Overfeeding?

[mgrelik]

I'm a bundle of questions recently... But right now we're running a 1000g tank system. 1, 2, 3 are tanks, 4 is the sump, and imagine it all connected with plumbing... each tank is about 250 gallons.

(my camera is gone... so i made this amazing drawing in paint...)

But yeah... Right now we feed about 12 litres of phytoplankton a day, and feed our sun coral, pagoda corals, candy canes, zoos and well pretty much anything else cyclopeeze on a daily basis. (i'd say about a 1/4 cup worth of cyclopeeze is used in each daily feeding... then water is added to dethaw)

I'm beginning to think that i'm overfeeding heavily which is probably a huge cause of my constant algae problem as well... Any word on how much food would be required to get good growth of coral, while not overfeeding it and polluting my system? (unless i'm doing it right as it is... but that's usually not the case lol)

 

[returnofsid]

I have no idea how much food you should be feeding. However, what is your reasoning for feeding so much phytoplankton? Very few corals are "herbivores," most are carnivores and won't eat the phyto. Zooplankton and certain pods and other beneficial critters in your tank may eat phyto though. The use of Cyclopeeze is a great choice for feeding your corals. I do think that 1/4 daily is a huge amount, although if you have a 1000 gallon system that's loaded with corals, that might be an appropriate amount. But maybe you could use this as a comparison. I feed frozen cyclopeeze to my tanks. Take my 75 gallon, for instance. It's predominately SPS, with some LPS in it. I feed frozen cyclopeeze 3 times per week. Each feeding consists of a frozen chunk about the size of a marble, maybe a little larger. I feel that I'm feeding enough. However, with fish in the tank, I'm also feeding other items and the corals are getting fed from the fish as well.

 

[Scooterman]

12 litres of phytoplankton a day,

Where did you ever get the information that you have to use so much or what is your reasoning? Can you breakdown what your feeding & what you have & your filtration? Hard to help with little information about your system.

 

[mgrelik]

Where did you ever get the information that you have to use so much or what is your reasoning? Can you breakdown what your feeding & what you have & your filtration? Hard to help with little information about your system.

Alright lol. I'll give the super huge rundown of the tank because i really want to get this stuff figured out.
FEEDING
TANK 1
mainly zoos, mushrooms, some flowerpots, the sun coral, blastamoussa, a couple carnations and some star polyps.

We directly feed cyclopeeze to each suncoral polyp, and to the flowerpots. We also have little plate corals (8 of them) and they get fed directly as well. I'll occasionally feed the blastas directly.

TANK 2
30+ heads of candy cane coral, favia brains, 10-15 frogspawn heads, some more zoo frags, large leather coral.

Directly feed cyclopeeze to every candy cane head, and try to feed each frogspawn head. if the leather's polyps are extended, i'll spritz it with some cyclopeeze as well.

TANK 3
Our SPS tank. Tons of acro/monti frags. though we have some pagoda coral as well.

Directly feed the pagoda coral with cyclopeeze, and spritz around the acro's and monti's.

Since all 3 tanks are linked, i just feed the phyto 4litres per tank and let it cycle.

Why do i feed this much phyto? I was just told by the guy before me that that's how much he fed to the corals, so that's just what i've always done and no one said otherwise.

Filtration
Currently one "medium"(?) sized skimmer in tank 1... I want more than one, but the guys i work with think it's ok.

second, we have a charcoal filter that we run, and at the ends of each tank is a sheet of floss that we replace every 2 weeks.

Our sump is a 250gallon tank that's filled 90% with live rock.

Hope this helps, and if you need anymore info, i can provide it.
thanks.

Matt.

edit 1(Oh, and all this is done on a daily basis as well)
edit 2(also feed the 2-3 fish per tank New life spectrum pellets on a daily basis as well.. but not much)

 

[Scooterman]

When you say medium size skimmer, just what does that mean? Do you have a sb & how deep?
Ok on the feeding, how long have you been doing this?

IMO
If you continue this I think your going to have major algae issues that will be very difficult to deal with, in time detritus will accumulate to the point that will make it difficult remove it effectively. Hard to say without knowing what exactly your doing to remove waste foods that isn't used up. Many people go without any feeding or maybe slight feeding but not the quantities your talking about & not daily even. Your coral don't just eat this stuff up like people eats three meals a day LOL.
If I was you I'd cut off everything for a while, make sure your cleaning up the tank throughly & in the mean time start doing some reading.
Let me gather a list of information for your reading, I'll post some links that while be helpful

 

[mgrelik]

When you say medium size skimmer, just what does that mean? Do you have a sb & how deep?
Ok on the feeding, how long have you been doing this?

