hypothetical calcium reactor

[Skimmy]

i was trying to think of an alternative to running a calcium reactor w/ co2,
i was just wondering if it would be possible to run a calcium reactor on something like citric acid or other weak acids instead of co2?
my idea was to mix up some analytical grade citric acid with some ro/di water until the water had an acidic p.h. reading and then dose the water to the reactor until the p.h. was 6.0 - 6.5, can anybody with a good knowledge of chemicals tell me if this would be any more harmful than using co2? i know the same potential for p.h. drop exists, but would there be some other reason why i wouldnt want to use citric acid?
i figure if something like this worked, there'd probably be somebody doing it already, so im not holding my breath

 

[big t]

That is a interesting concept, you could use a dosing pump to drip in acid instead of co2. I am interested to hear what some of the chemists have to say about this.

 

[Skimmy]

dont all jump up at once now....
anybody??

 

[mojoreef]

Yea it would seem you would be better off just dosing a two part??


MIke

 

[Skimmy]

well it certainly would be easier to dose.... i was just wondering if it would be possible to run a reactor that way at all.

 

[MCary]

You could use vinegar too, the only problem I can see is raising it before it hits your tank. With CO2 you can blow it off.

 

[Skimmy]

good point. and when i think about it, where would all that acid go? probably just slaps your p.h. to the ground compared to co2.

 

[NaH2O]

I know this quote has more to do with using vinegar with Kalkwasser to reduce pH, but it might help you see what happens with the vinegar and bacteria, and potential drawbacks. What your Grandmother Never Told you About Lime

The reason that limewater raises the pH of aquarium water so considerably is because of the hydroxide that it adds. As described above, the hydroxide can combine with carbon dioxide to form bicarbonate and bring the pH back down. In many aquaria, however, the aeration is not great enough to bring in carbon dioxide fast enough to meet all this demand, and the pH rises. There are several ways to add additional carbon dioxide to meet this demand, including delivery from a carbon dioxide cylinder. Many aquarists, however, choose to add carbon dioxide in the form of vinegar. Many of them choose to add the vinegar directly to the limewater, although if pH reduction is the goal, it can also be added directly to a high flow area of the aquarium.

When vinegar is added directly to aquarium water, the active ingredient is acetic acid. The first thing it does is ionize into acetate and H+:

6. CH3COOH à CH3COO- + H+

Bacteria can then metabolize the acetate to gain energy in the reaction shown below:

7. CH3COO- + 2O2 à CO2 + H2O + OH-

On balance, the H+ released in (6) and the OH- released in (7) offset each other, and the net addition is simply carbon dioxide:

8. H+ + OH- à H2O

9. CH3COOH + 2O2 à 2CO2 + 2 H2O

One of the potential side effects of this metabolism is that the bacteria performing the transformation may grow faster because of it. This growth may have positive or negative outcomes. One potentially positive outcome is that as they grow, they will necessarily consume nitrogen and phosphorus, possibly lowering nitrate and phosphate levels in the aquarium. Another is that the bacteria may be a suitable food source for other organisms.

Potential drawbacks can include reduced oxygen as the bacteria use it to consume the acetate, and the appearance of unattractive bacterial mats in the aquarium (reported by some, but not by the majority of vinegar users).

 

[Skimmy]

thanks nikki, link queen!
just what i want for my tank, a bacteria matt!!

 

[pete polyp]

depends on the acid......you use to strong it will eat ur pumps,glass,acrylic,etc....i have used acids and caustics in an industrial setting...acids deteriorate non organic materials...it would more than likely eat thru your reactor