need help with ca levels

[cmiller]

i need help. for the past 8 to 10 weeks i've been having trouble getting my ca levels above 300ppm. this has never been an issue for me for the past 5 years of reef keeping and i'm not sure what i'm doing wrong now. i've been researching this for several weeks, trying to educate myself about the relationship betw. ca and alk and mg but i can't seem to figure out how to correct for low ca. any help is much appreciated.

been using both parts of b-ionic two part dosing, and this week stopped dosing part 1: alkalinity and only dosing part 2: ca 25ml/day.

did a h2o change on 12/4 which brought my alk level down from 13dKH to 11.3dKH.

alk jumped back up to 19dKH on 12/13 so i did a second 20% h2o change and got alk down to 12.5dKH where it has stayed for the past week.

other additives include :
5ml iodide 3x/week
10ml strontium 2x/week

here are my other levels:
pH: 8.2
specific grav: 1.025
Mg: 1200ppm
phosphate: 0
Nitrate: 0

again, any feedback is more than welcomed.

ca absorbing critters:
46 gallon reef includes 2 large tridacna clams 1 small tridacna, 1 med size open and 1 med size closed brain coral, med med torch, 2 med leather corals, 1 med plate coral, med candy coral, bunch of zoanthids and soft polyps, 2 cleaner shrimp

is 25ml/day of ca too low for this invert load?

 

[jadeguppy]

Have you checked to see if your test kit is giving false results? If the corals and clams are using it up, the Ca should drop as well.

 

[cmiller]

Have you checked to see if your test kit is giving false results? If the corals and clams are using it up, the Ca should drop as well.

i've been using elos ca test kit and red sea ca test kit as a reliability check. both readings have been the same for the past 3 or 4 testings.

my best guess at this point is that my clams and coraline algae growth are soaking up most of the 25ml ca dosing/day.

 

[treehugger]

What salt mix are you using and test kits? I would say get some new test kits and stop adding supplements until you figure out where you're really at. Water changes should stabilize things and if you're doing them frequently you're levels will remain just fine for your corals. Make sure you mix the new saltwater at least 24 hours before you do the water change and throw a small powerhead and air stone in there. Once you get stability then you can start with the supplements again. If you're trying to change supplements to correct imbalances, IME you just end up making things worse. Water changes with good ro/di water and a decent salt mix should get you back on track...good luck

 

[cmiller]

What salt mix are you using and test kits? I would say get some new test kits and stop adding supplements until you figure out where you're really at. Water changes should stabilize things and if you're doing them frequently you're levels will remain just fine for your corals. Make sure you mix the new saltwater at least 24 hours before you do the water change and throw a small powerhead and air stone in there. Once you get stability then you can start with the supplements again. If you're trying to change supplements to correct imbalances, IME you just end up making things worse. Water changes with good ro/di water and a decent salt mix should get you back on track...good luck

i use instant ocean salt mix and having been doing 20% h2o changes every 3 to 4 weeks.
i suppose it's possible that test kits are off. althoguh, i just bought the elos ca test kit a week ago and elos seems like a trusted product from what i've read. the red sea test kit i've been using just to check the readings from the elos kit and they have been consistently the same readings.

have been mixing the salt h2o as you have described. i don't have a ro/di filter system set up at home yet and so i've been using ro/di h2o from the grocery store. any problem with using this?
thanks.

 

[returnofsid]

I would suggest doing water changes much more often. For now, I'd suggest doing 20% every week. Once everything is normal and balanced, you might be able to stretch it out to every 2 weeks.

 

[treehugger]

The water should be "ok". I would do the water changes more frequently for right now (maybe 20%-25% every 5 days to 1 week) What are you using to test your ALK? Make sure the salt water is mixed to the same s.g. as your tank and the temp is the same before the changes) I know this might sound funny but roll your bucket of salt to mix it up before you scoop the salt out for the h2o change...sometimes the salt kinda seperates from being bounced around and sitting. Like I said personally I would hold off on the supplements for now.

 

[Boomer]

First

been using both parts of b-ionic two part dosing, and this week stopped dosing part 1: alkalinity and only dosing part 2: ca 25ml/day.

This is usually not going to make it when the Ca++ gets that low, 300. IO only has about 350 ppm Ca++. Boost up your mix with Kent Turbo Calcium to 425. And boost up your tank with Turbo to 425 and then start with the two -part. Once there then take a few daily readings to get an avg to see what the Ca++ and Alk demand is and go from there.

 

[cmiller]

great advice. much oblige eveyone.

so with alk at 12.5dKH (tested with LaMotte alk kit) how much of this interfering with my efforts to raise ca? i'm still trying to wrap my head around the chemistry re: alk + ca = biocarbonate(?), but my basic understanding is that too high alk makes it difficult to raise ca, no?

 

[Boomer]

great advice. much oblige eveyone.

so with alk at 12.5dKH (tested with LaMotte alk kit) how much of this interfering with my efforts to raise ca? i'm still trying to wrap my head around the chemistry re: alk + ca = biocarbonate(?), but my basic understanding is that too high alk makes it difficult to raise ca, no?

It depends on pH also. You are at 4.45 meq / l and 4 is the max or 11 dKH. With these levels of pH 8.2, Alk and 12.5 dkH the Ca++ limit will be about 410. Shoot for no higher than 400 to be safe until that Alk comes down to at least 11 dKH

 

[cmiller]

ok, sounds like 25% h2o change to get alk down at least to 11 dKH is advised. check levels after change and use kent turbo ca to raise to 400ppm.

i'm not familiar with kents turbo ca and haven't searched yet for the instructions, but is the mix prepared then dripped into the system or can i dose the turbo mix it the same way that i dose with the esv b-ionic liquid ca?

i have a ca reactor system rready for set up, but from what i read it is advised to wait until one has ca and alk levels stable and ca at desired level before one fires up a reactor. anyone's input on this?

 

[Boomer]

It is a grain/prill of Calcium Chloride like than dumped on streets as "snow melt". And yes wait on the Calcium reactor

Things for you to read

Reef Chemistry Calculator
http://home.comcast.net/~jdieck1/chem_calc3.html

How to Select a Calcium and Alkalinity Supplementation Scheme
http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/feb2003/chem.htm

Purity of Calcium Chloride
http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/mar2004/chem.htm

 

[cmiller]

thanks for the material and advice.