IMO
If you continue this I think your going to have major algae issues that will be very difficult to deal with, in time detritus will accumulate to the point that will make it difficult remove it effectively. Hard to say without knowing what exactly your doing to remove waste foods that isn't used up. Many people go without any feeding or maybe slight feeding but not the quantities your talking about & not daily even. Your coral don't just eat this stuff up like people eats three meals a day LOL.
If I was you I'd cut off everything for a while, make sure your cleaning up the tank throughly & in the mean time start doing some reading.
Let me gather a list of information for your reading, I'll post some links that while be helpful

Well i started with this place about 2 months ago, (my own reefing experience only started about 4 months ago and i have a little biocube that does exceptionally well...) and as far as i know, this has been the way the tanks have been fed for the past 6 months.

The tanks are all bare bottom, and i try my best to siphon out detritus, but its a pain because of all the little frags i have to go around. (i'm working on a new system that will raise the frags about 3 inches off the floor on easily removable egg crate platforms so i can get at the detritus easier, but that needs some time...)

 

[Scooterman]

Here's one to start with.

http://www.wetwebmedia.com/growingcorals.htm

http://www.personal.psu.edu/users/s/b/sbj4/aquarium/reeffood/feeding.htm

 

[Scooterman]

Sounds like maybe your cleaning up well so you may just need to adjust your feeding quantities, to me it seems like 12 liters of phytoplankton a day is a bit too much.

one more recent

http://www.reeffrontiers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=40406

 

[mgrelik]

Sweet, thanks for your help. I'll probably cut down to like a litre a day of phyto being that apparently most corals don't really benefit from it... and slow my feedings of cyclopeeze to once every 2-3 days (the exception being my turbinara, which i'll still feed daily)

I'll see how it goes over the next couple of weeks.

again, thanks for your help.

 

[returnofsid]

12 liters??? Did I miss that in your first post?? So you're feeding almost 3 gallons of phyto every day?? What do you have in your tank that's eating phyto? Phyto is algae...you have an algae problem. I think I can say, with confidence, these two statements are related. Unless you have a specific reason, other than somebody telling you to, for feeding phyto, I'd not feed it at all. If you feel the need to feed it, I'd suggest cutting back to much less than a liter per day. I'd suggest something along the lines of a cup a day, IF you really think you need to feed it at all. Also, are you culturing your own phyto? What type of phyto are you feeding?

I agree with spot feeding each head of sun coral. The rest of your corals don't require the spot feeding. If you have good circulation, allowing the food to circulate through the water column will be enough to feed the corals. Spot feeding is probably leading to overfeeding. I'd suggest stopping the phyto all together, unless you have specific animals you know require it. I'd also cut back your feeding of cyclopeeze...WAY BACK. I'd also suggest you feed your corals, except for the sun coral, every 3 days instead of every day. Keep in mind that, as long as you have adequate lighting, your corals don't even require feeding, except for the sun coral. Any photosynthetic animal will get it's nutrition through it's zooanthella hosting within the body, which feeds off the light.

Having a bare bottom tank, you have the ability to have TONS of flow. This will be a benefit when feeding your corals. You can feed the entire tank, instead of spot feeding, and the good flow will keep the food suspended long enough for all corals to eat. Don't know when you're feeding, but I'd suggest feeding at night, when coral polyps are more likely to be out.

With the feeding regiment you have, I would also look into upgrading your skimmer. You need MAJOR skimming with that kind of feeding schedule.

Once, again, I would have to suggest you either cut WAY back or even stop feeding everything except your sun coral, until your algae problem is taken care of. Once the algae is taken care of, you could start feeding again, but seriously re-think your feeding style. Keep in mind that it's not the 1000 gallons of water that you're feeding. You're feeding the corals. What I'm getting at is just because you have a large system, doesn't mean that you have to feed so much. For instance, I have a 29 gallon frag tank that's loaded with SPS frags. I have a 75 gallon tank that is predominately SPS, with some LPS and soft corals. I have a 46 gallon with one SPS, a few LPS and a few soft corals. I barely feed the 46 anything...maybe 1 feeding every 4 days and that feeding is a tiny amount. I feed the 29 almost as much as the 75, because of it's coral load. However, I do a higher percentage of water change in the 29 as well.

 

[mgrelik]

12 liters??? Did I miss that in your first post?? So you're feeding almost 3 gallons of phyto every day?? What do you have in your tank that's eating phyto? Phyto is algae...you have an algae problem. I think I can say, with confidence, these two statements are related. Unless you have a specific reason, other than somebody telling you to, for feeding phyto, I'd not feed it at all. If you feel the need to feed it, I'd suggest cutting back to much less than a liter per day. I'd suggest something along the lines of a cup a day, IF you really think you need to feed it at all. Also, are you culturing your own phyto? What type of phyto are you feeding?

