Not Enough Light or Food?

[rjarnold]

If it were my tank, id do this:
Start monitoring your alk daily for about a week, measuring at the same time every day. IME alk instability/imbalance is the number one issue for SPS keepers. If your alk/calc regiment appears to be working fine with no swings from day to day, then add a fish and start feeding daily. You have to go slow with ramping up how much you add. Just use a food little at first, then work your way up to what appears to be a "meals" worth. This should keep your nutirent levels low and give your bacteria time to catch up. After a month or so you should notice a difference imo.

Peace,
Jesse

As far as nutrients are concerned, I didn't mention this but should have - there are three 'normal' reef-type fish in there in addition to 2 frogfish which consume rather large meals every 3-4 days each. I also feed my scoly a large meal now and again. So the fish waste-producing aspect is way covered

 

[jezzeaepi]

Then I dont know why your asking about food =P

I still dont think its your lights, I think its your chemistry.

 

[rjarnold]

Then I dont know why your asking about food =P

Cause I have 0 nitrates and little to no phosphate and someone told me it was low nutrients Other than that, I don't know either!

 

[rjarnold]

Then I dont know why your asking about food =P

I still dont think its your lights, I think its your chemistry.

So chemistry would change color but not affect growth?

 

[jezzeaepi]

Well normally when corals are light colored they are usually being stressed by something. This could be a large change in enviroment, some sort of pest(like red bugs, but I dont see any bugs in your pics), less then optimal chemical conditions, bleaching from over-lighting(which could be the case for your plasma, but doesnt explain the rest and when they are bleaching they dont normally grow), or a complete lack of nutrients(which can be seen in some zeo-tanks).

 

[jezzeaepi]

One other thing to consider,:

Have you used multiple test kits for your nitrates and phosphate readings? I was reading 0's for months on my tank, till I got new test kits and realised I was actually at 30 nitrates and .5 phosphates. Bad test kit readings can wreak havoc =\

 

[rjarnold]

One other thing to consider,:

Have you used multiple test kits for your nitrates and phosphate readings? I was reading 0's for months on my tank, till I got new test kits and realised I was actually at 30 nitrates and .5 phosphates. Bad test kit readings can wreak havoc =\

I've considered it as I have had a bad test kit or two that wreaked havoc The phosphate test was used on my husband's tank at home and did give a reading though. Same for KH and pH. However, the nitrate and nitrite are newer tests, so there's always a possibility there.

 

[RejectReefer]

Kevin, just wondering if flow can be a contributing factor to color loss like the kind explained by rjarnold?

 

[kevinpo]

just wondering if flow can be a contributing factor to color loss like the kind explained by rjarnold?

I have not seen flow change the color of any SPS coral only the growth form.

Color change (lightening/darkening) can have nothing to do with SPS coral health or stress, but rather just an adjustment to changes in lighting intensity and/or spectrum. Growth rates can remain the same in either condition. Large colonies will have light and dark areas depending on the orientation to the light (this is especially true with halide lighting). PAR readings of 750 and higher tend to make corals quite light. LPS corals subjected to these levels will be almost translucent. SPS corals of the same species can be found in a wide range of water depth/clarity and careful acclimation may be needed if the coral is placed in a higher light environment. Most SPS corals are quite adaptable but may need up to six months to adjust to different environmental conditions. The color of SPS corals can have little to do with the health of the coral but rather our preference to have brightly colored corals. This can result in us tweaking the lighting and chemistry to achieve the desired effect sometimes without regard to corals health. This can lead to crashes in entire systems if the corals are living on the edge of their optimal parameters.

Regards,
Kevin

 

[rjarnold]

It has been a week since moving the Purple Plasma down. At day 6 (yesterday) it started STN'ing on the bottom. I put some glue over the white portion but I must not have gotten all of it because it had continued further when I came in this morning. I put more glue over all of the dead portions. If that doesn't work, I'm going to have to frag it and cross my fingers.

I am not sure why that happened, but I moved it back to its previous location. I have been feeding more but my nitrates and nitrites remain at 0, and phosphate still measures 0.01 or less (I removed the phosphate reactor, which I guess wasn't really supposed to be on there with FiltraM (zeo) anyways). One change, which I just started yesterday, was Vitamin C supplement for the zoas. I did less than 1/4 tsp. that morning and then the same this morning into the refugium. I also ran out of the calc and alkalinity boosters I was using and bought different ones that were started yesterday (it never went without supplementing). They are both DTs and I put in about 2x3/4 capfuls of each into the refugium.

If it wasn't for that problem, everything else seemed to have been going alright. I think the purple plasma got a bit darker, but so did the cali tort and plum crazy that were not moved from their positions. I'm not absolutely certain, however, as it may be slight or it may be wishful thinking.

Alk is at 7 and Calcium is at 410.

 

[warforged]

I know that BR uses Luminarcs and the frag tank is under some intense lighting... also they have a lot more blue in there spectrum.

When I brought some stuff home from the same sale the colors were different in my tank on a few pieces...bright green birds nest turned out looking more like forest green in my tank..

