Juvi Blueline Angel (C.septentrionalis )

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Staff Housemonkey
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Hello Lee,

I recently purchased a tiny (1.25 inch nose to tail) Blue lined Angelfish, (Chaetodeontoplus septentrionalis) from Live Aquaria's Diver's Den. I've long admired this fish and when I saw this one on the Diver's Den for a two week period I decided to give it a go.

I spoke to the caretakers over in the facility where the fish was being kept before ordering it to have some more information about the fish. According to them, the fish had been in their care since early June, had been frehwater bathed twice, (I'm guessing flukes), and had been in a copper treated system for 3 weeks. I was assured it was eating mysis and spirolina enriched brine shrimp with gusto.

The fish arrived in good condition, (no sunken areas behind the head or above the lateral line indicating malnutrition or starvation), and was very curious and acting like I expect a healthy angelfish to behave.

I drip acclimated the fish for about 90 minutes and then placed it into a 20H QT tank. The tank contains two pieces of liverock from my sump, (sponge growing on it), some PVC fittings, and about 5 bioballs from my sump as well. Circulation is achieved via HOB Aqua-Clear filter with no media or sponge etc to collect detritus, its just there for water movement.

The fish picked at the liverock somewhat, but did not eat the two highly visible pieces of white lace sponge growing on the surface of it.

After 24 hours, I attempted to feed it frozen Hikari Mysid shrimp, and spirolina enriched brine shrimp (frozen as well). the fish showed excitement by immediately pacing the tank in an attempt to locate the source of food, but did not touch anything.

I tried Rod's Food, the Hikari Mysid, Enriched Brine Shrimp, Arcti-Pods, Fresh thawed scallop, Spectrum New Life Balance Flake and mini pellets, and Formula 1 & 2 small pellets. All were soundly ignored.

After 48 hours of the fish not eating anything, but still seeing excitement from the fish when I introduced food, I went ahead and moved a firefish I've had for about a year into the QT with the Angel. The idea was to use the Firefish as a dither fish to "teach" the angel what the other sources of food were.

I then also placed Nori on a clip in the tank in the hopes the fish would graze on that.

No luck on any of the prepared foods, but the Nori was nibbled on constantly by the little angel.

I've had the fish for 5 days now, and its still only grazing on Nori. Its eating enough to make its little belly plump, but I wonder about the long term health of the fish due to its small size, and eating solely Nori. Its eating something already, so that makes me confidant I can switch it to other sources of food.

I remember the invaluable assistance you gave me with my Regal Angel severl years ago. As of November 23rd, I'll have had her for 4 years. She now eats just about everything I put in the tank.

I'm guessing based on the responses I'm getting with frozen food that fish was being fed live mysis and live gut loaded brine. Can you think of another meaty food source I try with this tiny angel?

I just added fresh Nori and stuck two small strips of freshly thawed Scallop next to it thinking that the constant exposure to scallop, right next to a "known" food source might provoke some curious nibbling, but nothing so far...

My experiance with Regal Angels has led me to believe that it takes about a year for the fish to become fully acclimated and comfortable enough to become an aggressive eater. From what I've read, these angels tend to be aggressive eaters early on...It definately likes the Nori, but doesnt seem to hardcore about other food items as of yet.

Since the fish is so small, (and I really think 1.25 inches is being generous size wise, this is a tiny fish...it looks like a dime with fins), do I really need to be as concerned about it only eating Nori for a short while, or is it a non issue since its eating something and behaving normally?

Thanks Lee,

Nick
 
Hi Nick,

I remember your Regal. Glad to hear it's doing well. Also glad to hear this fish is in quarantine. From what I can tell from your post, you've done just about everything right. These Angels are usually imported at about 3"+ so finding one so small is really unusual. Can you really trust the LFS? I mean, did you see the fish eating in their store?

You are right in that these fishes are good eaters. Despite their expense and the fact they are of the Large Angel category, they are good eaters. I've never had one that didn't do well -- even the one I got from China. They are usually picky about the size of the food until they start eating voraciously, so be conscious of trying different sizes of foods. You might even try newly hatched brine shrimp (live) and if you can get them, young adult brine shrimp (live). I would also suggest the following:

1) Get a couple of small living clams (from your seafood store). Wash them well and freeze them 48 hours. They will open a bit. Thaw one. Open it and wash it out with distilled or your best source water. Drop it open into the tank and leave it there for a few hours, see if it has any interest in that.

2) Do a huge water change -- over 85%, following the guidelines given in the water change post.

3) If might be getting too used to the Nori, start varying/changing the macro algae colors (get some packaged macro sea algae and try the red first, which many Large Angels do prefer). If it eats it, slowly decrease the amount you offer and continue to urge other foods.


After the above, its just waiting it out and hoping it 'comes around' to live up to its reputation. Keep in mind it isn't so much the kind of food. When it does start to eat, it will.

I don't much like the drip method for these fishes, but that is done. Be ready to de-worm the fish when and if it starts eating.

:)
 
Thanks for the info Lee.

I live in St louis Mo, and live clams arent available (AFAIK), so I'll have to keep working at getting it onto other food sources.

How did your Blueline Angels do with clams and soft corals,(zoas)?

My Regal used to ignore both clams and soft corals, and then one day last year, those items became part of the acceptable menu. I found this out after providing it with some expensive Zoas I'd just purchased...she snarfed em down very quickly.

