Predatory Starfish removal

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reeftank1

Do you digiscope?
Joined
Sep 25, 2004
Messages
198
Location
South Puget Sound
I am curious if there is any way to remove these little guys. I know that harlequins are an option and a tweezers is the second best way. Is there any way to dip my corals into some sort of solution to free them and not harm the corals? I have tried to remove them several times and they seem to be come back better each time.
 
well I will be the first to tell you the the harlequin is the best option. I used have hundreds of those stars in 300 lbs of rock and one shrimp ate them down to nothing in 2 weeks and I never saw another one again.. I tried taking them out as I saw them too but you can only get the visible ones. the harlequin hunts them down and eats them I think they can probably eat 5-10 stars a day ( that is is your preditary stars are the size of a pea like mine were...

Matt
 
are you talking about the little white ones? if so, i have alot of them aswell and would like to know how to get rid of them in a safe and effective way.
 
Augustus if your stars are smaller then a dime and mostly have either 3 legs or 7 then they are predatary and the same as what I had. the harlequin is your best bet!!!

Matt
 
Steve to Butt in here, I want to thank Anthony, Kevin, yourself, and all the other highly experienced enthusiasts; who so generously give their expertise and time to all, purely for the sake of conservation and the hobby. The activity of keeping a marine aquarium has evolved from the selfish consumption and destruction of reef inhabitants, to productive home aquaculture.

I personally have learned more about successful reef keeping in the last few months, than in three decades of trial and error.
Regards,
Mike

(probably the wrong thread for this)
 
Thanks Steve. I know where this myth came from (and it is a myth 99.9999% of the time). Most people should like Asterina spp starfish so if you don't want yours, please give them to someone in your club.
 
I've had them in my 27 for years and not one death or anything to suspect. While I won't say dismiss it outright, please do work on the assumption innocent until proven guilty. :p

Much like worms, if you control the freely available nutrient, you control their population levels. In a heavily fed, poorly maintained tank, they can get to a level like Planaria. Keep the tank clean (but still well fed) and they will be quite minimal.

Curtswearing said:
I know where this myth came from (and it is a myth 99.9999% of the time).
Please elaborate, I have always wondered how this got started. I always though it was one of those hobbyist "I read it somewhere" type things??:confused:

Cheers
Steve
 
Steve. I am not nearly as educated as you with marine life but I have caught the preditary stars eating my zoanthids time and time again, the funny thing is that the only time they ate my zoos was when I backed off on the feeding and kept the tank clean (like you said if you keep the tank clean and do not overfeed they will stay in small numbers) But then they get hungry and curious. I know this varies drastically from tank to tank but this is my experience and my theory...

Thanks for your input Steve....

Matt
 
I wake up to hundreds of those little guys every morning. Never seen one hurt a thing.

Don
 
steve I just read that link you shared with us. thats a great source of info on star fish. here is what I read that struck me as why they are eating my zoo's I copied this from the link..

Asterina sea stars have been accused, unfairly at times, for preying on coral tissue. While some individuals appear to eat some desirable reef invertebrates, the problem may be a simple matter of an opportunistic predator adapting to a change in the available, preferred foods (worms, algae).

so this I am sure is what has happend to me in the past with mine...

Thanks again Steve..:)

Matt
 
Please elaborate, I have always wondered how this got started. I always though it was one of those hobbyist "I read it somewhere" type things??:confused:

http://www.garf.org/news26p2.html#STAR

You'll see this picture. These Asterina are much larger than the typical hitchhiker according to Rob Toonen and if you have this larger variety, there is the possibility of problem. PS....doesn't the one on the far left look like King Neptune?

STARDIVISION568221.jpg


The sea stars listed on the GARF site (http://www.garf.org/news26p2.html#STAR) are really quite huge in comparison to most that I have seen in aquaria (and that you describe here). Species like Asterina cepheus, A.burtoni and A. gibbosa can all be pretty variable in color, shape and size depending on how much asexual reproduction they undergo, but for the most part, all of them are thought to be opportunistic predators and scavengers. I would say that, like some large errant polychaetes, the likelihood of them causing a problem (such as eating a coral) is likely to be a direct consequence of their size and level of hunger -- a starving animal is less picky about their diet than one that is reasonable well-fed. Of course, there is always the possibility that these stars are also attracted to the scent of decay, and your experience with this coral is not uncommon for people without these stars in their tanks as well -- these stars use chemical stimuli to track food, and will be much better at determining when a polyp is failing than you are. My guess is that as soon as a polyp starts to fail the stars in the area immediately respond by coming over to feed on it, but that's moving into the "enough guesses" zone again ;)

I know plenty of people that have had these stars in their tanks without problem for many years. The reports on the GARF website regarding the taste of their sea stars for certain SPS are pretty dire, however, so it's worthwhile keeping an eye on them to make sure that you don't have a problem with them. Again, although these stars are opportunistic carnivores, my guess is that problems with them in the tank are a result of size, population density, and feeding regime of the tank in question. I would say that in general, people who have relatively few of these stars, or have only the stars of the small variety (never get more than 1/2"), almost always report "they don't seem to cause any visible problems in my tank..."

