Jiddy Needs Help, goto Chat!

[spongebob lover]

sorry Nikki, but what is hyposalinity?
i was starting to read that thread but i still don't get what's hyposalinity?

 

[NaH2O]

The prefix Hypo- means below normal. Hyposalinity treatment is when you lower the salinity to about 14 ppt. It is important to use a refractometer with this treatment because you want to make sure your salinity is low enough to be effective, and a hydrometer could have error enough that the salinity isn't low enough. It is also important to not introduce anything from the display to the QT during hyposalinity conditions, or else you will have to start the period in hyposalinity over. Same goes for introducing new stock to QT during that time. The hyposalinity start time is when the salinity drops to 14ppt, then after the 4 week period (I believe that's what it is...need to double check that), slowly increase salinity to normal 35ppt over the course of a week, then keep the fish in the normal salinity conditions for another week. At that point it should be good to go in the display.

Hope that helps clarify?

 

[spongebob lover]

thank you so much Nikki, i didn't know that this could help a lot the fish to bad i didn't know about this when i had bubbles (yt)

 

[My2heartboys]

well right now the lights are off, but i can see she's still breathing heavy

Can you tell what's wrong with her???

Anne

 

[spongebob lover]

Thank you so much for asking Anne but my clown fish is fine now,
That day i was doing some iodine dipping for my zoos and it kind of affected my clownfish because she started breathing heavy that's why i was trying to reach Elmo.
I just did a water change and the next day she was breathing normal .

 

[My2heartboys]

Thank you so much for asking Anne but my clown fish is fine now,
That day i was doing some iodine dipping for my zoos and it kind of affected my clownfish because she started breathing heavy that's why i was trying to reach Elmo.
I just did a water change and the next day she was breathing normal .

Can you tell what caused the problem? Excess iodine, poor water movement on top? I recently had two of my clowns die and the skunk clown was breathing hard for quite a few days before it happened. Then I left for two nights over thanksgiving---and came back to two dead fish in my tank. I am trying to figure if it was ich, poor water movement on top, excess iodine (I do dose this but do not have a test kit for it. I thought I was being careful with it---but maybe not careful enough.).

Not too long ago I replaced the clown fish with two blenny's (cute little buggers for fish) and I think the bi-color blenny may have ich. I have gotten a cleaner shrimp and am using garlic in the tank. I have not moved any of the fish to a qt tank because so far the blue damsel (which was swimming around happily the day I found the two dead fish). I have a ten gallon tank that I could put all three fish in--but not set up to run it yet. Need to get a bigger penguin biowheel----as well as find a place to put it.

Will ich infect crabs?

Anne

 

[spongebob lover]

ohh woou Anne :shock: .
This is what happened, i filled a bucket with 3 gals of water and put 1 drop of iodine in there, so then i started dipping most of my rocks since half of my tank is almost full of zoos :doubt: grr and then i put them back in the tank.

Sunday night we were talking about it and if i remember what everyone said is that the oidine didn't cause any reaction on the clownfish but moving the rocks around probably cause some sort of reaction on the clownfish.
i don't dose iodine because i don't need it and i also don't have the test kit for it .

But i think you should definetly get one since your dosing and see where you are at
i'm not sure if ich can infect crabs and that's a good question... i hope someone can resond that one

 

[My2heartboys]

ohh woou Anne :shock: .
This is what happened, i filled a bucket with 3 gals of water and put 1 drop of iodine in there, so then i started dipping most of my rocks since half of my tank is almost full of zoos :doubt: grr and then i put them back in the tank.

Sunday night we were talking about it and if i remember what everyone said is that the oidine didn't cause any reaction on the clownfish but moving the rocks around probably cause some sort of reaction on the clownfish.
i don't dose iodine because i don't need it and i also don't have the test kit for it .

But i think you should definetly get one since your dosing and see where you are at
i'm not sure if ich can infect crabs and that's a good question... i hope someone can resond that one

Will ich infect crabs and snails?

 

[spongebob lover]

you know for some reason my heart tells me they can't, i think the only ones that can get infected are shrimps because they get on the fish and eat the ich, but i doubt a snail or a crab can get it... but let's see if someone says different.

 

[My2heartboys]

you know for some reason my heart tells me they can't, i think the only ones that can get infected are shrimps because they get on the fish and eat the ich, but i doubt a snail or a crab can get it... but let's see if someone says different.

Great--so if I decide to put the fish in the qt tank--then the shrimps also have to go in. Correct????

 

[spongebob lover]

well from what i've been reading first if your fishes have ich you gotta think what method you are gonna be doing
fresh water dip, hyposalinity (i'd recomend reading the link Nikki post), or using meds (i don't recomend it because that's like killing other things)
I don't think you need to move your shrimps and if i was you i'd keep them in your tank and jsut put the fishes in the quarantine.

 

[My2heartboys]

well from what i've been reading first if your fishes have ich you gotta think what method you are gonna be doing
fresh water dip, hyposalinity (i'd recomend reading the link Nikki post), or using meds (i don't recomend it because that's like killing other things)
I don't think you need to move your shrimps and if i was you i'd keep them in your tank and jsut put the fishes in the quarantine.

So if (and I do mean if at this point) I remove the fish and put them in qt and then just keep the main tank up to keep the inverts happy--once I see that the fish have gone without spots for 4 weeks and then return the fish to tank--it would be OK?

Anne

 

[spongebob lover]

yeah if your fishes are not scratching, are eating good, and swimming around yes i'd put them back in IMO.

 

[mungus]

Will ich infect crabs and snails?

No ich will only infect your fish.

then the shrimps also have to go in. Correct????

I would not use hyposalinity or meds on shrimp.

once I see that the fish have gone without spots for 4 weeks and then return the fish to tank--it would be OK?

