Lanthanum Chloride

[DonW]

Bommer,

Would you help me understand this stuff. My thinking is if you dosed this to a measure of tank water then pushed that water through a low micron filter it would trap all or most of the Lanthanum Chloride pricip / P.

Sound right??

Don

 

[Curtswearing]

Awesome question Don.....tagging along.

 

[LakeEd]

Don,

I understand from my quick research that Lanthanum Chloride would be a very good bonder of phosphates in water, but with this being one of those "rare earth metals"... not sure for a hobbyist the possibility of "writhing, ataxia, labored respiration, walking on the toes with arched back and sedation" (symptoms of toxicity) are really worth it???

Just tossing out ideas and thoughts...hoping to learn along with everyone else.

 

[DonW]

Don,

I understand from my quick research that Lanthanum Chloride would be a very good bonder of phosphates in water, but with this being one of those "rare earth metals"... not sure for a hobbyist the possibility of "writhing, ataxia, labored respiration, walking on the toes with arched back and sedation" (symptoms of toxicity) are really worth it???

Just tossing out ideas and thoughts...hoping to learn along with everyone else.

Its been used in the hobby for a long time. Its just not very popular. If you check around most of the liquid P removers sitting on the shelf are Lanthanum Chloride. Its also used in pools and spa's, I use it in the winter when my hot tub isnt getting alot of use.

Don

 

[Herefishyfishy]

http://www.patentstorm.us/patents/6846432-description.html

 

[DonW]

There are are a couple brands out there po4 minus and blue line seem to be the most commonly stocked.

Don

 

[Boomer]

I have not doubt Don that wold work. Here is some info for you on how it workd and why your idea would work.

Lanthanum chloride heptahydrate has been used for many years by various private and commercial institutionshere in the United States and abroad, to remove high levels of orthophosphates from fresh and brackish water systems (Disney World and Sea World of Orlando, Florida – information provided by request only), as well as the recreational pooland spa industry for over 20 years. Industry wide application rates have been denoted that lanthanum bonds to orthophosphate at a ratio of 1:1. Simply stated, it takes 1ppm lanthanum to remove 1ppm orthophosphate from water. As dry weight, this equates to 16 pounds of 35% lanthanum chloride heptahydrate to remove 1ppm orthophosphate (PO43) from 1-acre foot of water. This ionic attraction takes place within several seconds of contact of the lanthanum and the orthophosphate in both the water column and/or sediment. Lanthanum retains ionic bonding at pH levels between 5 and 11, making it highly useable in most water systems for orthophosphate reduction. The lanthanum acts as a flocculent, capturing the orthophosphate and settling to the lake or stream floor, or in recirculating system, being trapped for removal by mechanical filtration. Once bonded, it removes the orthophosphate from utilization by both microbial and algal species. Unless exposed to highly acidic or alkaline waters, the ionic bond will not release. As lanthanum has an ionic bonding level comparable to sodium, lanthanum will also bond and flocculate carbonate (CO3), arsenic, selenium, and chromium. Application rates can vary due to the presence of these other minerals. Lanthanum is widely used in Japan to remove both arsenic V and arsenic X from freshwater drinking supplies (Water Environment Research, Vol. 71, pp. 299-306,1999. S. Tokunaga, S. Yokoyama, and S.A. Wasay) meeting the Japanese Effluent and Drinking Water Standards, by treating at a 3:1 ratio of lanthanum to arsenic.

However, Randy thinks it may be better to use lanthanum carbonate. Lanthanum chloride is a soluble form, the carbonate is a mostly insoluble solid. Some of the media forms are this stuff. But, from what I found out long ago, when this was brought up ump-teen times, is that both may cause clouding of the water and increasing turbidity. The only big worry about Lanthanum is its toxicty..........we dont' known.

Also to add Lanthanum chloride dissociates in water and binds with phosphate to form Lanthanum phosphate, an insoluble salt. It may also produce some Lanthanum carbonate. So, keep an eye on Alk because it is seawater and not FW or a brackish system.

Here is our biggest thread on it and pretty much covers all one needs to know
http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=990723

 

[DonW]

So any clue on what size micron filter would remove the precip? I think the one in my hot tub is 100 micron but not sure.

Don

 

[Boomer]

I would try 10 microns. 100 is huge = .1 mm. Very fiine sand is 100 microns. But maybe try 50 microns first, that is silt size.

 

[DonW]

I would try 10 microns. 100 is huge = .1 mm. Very fiine sand is 100 microns. But maybe try 50 microns first, that is silt size.

Cool thanks those are easy and cheap.

Don