Nick
 
Nick, I'm sorry to hear yours isn't accepting frozen. I don't know if it was because I started the fish off with my regal and green chromis that it started eating right away or not, but it eats with gusto. It doesn't seem to like the frozen mussel that the regal eats now however. It does have a bunch of little white fuzzy spots on it and I don't know if this was due to adding a fish I got from nook that was sitting in his sump for a while in the dark as he had the same white spots on him. I don't think it's ich as I don't see the fish scratching. Even with this the fish still eats very well. It nibbled at some chalice I had in the tank and I think it was eating some plain jane zoas that were in there as well before I took them out and dropped the salinity.
 
Nick,

By the time my Blues came out of QT they were already eating pretty much everything. I put in a clam (as previously described) about once a month as an in-between-meal snack. The Blue would do its usual 'pick' at it and rip off small bits. But it and almost all my fishes would prefer my own homemade.

As mentioned before, it really isn't just the food, it's when the fish decides to start eating and, by coincidence what it is being fed. Many hobbyists will claim, 'Oh my fish started to eat when I fed it xxxx' but it isn't the xxxx, it was just that that was the time the fish decided to eat.

I never kept marine fishes with immobile invertebrates, so I really can't help you there. On many start up tanks, there'd be corals growing on the live rock, but after my fish started to come in, it and the pods would all disappear. :)
 
Daniel,

I'm not too worried right now about the angel only eating Nori. Its pretty determined to devour the nori from the clip. I'm pretty sure its just a matter of time before it begins to be more open with its eating habits. My main concern was malnutrition since it is so small. I'm on midnight shift right now which makes it tough to get much accomplished. I'm off tomorrow night so I'll probably make a run to the grocery store and pick up some more seafood for different feeding attempts. I'm also going to thaw and then dice some PE Mysis in the hopes that might work. I tried the Hikari mysid's since they are smaller in size than the PE Mysis, but if I cut the PE Mysis up maybe that will make a difference.

Lee, thanks for all the help. I will try and locate some live clams here locally.

Nick
 
Its doing pretty good so far. Its still only eating Nori, buts fat and begining to show the first little portions of the blue lines of adult hood. Right now, it looks like it has two tiny electric blue spots behind the gill plate.

Nick
 
Lee,

I thought I'd give you an update.

I've had the little angel since Aug 17th, (Almost 2.5 months). Its gotten larger, and is definately showing the blue lines these guys are famous for. It was moved out of QT about 3 weeks ago into a 58 gallon tank currently occupied by a firefish, a pair of Percula clowns, an H.magnifica anemone that I've kept for a year now, an H.crispa anemone I've had for 4 years or so, a porcelein crab, and a bunch of small zoa and lps frags.

So far its still only eating Nori from the clip, but I have seen it nip at shrimp scraps I feed the LPS frags. Of course I've also seen it nip at some of my zoa frags as well, so not real thrilled about that, but I'm willing to lose some frags for the greater good of the fish.

I thought I'd post some pics...these are crappy point and shoot pics, I'm not a photographer, so bear with me...

What it looked like on the website:

South_China_Sea_Blueline_Angel_Juvi_1_25_inch_08-15-11.jpg


Sorta looks like it had some parasites on it originally....

When I got it and was acclimating:

8-17-11_1.jpg


8-17-11_2.jpg


In QT, just beginning to get the blue stripes....small electric blue spot behind the gill plate. About 5 days after I got it:

8-22-11_1.jpg


8-22-11_2.jpg


8-22-11_3.jpg


Today....

IMG_1063-1.jpg


IMG_1067-1.jpg


It hasnt grown much, maybe another quarter of an inch....but the change in color is amazing in such a short time. Sorry for the craptastic photos, but you get the idea, and they show the change in coloration at least.

The overall goal is to eventually upgrade to a 250 gallon tank and house both the Blue Line and my Regal in the tank...I wont mix them until then, the Regal is just too bossy.


Anyway, just wanted to give you an update Lee.

Nick
 
Awesome nick, that's how mine started to look too. Unfortunately, whatever was wrong with it I could never get to go away and the fish just dissappeared one day. Although I will say for your sake that my regal never bothered it until its stripes started coming in, then the regal would occasionally chase the blueline around. Good luck with the feeding still!
 
nick,

thanks for the update...I always thought of a regal angel as timid/shy, and not one to chase other fish...learned something new...
 
Thanks for the update Nick. I like hearing back on how things are moving along.
 
Thanks Daniel, Kirk, and Lee!

Kirk,

The Regal wasnt always bossy. It took her about 2 years to decide she was in charge.

Nick
 
They're definately a weird fish IMO.

It took both of mine about a year to decide to become aggressive/comfortable eaters. And about a year after that for my Indo-Pacific Regal to decide to take over the tank. Every other angelfish I've ever kept has tried to become the boss of the tank as soon as possible.

Nick
 
I'll try to take some here soon. Its still got the juvi yellow in the face, but the markings in the face are starting to show up.

Its going to be a pretty fish as it gets bigger.

Nick
 
Sorry this took so long, been busy.

These pics are further proof that I need a macro lense for my SLR and that I'm not a photographer.

All pics from 01-06-2012

IMG_1355-1.jpg


IMG_1360-1.jpg


The tank it's in is older and has some scrapes and scratches in it, that's showing up distorting the body and face of the fish. Sorry...

IMG_1361-1.jpg


IMG_1365-1.jpg


IMG_1366-1.jpg


Nick
 
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