If you are using hyposalinity Nikki describes how long they should be in QT earlier in the thread.

Brian

 

[NaH2O]

So if (and I do mean if at this point) I remove the fish and put them in qt and then just keep the main tank up to keep the inverts happy--once I see that the fish have gone without spots for 4 weeks and then return the fish to tank--it would be OK?

Anne

Anne - I'm not sure if you mean 4 weeks in a hyposalinity treatment, or 4 weeks in regular salinity in a QT. Just because a fish doesn't have spots on it does not mean the infection has gone (without treatment). On post #20 in this thread, I have 5 articles about ich. Article #3 talks about different treatment methods, so you might want to read it and see what will work out best for you. Hyposalinity is a good treatment (fish only...no inverts), but you really should read up on it (or any treatment for that matter) before you dive into it. If they aren't done correctly, then you may reinfect the display. If you choose a method of treatment, post up what you are going to do, so we can follow and offer advice or support along the way.

Also, it is not scientifically documented, at least according to this article, that cleaner shrimp are actually removing parasites from the fish. Here is a portion of an article on Cleaner Shrimp from Coral Realm

It has long been assumed that these crustaceans ingest parasites and dead tissue. However, there is little information in the scientific literature that actually confirms that they eat parasites. There is one study that demonstrated that Pederson's cleaner shrimp (P. pedersoni) removed juvenile cymothoid isopods from fish hosts. (These researchers did not observe Periclimenes grabhami, Stenopus hispidus, and S. scutellatus removing any parasites, although anecdotal observations suggest that they do.) Cleaner shrimps will also "graze" on the fish's body slime and may ingest bits of fin. The shrimp will pick at the fish's body surface, under the gill covers and in the mouth. The client seems to "enjoy" the tactile stimulation provided by strokes of the antennae and antennules. This reinforces the posing behavior of the client.

So next time your on a coral reef, slow down and look for these cleaner crustaceans!

 

[My2heartboys]

Anne - I'm not sure if you mean 4 weeks in a hyposalinity treatment, or 4 weeks in regular salinity in a QT. Just because a fish doesn't have spots on it does not mean the infection has gone (without treatment). On post #20 in this thread, I have 5 articles about ich. Article #3 talks about different treatment methods, so you might want to read it and see what will work out best for you. Hyposalinity is a good treatment (fish only...no inverts), but you really should read up on it (or any treatment for that matter) before you dive into it. If they aren't done correctly, then you may reinfect the display. If you choose a method of treatment, post up what you are going to do, so we can follow and offer advice or support along the way.

Also, it is not scientifically documented, at least according to this article, that cleaner shrimp are actually removing parasites from the fish. Here is a portion of an article on Cleaner Shrimp from Coral Realm

Yeah, I meant with hypo salinity. I am still busy reading though and yes, your articles are on the list. Right now I am trying to wade through three different threads and it is slow going.

Anne

 

[My2heartboys]

Jiddy - hyposalinity is the best way, IMO, to totally get rid of ich. If you do this, then all fish need to be in QT for the hyposalinity treatment, while the display is without fish for several weeks. This will ensure the end of the parasite's life cycle, as there aren't fish to complete the cycle. Another method (see article #3 below) is the transfer method, where fish are transferred back and forth between 2 hospital tanks every 3rd day for 4 transfers. The tank not in use gets cleaned and dried out in the meantime, and the life cycle of the parasite is interrupted.

News from the Warfront with Cryptocaryon irritans - Part One of Five
News from the Warfront with Cryptocaryon irritans - Part Two of Five
News from the Warfront with Cryptocaryon irritans - Part Three of Five
News from the Warfront with Cryptocaryon irritans - Part Four of Five
News from the Warfront with Cryptocaryon irritans - Part Five of Five

Nikki, I'm a little confused. I have been told that ich cannot infect my snails, crabs, urchin, or shrimp so it would be OK to leave them in the tank while taking my fish out to a qt and start doing the hypo salinity treatment. Yet in reading part 1 of that series it specifically says that unless you put everthing through a treatment of some sorts---the tank will stay infested.

Which is correct???

Anne

 

[NaH2O]

Anne - inverts do not get infected with ich, however, they may be carrying part of the life cycle (tomonts or cysts). BUT, the parasite needs fish to complete its life cycle, so if the tank was without fish for the entire period, then eventually the inverts would no longer be carrying that stage of the parasite. So, the life cycle will be interrupted. Make sense? It is a good idea to QT everything when you get it, and that is a part of the reason. You could theoretically introduce some tomonts or cysts without QT, if the stock has come from a place where inverts are on the same system with infected fish. Here is a quote (or two) from the first article:

Hard surfaces such as sand, rock, glass, equipment and even some invertebrates (invertebrates do not become infected) can serve as attachment sites for tomonts (Burgess, 1992). If any of these objects are removed from an infected tank or system and placed into another aquarium they may carry some tomonts or cysts.

If the system that an invertebrate, piece of live rock, or live sand originates from is infected, it may be necessary to quarantine these items before they are moved into a display containing fish.

 

[My2heartboys]

Thank You Nikki. I will focus on getting the qt tank up and going and reading the articles when I can sit for a moment.

 

[aquariumdebacle]

The only thing that works for ich 100% is copper and QUARENTING!. Dropping the salinity is not absolutely effective and it is dangerous to the fish. Anything below 1.017 specific gravity is pressing your luck. I recommended it and they brought it down to 1.010 and the only thing that lived was a spine cheek and he developed spots when the salinity was brought up (slowly) a month later.

A method that I am interested in but have not had a chance to try is moving the fish every two days for a week to a clean sterile container. That way the trophonts can drop off and not have a chance to reinfest the host(s).