need help, bad water chemistry?

[goby2004]

not sure where to turn so maybe someone here has some new ideas. Just set up our 240 gallon tank 6 weeks ago and seem to be having some unknown water quality issue. 2 coral banded shrimp molted and died halfway thru molting 2 weeks ago. Added some zooanthids week and a half ago, opened right away and after 3 days never opened since. two sps coral frags put in 7 days ago and are dead now. Sponge seems to be ok, fish are ok, no new coraline algae yet but that is expected. little bit of brown diatom algae, hair algae, no cyno. good current.

tank set up 6 weeks ago with 225 pounds live rock. 50 punds live rock full of copepods, miniature brittle stars put in 3 weeks ago with zooanthids, sponge and full or coraline algae. can't find any copepods and i put a cleaner shrimp in yesterday and he died within minutes!! so it looks deadly to copepods, shrimp, tube worms and ? but not hermit crabs, fish. and ? also have some kenya trees and mushroom polyps that are doing fine...

currently have sailfin tang, 18 1" green chromis, lawnmower blenny, red leg hermits and few snails. these guys are fine.

2 250 watt 20k radium halides 8hours and 2 5' VHO's on for 10 hours per day
Instant ocean salt adjusted to parameters below.
currently running 2 cups carbon

system parameters

340 gallon system, RO/DI water, TDS on output is zero.
all test done with salifert test kits

PH 8.2
calcium 425
magnesium 1300
KH/alkalinity 3.6

rates below again with salifert test kits, undetectable with those kits.
phosphate 0
nitrate 0
ammonia 0
nitirite 0
copper 0

The only thing i can think of that is different is I now use a plastic make-up water bin (150 gallon horse watering tank) covered with styrofoam insulation and a rubber pond liner for my water change and mixed up some of the original water in. I can not find any evidence of toxicity from that but?

Any of you Wizards out there have any ideas what might be the problem?

I know first advice will be water change but I need to understand what is wrong or I may just be putting more bad into it. I have 125 gallons water change ready to go.

 

[Boomer]

Well, I don't see any issue with the horse (often used with no liner), styro or pond liner. However, where was this pond liner from/ stored ? Was it new, old was it cleaned before you used it. Where did this styro come from ? Was it clean ? Has it ever be exposed to chemicals that could get wetted on the down side, causing them to drip into the horse ? Lastly, where did this water come from that was put in th tank, tap, well, RO, RO/DI ?

 

[goby2004]

Well, I don't see any issue with the horse (often used with no liner), styro or pond liner. However, where was this pond liner from/ stored ? Was it new, old was it cleaned before you used it. Where did this styro come from ? Was it clean ? Has it ever be exposed to chemicals that could get wetted on the down side, causing them to drip into the horse ? Lastly, where did this water come from that was put in th tank, tap, well, RO, RO/DI ?

all components were new and rinsed with tap water. The pond liner had a white powder on it that I scrubed off.

make up water was from my Kent marine RO/DI unit with a fresh carbon and DI cartridge.

i did see a small copepod today so not all dead.

 

[chend2]

How did you get through a full cycle of 220 pounds of rock in 4 weeks?

 

[goby2004]

the rock has been curing since April in the sump.

 

[Kurt_Nelson]

On a different forum, we had a person that was having the same issues that you describe - couldn't keep inverts alive. She was using a horse trough bought from a feed store as a sump. Once she got rid of it and did additional water changes, she was finally able to keep things alive. Could've been coincidence... who knows. But I do know that some of mold releases (not "mold" mold... but the chemicals used to help get the cast plastic out of the mold) aren't very friendly to water chemistry.

 

[Boomer]

That Kurt may be a good point. I was think he was using a new one.

 

[goby2004]

That Kurt may be a good point. I was think he was using a new one.

Thanks Kurt, that is mostly what i was looking for was some kind of confirmation of similiar problem out there. I'll be tearing it down tonight and using my old 200 gallon tank for the make-up water. The tank I used was one of those grey plastic ones and it looks like it was made out of recycled products and you may also be right on the mold release Kurt, who knows, but is is outta here. I do know that we should let everyone else in our hobby know it is not safe to use anything other than 'food grade' containers which are usually white or clearly marked. i have seen alot of people 'cook' there rock in similiar containers. I think the blue containers may be safe but after this I would never take the chance again.

I will let everyone know if this is successfull in about a week. I am going to do a 100% water change

 

[JasonD]

Was the watering tank covered or lined with the Styrofoam and rubber pond liner? I assume you mean lined. What brand of pond liner?
I am a little concerned because I am working on a firestone pond liner reef pond.

 

[goby2004]

Was the watering tank covered or lined with the Styrofoam and rubber pond liner? I assume you mean lined. What brand of pond liner?
I am a little concerned because I am working on a firestone pond liner reef pond.

It was just covered, those pond liners are considered fish safe, I think it must be the plastic tank, though with the higher temps of our reefs who knows.

 

[Kurt_Nelson]

And again... I'm not saying that for sure that's what your problem is. Just saying that with our limited testing abilities, it's impossible to rule it out. Process of elimination is really the only way.

 

[JasonD]

It was just covered, those pond liners are considered fish safe, I think it must be the plastic tank, though with the higher temps of our reefs who knows.

Thanks for clearing that up.

 

[vwmoneypit]

we have successfully used the rubber maid brand b4!But this was for a curing proccess only!i would have to say have being in the plastic mold buisness alittle..that yes!Even more in recycled products as well..I will give off a chemical compound used to re-adhure the plastics together!i would have to say that in my experience..salt water leaches theses out quicker than cold fresh water!(for horses)well let us know what happens

 

[goby2004]

we have successfully used the rubber maid brand b4!But this was for a curing proccess only!i would have to say have being in the plastic mold buisness alittle..that yes!Even more in recycled products as well..I will give off a chemical compound used to re-adhure the plastics together!i would have to say that in my experience..salt water leaches theses out quicker than cold fresh water!(for horses)well let us know what happens

i have replaced the storage tank with an old acrylic tank getting ready for a full water change but am still sending out a water sample to be tested at a Lab, hope they find what the problem was and will let everyone know, should take about a week.

 

[sgwill122]

What are you using to test your salinity? I killed a cleaner pretty quick when my cheap hydro was off, might want to make sure you have two different salt measuring devices agreeing.

 

[Boomer]

goby what Lab ?