Mandarin Fish

[jrgilles]

Hey guys, I had a couple quick questions about mandarin fish.

I would like to add 1 or 2 of these to my tank at some point. Here is what I was wondering

My system is a 75 display, 20 fuge and 50 sump

1. Is this system big enough to hold 2 mandarins? I would like a mated pair, but I'm a bit dubious that I can support them. (I also have a rainfordi gobi that likes to pick at pods)

2. If I added one male, could a female be added later (or vise versa)? Or do they both need to be added at the same time?

3. My tank has been set up for about 2.5-3 mos now. I have maybe 160-175 lbs of live rock (a lot of it loaded with pods when I added it, as it came from established aquariums, fuge also has a good number of pods.) Am I still way to young to think about putting a mandarin in?

Thanks! I want to get another fish in to add amino acids to my reef tank, and this one is on my list. I want to add small non aggressive ones first, so it seems like a good one to throw in if I can 1)add one now then one later once all is more established and 2)not kill it

cheers, rob

 

[returnofsid]

I believe your tank is definitely large enough, and you have enough live rock, to support 2 Mandarins, WITHOUT any other competition. Unfortunately, the Rainfords Goby may present a problem. However, are your sure your Rainfords Goby is eating your pods? Rainfords are typically more herbivorous fish, almost relying on filamentious algae to graze on.

Another option is to find Mandarins that are already eating frozen, or QT and "train" to eat frozen. This is time consuming, but usually works. They will still need a decent population of natural pods to feed on though.

If you do decide to get any Mandarins, I'd suggest waiting until your tank is a bit more mature. If you decide to get a pair, I'd suggesting adding them together, or adding the female first.

You can also create a couple Pod Piles, in the back corners of your display, or in the refugium. Small pieces of rubble rock, all piles up, in a way that other fish can't get into the pile. This gives the pods a "safe" place to reproduce. As they multiply, some will venture out of the pile. Eventually, this will become a great "hunting ground" for your Mandarins. You might also start populating your refugium with bottled pods, once in awhile, to encourage more multiplication.

 

[jrgilles]

OK, cool. thanks for the reply. I was feeling it was a bit early.

You need to QT to train them onto frozen food? Or can this be done in the DT? Was reading about training them, seems like it might be a good idea, although ideally it would be cool if they could just eat pods.

What do you think about adding phytoplankton to my fuge? Should that increase the pod growth? I got some cheato from a couple sources, so its pretty full of pods and bristleworms right now.

Thanks again for the comment sid

rob

 

[jrgilles]

Oh, I guess I'm not really sure if the goby is eating pods or algae. I read online that they like picking pods out of the filimentous algae, but it could just be eating algae. Sifts sand and picks at the rocks a lot. Guess its hard to tell though

rob

 

[returnofsid]

I believe it's easiest to train them onto prepared foods, in a QT tank, where you have more control over their food source. Otherwise, they'll find pods, have no reason to start eating frozen foods, and then will have to rely on the available pods.

As for Phyto, I wouldn't recommend it. If you currently have pods, then they're finding food. Adding phyto will only pollute your tank.

 

[lvsuckerfish]

I agree with not adding phyto as it will polute the tank if you are feeding corals pods will find a food source and scavange from there.

 

[returnofsid]

Somewhere, I've read a couple great articles/primers, on training Mandarins to eat prepared foods, but as hard as I'm trying, I'm unable to find either one, right now...go figure.

 

[NC2WA]

I agree tank is not mature yet..I would wait until 1yr if not 1.5 yrs..want to get a good pod growth established..the fuge should help you do that.

 

[dragoneggs]

I agree tank is not mature yet..I would wait until 1yr if not 1.5 yrs..want to get a good pod growth established..the fuge should help you do that.

Any specific advice on how to cultivate in the fuge? I plan some chaeto but I have never had a fuge before. I hopefully will be setting up my filter/sump in a couple weeks. Filter is starting to be built this coming week, yeah!

 

[NC2WA]

fuge needs light, water movement, cluster of rocks together, and (obviously) chateo..

to start it off, i put a couple pods from tigger pods, or something similiar..i also feed the fuge with cyclopeeze or DT or something similiar once a week or so...

since my tank is in the garage, my pH is constant and I am able to get away with leaving the light on all nite, otherwise you may need to turn light off at night to avoid ups and downs.

 

[leebca]

Forget trying to cultivate enough pods in your system for Mandarins. Train the Mandarin to eat prepared foods and then be prepared to spot feed them as long as you keep them. If you're not prepared or willing to provide this kind of care, you may want to rethink keeping a pair.

Here is a link which also contains more links on the subjects mentioned above and in previous posts:
Pod Eaters

 

[pogofish]

I have to disagree with some of the posts above. I think a 75 is marginal at best for a single Mandarin, much less two.

 

[ango917]

i have had a mandarin in a 55gal, but i had trained it to eat prepared food, so it was fine. i agree with someone above, that you really have to be patient and dedicated to spot feeding it or it will not thrive. (plus you can't have other aggressive fish, or spot feeding can be very frustrating!)

 

[Bored4ever86]

also if you do get a mandarin i'd go for the female (first if not the only one) I had a "pair" in my 125 and the male, even prior to a female, spent a good amount of time "fighting off his rival" who was his reflection on the inside of the glass. This ended up being his demise as he spent more time attacking his reflection than eating and perished while the female thrived on the tons of pods in the tank. I did have him trained to eat cyclopeeze in QT but once he moved to the 125 it was near impossible to spot feed him and he perished with a large supply of food and was unsaveable by the time i got to him. I miss having my elvis and priscilla RIP

 

[jezzeaepi]

I have a productive fuge, and a 125g display, and Id say there is barely enough pods for my mandarin and leopard wrasse. Both fish would have starved to death long ago if they didn't eat prepared foods as well. For long term care(i.e. measuring your success in terms of years rather then months), id recommend just one pod eater for 75. If you want two pod eaters, do at least a 125. Even then, you WILL have to get them to eat prepared foods as part of their diet, or they will die from starvation/lack of nutrition.

 

[jrgilles]

alright, great info guys. Seems maybe I should do just one. And anyway, also seems that I need to wait a year or so, so I have plenty of time to think about it.

Thanks for all the input

rob

 

[johny99]

I have a very fat manderin in my old 50g (now in my new 110) but I had to get rid of my 6line wrasse. I agree that a single manderin should be able to survive without competition. Multiple manderins is not good. They will starve.

 

[KrautBurner]

what about if you are throwing more pods (tigger pods or other cultivated pods) in the fuge,

maybe a bottle every two months?

 

[leebca]

"More" pods isn't the answer. More food doesn't mean better nutrition. Like -- eating more Twinkies will make you healthier than just eating a few.

Pods have to live on something. The food pods live on in a tank is limited to what's in the tank. So pod populations wax and wane depending on what foods and conditions are found in any given tank.

What is needed is diverse pod population to provide a balanced nutrition. This is pretty much impossible since (as noted above) the tank can only provide a limited amount of nutrition for the pods, and can only sustain certain kinds of pods.

I'm not against keeping pod eaters. . .This whole matter is really easily resolved -- train the pod eater to eat prepared foods. I have kept Mandarins in FO tanks (w/o live rock or pods) for over a decade. It isn't hard, but it takes attention.

Pod Eaters