Not exactly new, but...

[whispurr]

I have a strange history with saltwater tanks.

I had a 125 about 10 years ago with fluorescent lighting, not enough live rock, an undergravel filter, and a canister filter. I succesfully kept all kinds of things in there from anenomes to inverts, but no corals. I also had a 10 gal saltwater, when everybody said it couldn't be done - with fluorescent lighting and a biowheel!

Now I have a 14 gal bio cube that is 5 months old with live sand and 15-16# of live rock. I haven't been able to progress beyond the CUC because it hasn't stabilized yet. I'm still getting high readings on nitrates. I just did a 50% water change last night and found a couple of more dead snails. I'm down to 1 snail and 2 hermits out of the initial 22 member CUC. I use RO water, and API test kit, and a refractometer to test the sg. I'm just not having much luck there.

But now onto the questions portion of the post. (Not that I wouldn't mind any suggestions on the 14gal!) I still have the 125gal tank, but it is currently freshwater. I'd like to convert it to saltwater. It's pretty much the same configuration as it was before except it has been upgraded to pc lighting.

I don't have a huge chunk of cash just laying around to do the conversion with, so I need to do it a step at a time. I've considered setting it up the way I had it before - it worked then, why not now? But I can see there would be difficulty in later converting it to a biological-only filtered tank. Unless there is a way that I'm not aware of to wean it from mechanical to biological without killing everything in the tank.

So I guess what I'm looking for, is what is the least expensive way I can convert to saltwater now, fish and inverts only is ok - with the ultimate goal being a reef eventually?

Also, any suggestions on where to get larger quantities of live rock and/or live sand would be great. I've seen it online for much less expensive than the $6/# it is locally, but not being able to see it makes it hard to know how good it is.

Or maybe I should just try to trade my 125 for a more complete smaller tank?

I'm just bored with freshwater. All they do is swim. :lol:

Thanks,
Teresa

 

[tat2z_21]

Well by all means you can keep fish onlyt tank with the set up you have now. I am guessing that you have some sort of mechanical filtration and have a good understanding that with out all of the extra gadgets it will have to be a strict schedule of water changes and parameter checks. With that being said the gadgets that you see people in this industry sort of a convenience when it comes to fish only tanks. A protein Skimmer is nice to have, but not a necessity. A sump/refugium is the same. However fish only tanks benefit alot from the right amount of "live Rock. " So though it is a big expense try to scour this sight and find some good deals. Everything else could come along later. Hope all works out and if you lived a little closer to Whidbey Island I could come down and possibly help you with your set up. Good luck and just for the records in my opinion, Saltwater tank has so much more life then a freshy (sorry if I hurt anyones feelings out there)

 

[gas4544]

Welcome to Reef Frontiers. We have a bunch of local reefers who ar active on this board. You can also check out our local club at thepsas.org

Perhaps you could set up a tank that is somewhere between 14 gallons and 125 gallons. It takes allot of rock to stock a 125, and it would be easier on the budget to go with something in the 40-75 gallon range. If you keep an eye on the board here and also on Craigslist, you can find some pretty good deals on used equipment and on liverock also.

If your goal is to have a reef tank, then acquire equipment that will fulfill the needs of your desired reef. Incremental upgrades can be expensive, and you can find some nice used equipment if you are patient.

Gary

 

[whispurr]

What exactly is a refugium? I keep seeing that term used and I see pictures of them, but no explanations as to what they are, what goes in them, or what their purpose is.

Thanks,
Teresa

 

[Herefishyfishy]

A refugium is a separate little tank like container to grow plants in for filtration purposes. One can also keep the plants right in the tank. I have maintained large planted reef tanks with calurpa in lieu of lots of rock. The plants perform a large part of the denitrification. It would require t-5 or VHO lighting at a minimum to keep any Corals or anemones but any decent lighting could make a cheap planted FOWLER. Less is better than more when it comes to fish unless you want to do a lot of water changes.

