jrgilles
Well-known member
I agree. He should easily be able to cut 3-4k off of the price. Some of his prices seem that he is way over inflating.
I finally gotten the quote I been waiting for
- Thread starter OldManOfTheSea
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I agree. He should easily be able to cut 3-4k off of the price. Some of his prices seem that he is way over inflating.
TotalVapor
Banned
I agree, some are in line some are padded. I would do some shopping around before going further. I would also review the specs of the entire set up.
If this is a local store I am sure they will be willing to work with you. Especially since you will be a returning customer and they will be making their money off the support of the tank. Also with a local store you have a place to take your stuff back IF there is an issue with it.
If this is someone online I would continue to look online for better pricing for each of the items on your list that other places may stock. Of course I am not talking about the stand and canopy that is most likely made to order.
+1 more for finn you do not want to have high flow through your sump. If you have an in-sump skimmer you would want to allow the skimmer the proper amount of time to work with your water. Consult your skimmer manufacture on flow rates.
If this is a local store I am sure they will be willing to work with you. Especially since you will be a returning customer and they will be making their money off the support of the tank. Also with a local store you have a place to take your stuff back IF there is an issue with it.
If this is someone online I would continue to look online for better pricing for each of the items on your list that other places may stock. Of course I am not talking about the stand and canopy that is most likely made to order.
+1 more for finn you do not want to have high flow through your sump. If you have an in-sump skimmer you would want to allow the skimmer the proper amount of time to work with your water. Consult your skimmer manufacture on flow rates.
nomercymike
Live Aloha!!!!!!!!
I think we all need to take a road trip and help this fellow reefer out. It would be one heck of a road trip with all of us crazies. I think doing a bit more research would help you out the most. Check craigslist daily. If you see something on craigslist and are unsure, post it here and we can give our 2 cents. Keep us all posted.
jrgilles
Well-known member
for 240 galllons, whats the depth? Are 2 X250W MH and 8 T5's enough? I would think you would want more, as 2 X 250W MH seems good on my 75 gallon, which is a third of the size. Should they be upgraded to 400 W bulbs?
Never build anthing that big, so not exactly sure. I guess its all about water depth. Make sure the reflectors are good.
Never build anthing that big, so not exactly sure. I guess its all about water depth. Make sure the reflectors are good.
mfinn
Surgeonfish
jrgilles
Well-known member
I agree, seems like you'd want 4 bulbs for 8' of tank
OldManOfTheSea
Well-known member
The return pump listed will split into two return lines so the flow rate shouldn't be all that strong and as well, one other item that not on the list, pumps for the tank water currents.
James, his the man who will build this tank up again for me, also he is short of a private worker just for himself, he does I know have a few men working for him and the only two I seen know nothing at all.
finn, I wanted 4x250w MH, James is thinking about the over heating issues and I tell him that what is the problem with it? I have a 1/2 HP chiller and a s*** load of fans will be in place as well and I want to also look for those clip on fans for the sump.
jrgilles, I agree with you, but take a good look again at what the lighting will be, he list both the MH and T5.
Buddy
James, his the man who will build this tank up again for me, also he is short of a private worker just for himself, he does I know have a few men working for him and the only two I seen know nothing at all.
finn, I wanted 4x250w MH, James is thinking about the over heating issues and I tell him that what is the problem with it? I have a 1/2 HP chiller and a s*** load of fans will be in place as well and I want to also look for those clip on fans for the sump.
jrgilles, I agree with you, but take a good look again at what the lighting will be, he list both the MH and T5.
Buddy
mfinn
Surgeonfish
If you have a 1/2 hp chiller there is no reason you cannot run 4x250 watt, plus any other actinic lighting ( I think you should consider VHO )
If your return pump is pumping 2850gph, that is still going through the sump.
You really only need 750 to 1200 gph on a 240 gallon tank. Comes out to 3X to 5x tank volume.
If your return pump is pumping 2850gph, that is still going through the sump.
You really only need 750 to 1200 gph on a 240 gallon tank. Comes out to 3X to 5x tank volume.
OldManOfTheSea
Well-known member
finn, your telling me? I been telling James the very same thing that this chiller is powerful and early on, he wanted to run the chiller with a pump with 400 gph and I told him this chiller requires a greater flow rate, that if its less then 750 gph, it will shut itself down. But do look over the quote his giving for the lights with the combination with T5 lighting, one other believe it will do well for any SPS coral I would like to have.
