ICH in the reef tank

[bigdave]

Did you ever try reading the articles that I linked to? It will seperate fact from fiction.

Terry B

Great reading Terry Thanks for the Links. Dave

 

[Terry B]

Hi Dave,

I am happy that you enjoyed the articles. I should give you a "heads up" and tell you that several years ago using Coral Vital for ich was popular. It faded out because it doesn't work for that. If you seem to have had success with it then I would suggest that there were other factors involved. I have talked to at least 100 people that tried it for ich over the years. That is my opinion.

Cheers,
Terry B

 

[FishyinKy]

The pet store I help has been successfully battling ich with the use of diatom filters and diatonaceous (sp sorry) earth. Many stores have gone to quarantines with copper systems. Also there is the uv filter. I would also recomment the use of vitamins like selcon and garlic. I would be extremely worried about medicating a reef tank. Sometimes cleaner shrimp get lazy and if you rearrange the tank and give them an overhang that seems to get them started cleaning again. I really believe in quarantine tanks. To the point where i quarantine everything 8 weeks personally. If you absolutely cannot quarantine at least try to freshwater dip before it goes into your tank. Hope that helps
Mac

 

[NaH2O]

Hey Mac!

I was looking through Terry's articles on Ich, and here is what I found regarding UV Sterilizers and Freshwater dipping (News from the Warfront with Cryptocaryon irritans - Part four of Five). Now these are in regards to "treatments", but I would think it could apply to incoming fish, as well?

Ultra violet sterilizers can help prevent the spread of infection between aquariums in a multi-tank system. When an ultra violet sterilizer is placed in the water flow between tanks in a multi-tank system it can eradicate theronts before they can spread into the next aquarium. However, UV lights are less effective at eliminating infection within a single aquarium. Free-swimming theronts can exit tomonts and infect fish before passing through an ultra violet sterilizer. This means that the parasite will continue its cycle life cycle within that aquarium (Gratzek, et al., 1983). Gratzek's study was performed with freshwater "ick" Ichthyophthirius multifiliis, but it is also believed to apply to Cryptocaryon irritans.

Freshwater dips are largely ineffective in the treatment of Cryptocaryon irritans (Burgess, 1992). The host epidermis and thick layer of mucus form a barrier impervious to osmotic shock (Colorni, 1985). "Most of the trophonts whose hosts had undergone hyposalinity treatment, including freshwater, for at least 18 h, were still alive and occupied the same position in the host by the end of the experiment, following re-adaptation to sea water. They later dropped from the fish, encysted, and the tomonts produced tomites" (Colorni, 1985).

Note that the above quote says "most" and not all trophonts. Trophonts embed themselves completely into the epithelium under a layer of skin. This protects these trophonts from dips. As the trophonts grow in size they gradually displace the overlying epithelium. This is when they become visible as white spots or nodules. Exposed trophonts may be susceptible to freshwater dips, but trophonts that survive continue in their life cycle making this method only partially effective at best.

Freshwater dips can cause osmotic shock. Typically the fish are exposed to the air during the process of capture, handling and transfer, all of which are stressful to the fish. Freshwater dips cannot be depended on as the sole method of treatment for Cryptocaryon irritans and can be counterproductive because they are highly stressful to the fish. They should only be used in combination with other treatments that will successfully interrupt the parasite's life cycle.

 

[bigdave]

Hi Dave,

I am happy that you enjoyed the articles. I should give you a "heads up" and tell you that several years ago using Coral Vital for ich was popular. It faded out because it doesn't work for that. If you seem to have had success with it then I would suggest that there were other factors involved. I have talked to at least 100 people that tried it for ich over the years. That is my opinion.

Cheers,
Terry B

Maybe I just got lucky for once :lol: Thanks for the info I also have a real good lfs who holds all my stuff for a couple of weeks in there coper tanks. I think I meet you there before at the Sharks Reef. Good to see you on here. Thanks Dave

 

[FishyinKy]

Hey Nikki, always a pleasure! I have to say, I have been dipping saltwater fish in freshwater for over 20 years and have yet to have one go into shock. You have to properly adjust ph and temperature of course. I watch the fish very closely for signs of distress. And I have found it a very effective way to get rid of ich and mutliple other parasites including flukes. We also use many other methods to get rid of ich some of which have been mentioned here but honestly I have found a freshwater dip very effective. Personally I prefer quarantine but if you don't quarantine you are taking a large risk simply by putting the fish into the tank. As for UV filters they've been used by stores and multiple people for years as a way to get rid of ich. Personally I think people need to explore all the alternatives. Hyposalinity also works very effectively if done slowly and cautiously and over an extended period of time. I have seen ick stopped simply by using cleaner shrimps as well. But I still believe it lingers in tanks. And Steve, I hate hate hate hate hate ich/ick as well. I'm not trying to go against Terry's advice but speaking simply from my experiences.
Mac

 

[Abissus]

I have been wondering about this, how to raise pH in freshwater? As a matter of fact how to do that with saltwater? I am talking about raising pH alone and not alkalinity as well. I have SeaChem Reef Builder that raises alkalinity (for saltwater at least), but not sure if it'd raise pH to 8.3 or not.

Thanks.

 

[wrightme43]

Seachems reef buffer raises ph to 8.3. Mac your cool, your always cool. This as I am sure you know is a place to share ideas and opinions. I learn from everybody. I am glad that you drop in here too. I have found just for me, that if I quar every fish for at least 2 weeks, and if I see any ick I treat it with copper, and then after seeing none, I give it 4 weeks. When I do this I dont even think about getting ick. Ick is like Wal-Mart to me. Insidious, and evil. LOL Steve

 

[Fokkerdmr]

I bit the bullet this weekend and pulled out 120 lbs of rock to catch my damsels, ailing wrasse, watchman goby, coral beauty and lawnmower blenny. They've all gone to the hospital for hyposalinity treatment of ich per recommendations at: http://www.marineaquariumadvice.com/aquarium_fish_3.html. The coral beauty had one large tomont on it which evidently hatched into a zillion of them and subsequently re-infected the coral beauty with 20-30 tomonts. So, hopefully some careful treatment for 3 weeks plus 100% quarantine of any new fish will eradicate this nasty problem.

 

[wrightme43]

You are on the way Dave. Death to ick. Steve