If you find that they grow larger than 1/4 to 1/2" or you are convinced that these stars are the source the problem with your Tubipora (as opposed to cleaning up a slowly failing colony), though, there have been successful reports of using the Harlequin Shrimp to remove these cryptic stars (e.g., also on the GARF site http://www.garf.org/news28p1.html#star). If you're really set on removing these sea stars from your tank, that is probably the best way to go, because these stars are primarily nocturnal and so cryptic that you're almost guaranteed to miss some in any manual removal attempt. The Harlequin Shrimp will do a much better job than you will in finding all the sea stars in your tank if you're determined to remove them, but when sea stars become scarce in your tank, you'll need to start buying small sea stars to feed the shrimp, because I have never heard of one being kept alive for any length of time without sea stars on which to feed....

SOURCE: http://www.reefs.org/library/article/coral_eating_starfish.html

Anthony Calfo said this:

Asterina sea stars have been accused, unfairly at times, for preying on coral tissue. While some individuals appear to eat some desirable reef invertebrates, the problem may be a simple matter of an opportunistic predator adapting to a change in the available, preferred foods (worms, algae).

Returning to our example of the common, small Asterina species found in some reef tanks, these sea stars in recent years have suffered, unfairly I might add, the reputation of being risky or just plain un-safe in the reef. This is interesting because for many years prior to that, they were not only regarded as harmless, but beneficial! What happened? Did they all change their voter registrations overnight? No, the answer really is quite simple. It also explains why some other "controversial" reef invertebrates have contradictory reputations like Mithrax/Mithraculus crabs. Many such creatures are opportunistic feeders. While they favor one type of prey that is convenient or popular to us, like sand bed worms, brown diatoms or bubble algae, they will adapt to eating other food items following the reduction or absence of a preferred food item. Thus, the reef keeper with a persistent growth of microalgae in a garden reef display will likely have less trouble with misbehaving omnivores than another aquarist with an aggressively skimmed and scrubbed tank that supports little growth of the matter. In a phrase, the hungrier that a so-called "reef-safe" creature gets, the less "reef-safe" that creature becomes. In the case of Asterina, many years ago during the bare-bottomed, nutrient poor Berlin style era of reef keeping, reef husbandry with early protein skimmers and limited nutrient export processes was not as efficient as it is today; diatoms and other nutritious growths grew quickly in our tanks. And Asterina were not considered un-safe by hobbyists.

http://www.reefkeeping.com/issues/2004-06/ac/feature/index.php

Personally, I've never had a problem with the smaller varieties and I've never had one of the larger varieties (nor have I personally seen the larger variety before in my tank or in anybody elses tank and I've seen many tanks over the years).

I have links to several more Starfish articles here in the resource library.
 
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I have had a problem with one of the smaller varieties eating tubipora musica polyps. I found two such individuals mowing right through the center of my coral. I removed those two and the problem went away. The coral has subsequently regrown the lost polyps.

I have never had the problem since, though I find one of these stars occasionally. Maybe none of them have found this coral since then?

As far as the harlequin shrimp goes, my question is: Once the shrimp has cleaned your tank of a. stars, how are you going to get it back out of there again? These shrimp don't really belong in a mixed-reef tank and they will starve once they've cleaned house.
 
As far as the harlequin shrimp goes, my question is: Once the shrimp has cleaned your tank of a. stars, how are you going to get it back out of there again? These shrimp don't really belong in a mixed-reef tank and they will starve once they've cleaned house.

You would have to buy a starfish, wait for the shrimp to feed, and then move the starfish and shrimp to a species only tank.
 
Yeah, I guess you could bait a trap with a star, if you could get the thing to stay in the trap.

Okay, nevermind. Shrimp away.
 
Wow,
Thanks for all the information. You guys are always great. I guess the bottom line for the Asternia is watch and see how they do with my corals. I would love to add a Harlaquin but it kind of defeats my initial intention unless I start another tank down the line for him. It sure is funny how a person can get so picky about little things yet we strive to keep others going.
thanks,
Brian
 
About keeping the harlequin shrimp, I have kept a harlequin in my 125 gallon reef for almost 2 years now just make sure you keep star fish in there to eat. keep in mind with big star fish like sand sifters and linkia they eat a leg at a time not really ever actually killing the star.
I guess I have been ok with buying stars to feed my shrimp because I can get just about any kind of starfish at the LFS for $6 and I only need to ad one every month or two...

Matt
 

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