Buddy
Buddy
mfinn
Surgeonfish
IceCap T5 4’ strips( 8 sets 4 on the front 4 on back) -------=$528.90
This isn't for just actinic is it?
seems another area that's a bit much.
Plus another thing I'm hearing is this guy, James, is telling you what you will get.
I would want it the other way around.
This isn't for just actinic is it?
seems another area that's a bit much.
Plus another thing I'm hearing is this guy, James, is telling you what you will get.
I would want it the other way around.
OldManOfTheSea
Well-known member
James knows that I need him more then the other way around, but i told him i will never kiss his a** for anything on this, im paying for the same tank all over again because one other couldnt do the right thing as well. It seems to me being with a disability, others take it too their advantage. Nut im not worry about that for if he was to called it quits, i would buy the dry goods and top of the line equipment should be for a price like more then $14K and in some of the T5 there suppose to be some actinic as well, but im no expert to the fancy lighting conditions, it was far easier when I did soft corals and others, this will be the first for me with a SPS system, and even waiting now more then 10 years, I am still determine to do this even if it does take me another year. And i wanted 4x250 w MH and not 3, with a chiller like the 1/2 HP i bought used, and later I will buy a new one for backup.
So you and others with the lighting and equipment knowledge, please list your highest recommendations and i will present them to James that those are far better then his suggestions, this as well is also another reason i wanted other marine hobbyists to see it for i was sure that if anything wasnt as good as it should been, I would most certainly hear of it. And i not care if James takes to the offensive again, it would only show me that his no expert but does have a limited amount of knowledge in what he does.
Buddy
The return pump will split into two return pvc lines, this should cut the flow rate tremendously.
So you and others with the lighting and equipment knowledge, please list your highest recommendations and i will present them to James that those are far better then his suggestions, this as well is also another reason i wanted other marine hobbyists to see it for i was sure that if anything wasnt as good as it should been, I would most certainly hear of it. And i not care if James takes to the offensive again, it would only show me that his no expert but does have a limited amount of knowledge in what he does.
Buddy
The return pump will split into two return pvc lines, this should cut the flow rate tremendously.
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iroll253
Well-known member
For the lighting i would do 4x 250's and for actinic supplement if you going with t5's i'd say cut it in half to at least 2x4ft t5's left to right and front to back making 8 total instead 16 even a total of 4 4ft t5' would work with the 4x metal halide 250's. For the lighting you could go to basically any websites retrofit section and get what you want for half of what your spending.
OldManOfTheSea
Well-known member
Does anybody second it and third and so on on what iroll253 is saying?
mfinn
Surgeonfish
Yes.
but I like VHO actinic better, but I agree.
You really don't need all those T5 bulbs and you would be better off with 4x250 watt mh.
but I like VHO actinic better, but I agree.
You really don't need all those T5 bulbs and you would be better off with 4x250 watt mh.
OldManOfTheSea
Well-known member
There are so many items to choose from and what James pick out in the three that others shown that I can get it for much less, I am becoming aware that his not as honest as he allows me to believe he is for I did tell him that I wanted the best I can get here and when i looked at the prices of the equipment he listed, due to the cost he listed that they must been top of the line equipment. I mean if he was to get those items he would normally charge to me just a bit higher to make a little profit on ordering them, but his prices on the three items that I said I would save as much as a $1,000 a lone in those if I buy them myself. but now im at a point with James that all of his selections are cheaper products and his charging me top dollar for them.
I can see almost how this is going to go, for how do I tell him his choices are cheaper products, not what I wanted and his charging me just about double the price without hurting his expert appearances? For im getting the idea he first talk with me was nothing but a all come on fairytale like so many often do in trying to make themselves a killing to make money off from that person. As well, I guess i can never give my trust to those who only make money in what they sell another for here you guys and gals do not make money off from me, so who would I trust more then the other?