 

[whispurr]

Welcome to Reef Frontiers. We have a bunch of local reefers who ar active on this board. You can also check out our local club at thepsas.org

Perhaps you could set up a tank that is somewhere between 14 gallons and 125 gallons. It takes allot of rock to stock a 125, and it would be easier on the budget to go with something in the 40-75 gallon range. If you keep an eye on the board here and also on Craigslist, you can find some pretty good deals on used equipment and on liverock also.

If your goal is to have a reef tank, then acquire equipment that will fulfill the needs of your desired reef. Incremental upgrades can be expensive, and you can find some nice used equipment if you are patient.

Gary

But that's just it. I don't know what is a need! And some people say things like protein skimmers are musts, while others say they are optional. I know I can get by with the pc lighting until I am ready to add the critters that need more light.

So what I need to know is what I have to have NOW, vs. what I can add later.

When I did this before, things were done a whole lot differently, so I'm having to learn all over again. I have two LFS's, one is SW only and totally unreliable for advice (they wanted to sell me multiple fish two weeks into the cycle.) The other... not sure about yet. It seems to depend on who I talk to.

I can afford to make mistakes with the 14gal, but the 125 is a whole different story. I need a little direction.

Oh, and I'm pretty good at constructing things, but I'm not good at the technical side of things. I don't understand electricity for example, but I can build boxes, work with plexiglass, have power-tools and a dremel, a couple ofsmaller aquariums (2.5 gal and 35-40 gal hex off the top of my head.) My 125 has a cabinet and wood top with about 6" clearance.

So some DIY is an option. Watching Craigslist and here for bargains would work - if I knew what to watch for.

Teresa

Thanks,
Teresa

 

[whispurr]

A refugium is a separate little tank like container to grow plants in for filtration purposes. One can also keep the plants right in the tank. I have maintained large planted reef tanks with calurpa in lieu of lots of rock. The plants perform a large part of the denitrification. It would require t-5 or VHO lighting at a minimum to keep any Corals or anemones but any decent lighting could make a cheap planted FOWLER. Less is better than more when it comes to fish unless you want to do a lot of water changes.

FOWLER?

Is T-5 the same as PC? I need more lighting no matter what, I only have one 48" PC strip on a 60" tank.

So I could start with rock and Caulerpa? The later could I replace the Caulerpa with live rock a little at a time? I love the live rock, it's so fascinating to see what grows out of it over time.

The fish aren't really what interest me, though of course I'd need some. It's inverts that have my heart! Crabs, shrimps, starfish... those are the things I find irresistable.

Is it hard to set up a refugium? They always look so complicated with all of their pipes and parts and pieces!

Thanks,
Teresa

 

[returnofsid]

FOWLR is Fish Only With Live Rock.

T5 is not the same thing as PC. T5HO (High Output) is far superior. With the correct reflectors, T5HO is every bit as good as 250 watt Metal Halide lighting. In most tanks, with adequate T5HO coverage, you can keep whatever you want, including high light demanding SPS, clams or anemones.

I would NOT put Caulerpa in your display tank. It'll quickly attach to your live rock. Once attached, it'll be almost impossible to get rid of. It grows fast, is very aggressive and will grow over anything in your tank, including corals or equipment.

Refugiums are as easy or as complicated as you want. DIY refugiums are easy to make out of, say a 29 gallon aquarium.

Skimmers are not absolutely necessary and lots of people have great reef tanks without them. HOWEVER, running a successful reef without a skimmer does take quite a bit more experience and maintenance. I'd definitely suggest that they're a very important piece of equipment for a reef tank. Not so important for a Fish Only tank.

The PC, Compact Fluorescent, lighting will be sufficient to keep most soft corals and some LPS corals. Unless it's a Freshwater set up...well, it'd still be somewhat adequate for soft corals. If it's a freshwater light set up, you will want to change out bulbs anyway. Otherwise, you could end up with huge algae issues, because of Kelvin ratings and such.

Read lots, decide what you want, instead of what you can keep with your current equipment. Once you've decided on what you want, then you will have an idea of what equipment needs you have.

