Probe location

[mojoreef]

Ok I dont like the way I have my probes installed (inline from a pump in the first chamber of my sump) so I decided to find another location and started to think about it, now I cant figure which would be the best place to put them to get the most accurate reading from the tank.
whatcha all think?? in the tank?? inline with a drain?, Hmmm can think of a down side for all.


MIke

 

[kimoyo]

Mike asking a question...thats funny.

In the tank...but since most people don't like the look, how about in your weir? The water in the weir just came out of the tank...not sure how your lights are placed and if it will affect your temp probe. I just think it would be better to monitor your fish from the tank instead of the remote location of the sump.

Paul

 

[mojoreef]

I thought about that but I think the water would be to hot and to airated, having just come over the top. I like the tank idea but worry about snails and algae screwing around with them.

Mike

 

[Illusion]

Mike,

why not install the probes Nice and clean like S. Weast has done... I like the way his probes are installed... http://oregonreef.com/images/photos/p_040_l.jpg Mount them right into your plumbing..

James

 

[mojoreef]

James thats exactly how I had my probes mounted and what worries me. I had some free time on the weekend so I went ahead and made a change. I made a little probe holder out of black acrylic and set it in the tank so the probes would be about 6 to 8 inches deep and shaded from any light and surface heat.
Well thier were definately some changes. Biggest one was the ORP, it dropped almost a 100 points from 485 to 380, I would imagine from the airation caused by the drains. I have a ozone unit controlled by it, so big change.
Temp went up about a degree and balanced out with the other two temp devices I had. Temp is a big one two as it is the reference marker for both ph and orp.
last was the ph it went up by a full point and a half.

So lesson of the day, if you use probes, especially as controllers, pick you placement correctly.


MIke

 

[MtnDewMan]

Give the ORP a week to adjust, maybe it lowered as part of the change that you made. I know those ORP probes take time to balance out.

 

[mojoreef]

Yea usually it takes about 24 hours for both orp and ph to settle out, its been a couple of days, bt we will see as time goes by.


Mike

 

[DonW]

I've been avoiding this one, having a hard time holding back. But any ways what have you figured out?

Don

 

[mojoreef]

I listed the results up a couple posts Don


Mike

 

[DonW]

Thats a big change in orp. Was your ozone comming on at all before?

Don

 

[NaH2O]

Mike,

why not install the probes Nice and clean like S. Weast has done... I like the way his probes are installed... http://oregonreef.com/images/photos/p_040_l.jpg Mount them right into your plumbing..

James

James, I wonder if the same issue would arise as being in the sump? Too much aeration from the drains giving a different reading than what is actually in the tank?

 

[Illusion]

Nikki,

To me I feel that there is always going to me some margin for error... It all depends on the probe and mfg... Placement may have an Issue so critical things such as ORP but for pH if your getting a phony reading from being placed in PVC then what is really the pH in the tank? With the logic of somthing like this Every area of the tank in theory could have a different pH level... Me personally I liked the Idea of mouting the probes in the PVC as It gives me the reading of what water is being Fed to the tank where as being placed in the sump really only gives the values of the sump which for most is 20-30g or so... If we want the most accurate measurement and location really matters then we should be looking at placing the probe in the tank physically as that is where we want the levels to be maintained and not in the sump... pH can drop .2 just if the amount of travel time it takes to get to the tank... Not saying it does but It can... Being in the PVC as Weast has to me is probably the closest place to being inside the tank as we can possibly get without being in the tank..

Just my .02,
James

 

[mojoreef]

Nope Don it wasnt, still not really but close.

James Mine were mounted in pipes just like Steves, for quite a while now to. I think taking reading of the water going back to the tank is not a good idea. It means that the water has been treated already, skimmer has airated (orp rise) chiller has been in play (temp lower) along with a whole host of other things that could make a big difference. Also the temp probe is the reference probe for both orp and PH so it compounds.
Having the probes in pvc is cool and I dont see a problem with that, its more of which water are you monitoring. Thats basically why I through up the question. Truly its hard to figure that out with out some kind of consenquence. In the tank is the only way I can really figure that makes any sence at all with the fewest problems. Maybe in the closed loop?? if the water goes down the drain line first that in itself can make all sorts of changes.


Mike

 

[NaH2O]

I'm bringing this one back from the dead, as I have my new AquaController2.

Mike - I wondered how you still like having the probes in the tank?

I don't think I can hide mine very well in the tank, so the sump will likely be where they go. What I am wondering is which part of my sump I should place them? The way my sump is designed, I have the drains from the tank in the first compartment and that's pretty much it, as it serves to settle detritus. Would this be the best place for the probes? It would be pre-skimmer, so skimmer aeration wouldn't effect the ORP. The chiller doesn't dump in that compartment, so I think all around, it would be closest to the tank (however, I do realize it still isn't perfect). Right now I'm not using the "controller" portion for pH or ORP, but I'd still like to be as close to accurate as I can.

 

[Angelscrx]

NIkki, would the drop from the tank to the sump still get some aeration done as well. I would think that in the overflow process, the down pipe and then the drop into the sump you would get some air mixed in. Not as good mixture as a skimmer but sure nothing like the tank itself?

 

[NaH2O]

I thought about that, as well. I thought if I stuck the ORP probe in the front corner, it would be furthest away from the drain pipes. I just don't think I could get the probe in the tank without it looking ghastly. Plus, if algae grows on it, that wouldn't be very accurate either.

 

[mojoreef]

Well that was the problem, now my tank is large so what goes on in the sump or frag tank is not really exactly what goes on in the main. My frag system has almost a two degree temp difference and I have to set my chiller at 78 to get it to maintain the system at 80. Also with the water dumping into the sump from the tank I was getting elevated DO and lower temp readies the from the main to, also pH. I have had my probes in the main for a while now and it seems to be the best location for my tank, I clean them once a weeks and that seems to be keeping them accurate. I would suggest doing testing on your system, basically you want the probes to read what is going on in the main, so just make sure that the sump water is giving you an accurate representation of that.


Mike

 

[Angelscrx]

Great suggestions. Do you think it would be good idea to build a black acrylic box for the probes to hang on the side to keep light off of them? Maybe have an open bottom or drill holes on the sides? Or you could cut fingers along the back side or something? Just trying to think outside the box :lol:

 

[mojoreef]

that close to what I did Angel. I got a strip of acrylic and drilled it for three probes, then attached that to a peice of black acrylic that acts as a shield from the lights and from me having to see the probes in the tank. Next time I have them out for cleaning I will take a peek.


Mike

 

[Angelscrx]

Sounds like a good plan Mike.