and now I'm all excited to see. I need to pickup more salt so perhaps if they are open I'll check them out.

As for temperature, Elmo you make good sense and that was the logic I was going by when I had my tank set at the mid 80's. Now I am a bit confused and not sure if I should bump the temp back up. Time to do a bit of 'net research.

 

[Angelscrx]

Sorry to sound argumentative but I have never heard of anyone keeping their tank at 86 degrees. Maybe someone out there does but I have never seen it. 78-80 degrees are the norm, cooler waters are better since parasites don't grow well in these temps. Also slows the fish's metabolism down so they aren't as succeptible to illness (read that somewhere). I wouldn't bump your temps back up yet, check around.