Read through the stickies in the New to Reefkeeping forum. There's all kinds of great information there. Also, browse through the Articles here on RF. Don't be afraid to ask questions at all. Most importantly, be very patient. You'll get all kinds of advise, good and bad. Research is your friend!!

Welcome to Reef Frontiers!!!! Make sure you consider joining the great local club you have over there. PSAS. Here's a link to their forum, here on RF. http://www.reeffrontiers.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=8

 

[whispurr]

FOWLR is Fish Only With Live Rock.

T5 is not the same thing as PC. T5HO (High Output) is far superior. With the correct reflectors, T5HO is every bit as good as 250 watt Metal Halide lighting. In most tanks, with adequate T5HO coverage, you can keep whatever you want, including high light demanding SPS, clams or anemones.

I would NOT put Caulerpa in your display tank. It'll quickly attach to your live rock. Once attached, it'll be almost impossible to get rid of. It grows fast, is very aggressive and will grow over anything in your tank, including corals or equipment.

Refugiums are as easy or as complicated as you want. DIY refugiums are easy to make out of, say a 29 gallon aquarium.

Skimmers are not absolutely necessary and lots of people have great reef tanks without them. HOWEVER, running a successful reef without a skimmer does take quite a bit more experience and maintenance. I'd definitely suggest that they're a very important piece of equipment for a reef tank. Not so important for a Fish Only tank.

Read lots, decide what you want, instead of what you can keep with your current equipment. Once you've decided on what you want, then you will have an idea of what equipment needs you have.

Read through the stickies in the New to Reefkeeping forum. There's all kinds of great information there. Also, browse through the Articles here on RF. Don't be afraid to ask questions at all. Most importantly, be very patient. You'll get all kinds of advise, good and bad. Research is your friend!!

Welcome to Reef Frontiers!!!!

Thanks for the welcome.

I've been reading and asking questions for about six months now and I just seem to end up more confused. I've been hanging out at nanoreefs.com learning what I can there. But I don't really think my 125 qualifies as a nano. :lol:

I had registered here quite some time ago and it seemed to be time to become active and maybe get to know some local people in the hobby. Now I'm looking around over at thepsas.org.

So, a refugium. Could one go inside the cabinet under my 125?

Looking at the prices for the LR at some online sources, it looks like I could swing that at some point in the not-so-distant future.

What about sand? Do I have to buy all live sand? Or do I buy just sand and seed it with some live?

Ugh. This is making my brain hurt. Can I pull the "I'm just a girl" card now?

Teresa

 

[Herefishyfishy]

I would NOT put Caulerpa in your display tank. It'll quickly attach to your live rock. Once attached, it'll be almost impossible to get rid of. It grows fast, is very aggressive and will grow over anything in your tank, including corals or equipment.

I have heard many claim this yet have never experienced it. Nor have I ever seen one planted tank where the owner regretted it. I have had dozens of marine tanks with plants and many that became intentionally devoid of plants. My current tank has two types calurpa, halimeda and some red grasilaria: it looks awesome. I harvest it as nutrient export. The only way it could grow out of control is if the tank was already a polluted bucket filled with nutrients.

In fact Michael, you saw my 72 bowfront first hand, it had three type plants growing in it then.

 

[beoks]

what i did with my live rock was just buy it in bulk online for base rock i didnt really care what it looked like or what shapes, than i picked out the pieces i liked form the store and started the look i wanted its cheaper that buying nice rock for the bottom layer you dont really see. all dead none live sand turns into live sand i think live sand is kinda a waste but you do need to seed it. just my 2 cents

 

[returnofsid]

I will attest to the beauty of Herefishy's planted tank. I've seen it and it's very nice. I have had Caelurpa grow to the point where it's shading everything out. I've also had it attach to Montiporas, keeping them from growing in that direction.

As for sand, buy aragonite based sand and seed it with live sand.

Yes, a refugium can go in the stand of your tank. I have a 29 gallon that I built a sump/refugium out of, under my 75.

No, the "I'm a girl card" won't work here. It was a very experienced girl that got me into this hobby and babysat me throughout my first year...lol. Barbie, here on RF.