This body of mine has been cursed with a disability and other certain medical problems that would take me a good while to best explain them for one is mostly all due from the Vietnam War and I first was when a younger man in the Korean War but my years in the military were cut short due to extreme close motor rounds in which also cursed some type of small medal peices to enter my skull and lost of some hair due to the explosion being so close. it caused me what the military doctors called it a minor condition of shell shock in which severe cases are better called as "post traumatic stress disorder". For my conditions with this all these years had become much worst in age, i often like when trying to type, forget what im trying to type and its a battle to regain my thoughts in which makes it tough for me to how better to explain myself in what im asking most of the time. At the end of my military life, I was giving a honorable discharge from the marines, I was of the rank as a Second Lieutenant.
Now away from what life i had, if James is to leave me after what im to tell him, fine by me for I do have another choice who to get for this, but I will talk to those at this other lfs and tell them i will buy the dry goods myself and have everything they will need except for pvc and such. With those here and a few other forums were I am also looking for just those certain few who i want to hear more from in what is best, top of the line equipment to get.
So you know something of my disability in which I was explaining about, this short message had taking me an hour to type.
Fiin, lord knows i planned from the begining to have 4x 250w MH and James changes it due to his own understanding and im going to have a strong chiller and even that I bought it used, I will later as well buy a new one for backup. The company for this chiller advises to drain the water from the chiller, i had the guy i bought it from to fill it with tank water and seal it tight, but they told me due to its medal elements, its not required to keep water in it, so I will later call someone I know to help me take it outside to drain it and then flush it out with the garden hose.
Buddy
PS. I need to start getting ready for all my three youngest grandchildren are to have their first holy communion today, I bought all new clothes to wear today for them. Also in another forum I finally am hearing from one other certain person, his under the name as argi.
I can see almost how this is going to go, for how do I tell him his choices are cheaper products, not what I wanted and his charging me just about double the price without hurting his expert appearances? For im getting the idea he first talk with me was nothing but a all come on fairytale like so many often do in trying to make themselves a killing to make money off from that person. As well, I guess i can never give my trust to those who only make money in what they sell another for here you guys and gals do not make money off from me, so who would I trust more then the other?
This body of mine has been cursed with a disability and other certain medical problems that would take me a good while to best explain them for one is mostly all due from the Vietnam War and I first was when a younger man in the Korean War but my years in the military were cut short due to extreme close motor rounds in which also cursed some type of small medal peices to enter my skull and lost of some hair due to the explosion being so close. it caused me what the military doctors called it a minor condition of shell shock in which severe cases are better called as "post traumatic stress disorder". For my conditions with this all these years had become much worst in age, i often like when trying to type, forget what im trying to type and its a battle to regain my thoughts in which makes it tough for me to how better to explain myself in what im asking most of the time. At the end of my military life, I was giving a honorable discharge from the marines, I was of the rank as a Second Lieutenant.
Now away from what life i had, if James is to leave me after what im to tell him, fine by me for I do have another choice who to get for this, but I will talk to those at this other lfs and tell them i will buy the dry goods myself and have everything they will need except for pvc and such. With those here and a few other forums were I am also looking for just those certain few who i want to hear more from in what is best, top of the line equipment to get.
So you know something of my disability in which I was explaining about, this short message had taking me an hour to type.
Fiin, lord knows i planned from the begining to have 4x 250w MH and James changes it due to his own understanding and im going to have a strong chiller and even that I bought it used, I will later as well buy a new one for backup. The company for this chiller advises to drain the water from the chiller, i had the guy i bought it from to fill it with tank water and seal it tight, but they told me due to its medal elements, its not required to keep water in it, so I will later call someone I know to help me take it outside to drain it and then flush it out with the garden hose.
Buddy
PS. I need to start getting ready for all my three youngest grandchildren are to have their first holy communion today, I bought all new clothes to wear today for them. Also in another forum I finally am hearing from one other certain person, his under the name as argi.
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mfinn
Surgeonfish
OldManOfTheSea,
here is my opinion on this whole thing.
You seem to have a lfs/person who is going to sell you a setup the way he wants and only his way. He is going to sell you equipment at a price that is going to make him some money plus he is going to charge you more for doing all this.
It doesn't sound like he is willing to listen to you at all.
My suggestion is to tell James he is fired, unless he is willing to shave some serious cash off the top of each piece of equipment and do what YOU want.
I would find someone else that is willing to listen to your wants and needs and then be willing to do it.
here is my opinion on this whole thing.
You seem to have a lfs/person who is going to sell you a setup the way he wants and only his way. He is going to sell you equipment at a price that is going to make him some money plus he is going to charge you more for doing all this.