I agree with spot feeding each head of sun coral. The rest of your corals don't require the spot feeding. If you have good circulation, allowing the food to circulate through the water column will be enough to feed the corals. Spot feeding is probably leading to overfeeding. I'd suggest stopping the phyto all together, unless you have specific animals you know require it. I'd also cut back your feeding of cyclopeeze...WAY BACK. I'd also suggest you feed your corals, except for the sun coral, every 3 days instead of every day. Keep in mind that, as long as you have adequate lighting, your corals don't even require feeding, except for the sun coral. Any photosynthetic animal will get it's nutrition through it's zooanthella hosting within the body, which feeds off the light.

Having a bare bottom tank, you have the ability to have TONS of flow. This will be a benefit when feeding your corals. You can feed the entire tank, instead of spot feeding, and the good flow will keep the food suspended long enough for all corals to eat. Don't know when you're feeding, but I'd suggest feeding at night, when coral polyps are more likely to be out.

With the feeding regiment you have, I would also look into upgrading your skimmer. You need MAJOR skimming with that kind of feeding schedule.

Once, again, I would have to suggest you either cut WAY back or even stop feeding everything except your sun coral, until your algae problem is taken care of. Once the algae is taken care of, you could start feeding again, but seriously re-think your feeding style. Keep in mind that it's not the 1000 gallons of water that you're feeding. You're feeding the corals. What I'm getting at is just because you have a large system, doesn't mean that you have to feed so much. For instance, I have a 29 gallon frag tank that's loaded with SPS frags. I have a 75 gallon tank that is predominately SPS, with some LPS and soft corals. I have a 46 gallon with one SPS, a few LPS and a few soft corals. I barely feed the 46 anything...maybe 1 feeding every 4 days and that feeding is a tiny amount. I feed the 29 almost as much as the 75, because of it's coral load. However, I do a higher percentage of water change in the 29 as well.

Thanks for the info sid. Alot of my problems come from being new to the marine stuff, and alot of what I do now is a result of just being told "well that's what I've been doing" from the other employee here. Which is why I brought it up on the forums. I'll definitely take your advice, and take the feeding way back and I'll see what happens.

Thanks.

Matt.

 

[Scooterman]

Do your water changes like maybe a couple 30% changes & then reconsider your feedings as mentioned, in time it will get better. I would stop feeding until then though, just to make things easier.

 

[vinny2261]

You also do not mention what kind of lighting you have. most of the corals you mention do just fine under properly lit enviroments, with out a lot of extra or any food. The night corals you have a little extra food a couple times a week and probably housed in the larger tanks would help.
Vince

 

[returnofsid]

Hey, we all started out in similar ways...taking advice, both bad and good. Eventually we all, hopefully, learn to do our own research...or who we can trust advice from...lol. Joining RF and seeking advice on here was a great step in the right direction!! Don't get discouraged...you'll get a handle on it in a few years...lol...just like we all did...or are still trying to do.

 

[G&NSalty425]

Just remember for corals that require light, light is a food source for them so what you put in your tank treat it like it was dessert for them Welcome to Reef Frontier's also and since your Sun Coral does not require light make sure to feed every polyp. I have a Sun Coral and I feed it 2-3 times a week. It routinely comes out about 8-9 pm and I remove it in a bowl of tank water and feed every polyp by hand some Mysis Shrimp mine loves it. The reason I remove from tank to feed is because I heavily feed it and don't want to muck up the rest of the tank. When I place it back in the tank I put a plastic soda bottle cut in half over it to help keep other tank mates (mainly my shrimp and hermit crabs) from stealing the food. Once the Sun Coral has eaten all the way I just remove the soda bottle top.

 

[tat2z_21]

# GALLONS OF PHYTO A DAY? I wish I had that it would last a whole year.

 

[Skimmy]

you've already been schooled on the overfeeding,
but can anyone guess what im going to say???



you guessed it!!!
i think you might be under-skimming, just a tad

but first off, does your boss want to spend money on improving the system?? that is the real question:idea:

if yes, it sounds like you need an additional sump on the system with a refugium that grows macroalgae for nutrient removal, coupled with larger, easily home made, media reactors to contain larger amounts of carbon, and a seperate one for phosphate (as it has a different rate of exaustion than the carbon), and of coarse a skimmer that can actually handle the large load of a 1000g store display system. until then your only hope is to detritus suck your brains out, from tanks AND sump, do at least 25% water changes weekly or even more frequent than that, and use at least 1/2 cup of carbon for every 100g in a sock in sump that you change out every week as well, preferable every 3-4 days.
good luck,
and may the schwartz be with you...

 

[mgrelik]

lol, well thanks for all the help guys, i'll slowly work on getting the system back to where it should be.