 

[rjarnold]

I know that BR uses Luminarcs and the frag tank is under some intense lighting... also they have a lot more blue in there spectrum.

When I brought some stuff home from the same sale the colors were different in my tank on a few pieces...bright green birds nest turned out looking more like forest green in my tank..

These were color changes that happened while in my tank.

 

[rjarnold]

I thought I'd dredge this thread back to the top for more input. I don't think the problem can be light (at least, not too much) because a nice dark green digi I received is now pretty light and even a bit more on the yellow side, but still healthy and growing well. The digi was on the bottom of a tank under MH from the person I purchased it from and was put on the bottom of my tank with the T5s.

My calcium is 425 and alkalinity seems to stay around 7. I'm going to try to push the alk up a bit more. Despite removing the phosphate reactor and feeding more, the NO3s and PO4s remain at 0 and 0.01 respectively (Elos test kits). Montiporas don't seem to be affected the same way the acros are, but two of my zoas and a type of rhodactis shroom have even lightened after being put on the bottom of the tank.

I imagine all this has to mean that the tank still isn't getting enough food. Typically, I feed (this is a 40 breeder):
-dime-sized amount of Rod's Foods 5x a week
-2 drops of Pro Skimmer each day
-1 drop of Elos Amino Acids on Monday

Livestock includes a dragonet, 2 frogfishes in their respective 'pens', a starry blenny, black limpets, flower pot anemone type thing, cleaner shrimp, lots o' snails (2 are the large nassarius meat-eating species), and I just got 3 chromis to replace the damsel. Corals are mostly sps, chalices, and zoas/palys, but there is a large scoly as well.

Equipment is a large HOB refugium filled with chaeto, 2 koralia pumps (3's I think?), and a AquaC Remora Pro skimmer (that doesn't take out much of anything... firstly because there apparently isn't much to take out and secondly, it's a crap skimmer

Other than the skimmer, the only things that are removing any wastes are the Elos FiltraM (approx. 1/4 cup) and the charcoal. I'm tempted to pull out the FiltraM and see what happens.

 

[jezzeaepi]

Sounds like your doing everything right. Im scratchin my head over here.

When was the last time you calibrated your refractometer?
My only other idea would be that it is somehow related to your skimmer not working too well. Perhaps its not pulling stuff out quickly enough? Meaning, that even though you are getting 0's on your nitrate and phosphates, they are not always 0. Perhaps they spike some after feeding, then get brought down by your algae by the time you test? Too bad its a big investment to get a good hob skimmer to see if thats the case =\

Peace

 

[rjarnold]

Sounds like your doing everything right. Im scratchin my head over here.

When was the last time you calibrated your refractometer?
My only other idea would be that it is somehow related to your skimmer not working too well. Perhaps its not pulling stuff out quickly enough? Meaning, that even though you are getting 0's on your nitrate and phosphates, they are not always 0. Perhaps they spike some after feeding, then get brought down by your algae by the time you test? Too bad its a big investment to get a good hob skimmer to see if thats the case =\

Peace

Yeah, sadly I won't be replacing my HOB skimmer anytime soon. What if I tested PO4s an hour after feeding?

 

[jezzeaepi]

Yeah, sadly I won't be replacing my HOB skimmer anytime soon. What if I tested PO4s an hour after feeding?

Thats a good question, maybe someone with some chemistry knowledge can chime in? Seems like somewhere between 1 and 3 hours sounds good?

 

[Bricky]

I think you may have to much Filtra M. Try reducing down to 1/8th of a cup and in a bag. Put the bag in a high flow area of your skimmer or fuge. I'm sure you're aware that Filtra M is powerful and can strip your water pretty quickly.

 

[rjarnold]

I think you may have to much Filtra M. Try reducing down to 1/8th of a cup and in a bag. Put the bag in a high flow area of your skimmer or fuge. I'm sure you're aware that Filtra M is powerful and can strip your water pretty quickly.

Yeah, I reduced it down after talking to you previously, but not by very much. I think there was a bit less than 1/4 cup left and I've just dumped more so it's really just a small amount now!

 

[rjarnold]

Think it's time for another update. I thought perhaps my plum crazy had gotten a tiny bit darker, but comparing photos it doesn't look like it. Photos are pretty difficult though, it might really have gotten a tad darker - it's certainly growing. The purple plasma remains the same, and I think the Cali tort as well (the latter has been growing fast and the tips seem darker). The good news is that the newest corals don't seem to have *lost* color, which is a start I hope!

I'm toying with the idea of putting a 20k MH on the tank, since this is my 'display' tank in my office, and I want the corals to look their best.

This is my little tri-color thing from salmonslayer (cali tort in background, yellow w/purple-blue tips on the right side):

And my purple pillow

 

[dailydriven911]

I think you need more P and N so those colors start to pop more. I was dosing the complete elos purist line and noticed my colors lightened considerably (low nutrients). Try dosing your AA's and Pro skimmer each day. After 2-3 months you should notice a difference.

Good luck!

Jayson