It doesn't sound like he is willing to listen to you at all.
My suggestion is to tell James he is fired, unless he is willing to shave some serious cash off the top of each piece of equipment and do what YOU want.
I would find someone else that is willing to listen to your wants and needs and then be willing to do it.
roscoe
Well-known member
OP you have been getting jacked and ripped off by whom ever you have been working with for the last few years!! I've seen your threads you have posted in the past and feel real bad for you. You have been working on these system for years now and the person you have helping you is dragging along the process to milk as much from the cash cow he can. Oh yeah a simple 40b set up that cost $2,311 is rediculous!!! A 40b with all the bells and whistle wont' even come close to that price!!
Those prices he gave you are at least 30% more than where you can get it any where else. If I was you if you. Buy all the equipment yourself. You will save yourself a whole lot of money and then just pay him or someone else which would be best for the labor to install everything.
Those prices he gave you are at least 30% more than where you can get it any where else. If I was you if you. Buy all the equipment yourself. You will save yourself a whole lot of money and then just pay him or someone else which would be best for the labor to install everything.
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Well said,
Ive been watching theses threads as well, for over three years and have tried to help. Its painful to see. Ive had three complete systems set up, grown in and torn down in the same time these professionals have been working for you.
OldManOfTheSea
Well-known member
fiin, I not mind spend big bucks on high quality equipment, but so far in the three I listed here early on that I would save somewhere near $1,000 and there are so many other equipment to check out, im almost afraid to see how much more he is willing to squeeze me dry. I want to get together equipment equal in size to the MH reflectors and so and buy them myself and if they cost what he listed his ideas with, that I can deal with, I want top of the line equipment. I will in no way agree what he wants to do and take more then double the cost he would get himself.
Jacked and ripped off would be correct, but this is also the reason why I post his quote in a few forums, for when I first look at it, it would sound like im getting totally the best, that is BS if you all excuse my expression. For I figured that what I don`t see, others here will see for me.
Im not afraid to spend for what I want here, and it matters not how long it will take, but it will however be less costly to me if I was to buy what a large group of marine specialist in a number of different forum links, that all or most agree, it will be what I would want, I think that this would be the only way.
trido, I really began questioning James professionalism at the start when he first suggested two internal pumps and his feelings were hurt by my turning it down, I certainly knew that I didn`t want those.
I thank you fellas
Buddy
Jacked and ripped off would be correct, but this is also the reason why I post his quote in a few forums, for when I first look at it, it would sound like im getting totally the best, that is BS if you all excuse my expression. For I figured that what I don`t see, others here will see for me.
Im not afraid to spend for what I want here, and it matters not how long it will take, but it will however be less costly to me if I was to buy what a large group of marine specialist in a number of different forum links, that all or most agree, it will be what I would want, I think that this would be the only way.
trido, I really began questioning James professionalism at the start when he first suggested two internal pumps and his feelings were hurt by my turning it down, I certainly knew that I didn`t want those.
I thank you fellas
Buddy
jrgilles
Well-known member
hey buddy, feel bad these guys are taking your for a ride. Seems very uncool. I wish I was in your area so I could help you out.
I agree with what has been posted here. Order as many pieces yourself, and get good quality stuff. There are plenty of people online who can help direct you if you don't have questions.
Once you have the bulk of the equipment, you can pay someone to finish it off by buying anything you missed and hooking it all up.
Seems like you could just take that quote and refill it out with the equip you want without the huge markup.
Too bad the guys you are working with are being like this.
Do you have a local reef forum where you can get someone on the job that isn't out to screw you?
Best of luck with this all. Its going to be awesome once you get it all going. If I'm ever in your neck of the woods I might have to stop by and check it out
rob
I agree with what has been posted here. Order as many pieces yourself, and get good quality stuff. There are plenty of people online who can help direct you if you don't have questions.
Once you have the bulk of the equipment, you can pay someone to finish it off by buying anything you missed and hooking it all up.
Seems like you could just take that quote and refill it out with the equip you want without the huge markup.
Too bad the guys you are working with are being like this.
Do you have a local reef forum where you can get someone on the job that isn't out to screw you?
Best of luck with this all. Its going to be awesome once you get it all going. If I'm ever in your neck of the woods I might have to stop by and check it out
rob
