Long Range Weapons

[ClamLubber]

ANTHONY!!!! What a busy lad you are. I linked over here from WWM and now have 2 favorite sites. I am researching diligently for my new set up and have read your reef propagation book and NMA:invertabrates. Thanks for your hard work in both as well as moderating this section. I am reentering the hobby after about 8 dry years and your books have really helped fill in the gaps.

I have a Wall O' Tanks at the end of the finished basement which have finished cycling. The reef display is 75gal. Above it is a 55 (fish only). Beside each is a 25gal(FOLR). I have 2 filtration systems in the "room" behind the tanks along with sink, and soon to build a rack for 3 or 4 20gal tanks for QT and water prep for weekly water changes. I am currently using trickle filters but have tanks awaiting pickup at the LFS to turn into refugium/sump for each system. Currently the 55 and 2x 25 tanks are on one filtration system and the "Reef" is on its own system. I was planning on an anemone and clown as the sole occupants of the lower 25gal but after reading about the importance of water quality for anemone I am thinking about replumbing it to share the sump with the Reef rather than the fish systems. The reef system has ozone and Ca reactor that the fish system will lack. Both have skimmers and will soon have Refuges with DSB and algae farms. Will add pod culture to the reef refuge at least; I figure the anemone would like that too.
Finally the question: Having the anemone in its own tank will isolate it from directly stinging the corals, but will it be able/likely to launch long range chemical attacks of any kind via the shared sump?

 

[ClamLubber]

anyone?... Bueller?....anyone?
After posting I noted Anthony's post about being away to write new books. !!!YAY!!!
Welcome thoughts of any other experienced folks.

BTW I am thinking either bubbletip or sebea anemone, should have said that to start with. No commitments on specific corals for the reef tank yet, but will start with ones noted to be hardy and go from there. LR has just recently finished cure/cycling so likely to add nothing for a few months till LR matures. Can exclude any possibilities that might be highly suseptable to chemical warfare.

 

[shallowreef]

Welcome to Reef Frontiers Clam Lubber

Its been a little quiet on here the past couple of days but i'm sure steve will connect with you sooner or later. Lots of luck on your tankenstein!

 

[Detri]

Welcome to Reef Frontiers!

 

[NaH2O]

Welcome to Reef Frontiers!!!

Hopefully Anthony will be able to answer your question soon, as I'd like to hear his thoughts on plumbing these systems together.

I'm not aware of any "chemical" warfare from anemones. By isolating the anemone to its own system you would be reducing the nematocyst/stinging contact with corals. Do you have any plans of running carbon in the common sump?

 

[ClamLubber]

I've never been big on chronic carbon use (although I do have a bag in line from recent curing that is likely doing little now). I do use Polyfilter pads.
Further note on plumbing since you mention it: will have a Mag5 returning to the 25 (via Anthony-style manifold). A Mag 7 will be pumping to the 75. returns to sump/refuge from each tank will feed to the section with skimmer. The other return from the 75gal will feed an external pump feeding a manifold over that tank to give the rest of the 20x flow.

 

[Anthony Calfo]

cheers, Clamlubber... thanks for your kind words And very goo to have you back in the hobby.

The carbon advice/use is very sound indeed... please do use small portions changed frequently. I promise you it will greatly impriove success in the tank for many reasons, not the least of which is insuring optimal light penetration (saving you money for geting light produced) and reducing the chemical allelopathy you rightly fear with the anemone on the shared system.

Segregating the anemone inline on central filtration helps with allelpathy issues... but not by much. In the Fav links sticky atop this forum there are links to anemone reproduction/propagation threads. One chap ytried to keep and prop three species in the same inline refugium and... sigh... met with the predictable tragedy for doing it.

My advice here for your anemone is to keep a closed dedicated system for it. A species tank

 

[ClamLubber]

Since I'm trying to do it by the book (namely yours, hehe) I'll take your advice then and leave the plumbing like it is except for inserting the refuges. If I see any issues with nitrates from the FO tanks down the road then I'll have to rethink. With the 40 long for the lighted refuge I should be able keep nitrate near zero so long as I keep the population down I'd think. Might add a bit more live rock to the upper systems too. Fortunitly I haven't set up the refuges yet. I might have to rethink layout. :idea: I might be able to squeeze in one more tank for a private refuge/sump for the anemone. If the anemone and clown are to be the only occupants in the 25g and it has a 6" DSB in the display, then a 20gal sump for a bit extra LR, alge, and skimmer (external), and carbon would that be enough system volume?

 

[Anthony Calfo]

If the anemone and clown are to
be the only occupants in the 25g and it has a 6" DSB in the display,
then a 20gal sump for a bit extra LR, alge, and skimmer (external), and
carbon would that be enough system volume

what is your source of biofiltration? Is there live rock in the tank with the anemone... or only the bit in the sump. The DSB alone will not support the anemone bioload with feedings.

 

[ClamLubber]

There is plenty of live rock in the display. I was just doubtfull that that would be enough to support the anemone and clown without an additional amount in the sump. A 20 gal sump is all I have room for if I am going to put that tank all on its own. So if ~40+ total volume will be too small, it would be better to keep that tank on the "fish" system and either proceed with the anemone plan or go with additional "fish" tank there

 

[Anthony Calfo]

isolation from other cnidarians is (always) better for anemones. Your display live rock (at least 20#) in the 20 gall will be enough biofiltration my friend. Usual water quality/water changes in supprt will keep it nicely. Do add the sump rock if you like so long as it does not collect detritus badly.

 

[ReefferMan]

Hello all, i keep rose bud anenome's in my tank with a pair of clowns. I also keep sps and lps moti's ect.. 100lb's of live rock, deep sand bed, 30g sump/fuge with all the uv's and skimmers.... The display is a 125. Anyhow back to the topic, i have seen little or no aggression from the roses toward the sps(I was nervious as hell! ) Ive seen a rose lean toward my lights and touch a delicate sps coral, but it didnt seem to sting it. I try to hand feed them when the clowns alow for that.

Use = pounds of LR to Gallons in your system... i dont like debris in my sump so i dont put any rock in there, just plants....

 

[Anthony Calfo]

reeferman... the issue is long term success. What appears to be tolerance is often just very slow chemical combat. In the case of anemones, it usually leads to them moving in the tank after a while. You need to have or at least advise people on the longview and on likely occurances rather than merely what you've been lucky enough to enjoy, contrary to the masses. Do see the extensive archives on Wetwebmedia.com on this subject (as well as my lengthy posting on RC and other message boards). I have answered hundreds of queries on this subject indicative of a pervasive risk inherent in the mistaken placement. Please don't encourage folks to do this just because you've had good fortune so far It will likely kill more animals than help.