Sailfin Sick

[Ohgee]

Question for anyone,

I've had a sailfin tang now for about 5-6 weeks and he was doing very well for a long time until the last couple days when he has started to thrash himself around the tank.

I can't see any reason or obvious signs of illness and was wonderign if anyone hase ever seen this or might know what I need to do. If he keeps this up I'm afraid he's going to die.

So far he is simply tearing his fins up but I think it's bcoming more sever.

Any suggestions would be appreciated.

Duane

 

[NaH2O]

Duane - I'm going to move this to the Fish forum, for better attention. Perhaps Steve or Terry can post some of their insight.

Just to get a little more info out there...what are the other tank inhabitants, what size tank, how are the water parameters, were there any new fish introductions recently? Do you have a Quarantine tank you can move the fish to?

 

[Ohgee]

Thanks Niki,

A little background, this fish is in a 50gal tank by himself. Onlything with himis a few crabs, snails, and soft corals. all the parameters are pretty much in the ball park except the kalk dipped a little to 2.89. He is actually getting worse by the minute and hope he makes it through the night.

I turned the lights off and he seemed to calmdown a little but don't think that is going to fix the problem

We will see
Duane

 

[steve-s]

How large is the fish? A 50 gallon tank is far too small for this species. If cramped they will quickly become severely stressed.

Please post the actual numbers for water quality and chemistry. That is not meant to question your abilities, just some numbers would help verify things. A 2.89 mEq/l alkalinity isn't going to bother the fish but a sharp increase in pH would.

Is the fish aimlessly running into things or rubbing violently against tank items/decorations?

Cheers
Steve

 

[Ohgee]

Steve,

Thanks foryour time. I fully understand this size tank is way tosmall for an adult fish. It was only a temperary arrangement till he grew a bit. He is only about 2.5" head to tail.

ca - 420
Kh - 2.89
Ph - honestly don't have a kit to test for. I know I should have a meter but haven't been able to afford one yet.
everything else reads as 0 but I have learned that it's hard to test for nitrite, nitrate and amonia also reads aszero.

to your last question he is swimming in circles very fast and thrashing himself against the LR .

hope that helps

One more thing tank has been up and running for about 4months and was started with LR and Water out of main tank. yes lots of water changes have occured since start.

 

[Ohgee]

One more thing

I just found a salifert test kit for PH and it tested out at somewhere between 8.0 and 8.3. close to middle of the road so I would say 8.2 maybe.

I think thats about right but not real sure about accuracy of the test kit, it is rather old,maybe a year old.

Duane

 

[steve-s]

Tsk tsk an accurate pH test is a must

but this isn't meant to be a lecture. . Check the package though, there should be an expirey date. Was the color a lighter green, darker or closer to blue?

To be honest the tangs sounds severaly stressed although I would not rule out a parasite. Has anything wet been added since the tang 5 weeks ago? Are there any indications of spots, strange stringy bits, excess slime, scales on end or redness on the tang? Eyes clear or cloudy? When was the last water change? What are you feeding, is it eating?

Cheers
Steve

 

[Ohgee]

I fully understand Steve, I have been putting off the meter far too long now. Exp 08-2007, color was a pretty light green but darker than the 8.0

nothing has been added to the tank since his introduction, he has been eating some of the macro that got loose into the tank but mostly the nori. He will actually eat out of my hand as I'm trying to put into holder. He was an avid eater up until today.

Hard to get a good look at him in his current state but the back half of him looks a little redish now that you mention it. He has lots of holes in his fins now and some scratches.

I honestly hope it isn't stress becuase only thing I could think of is the size of the tank and if thats it I'll hate myself. I wanted to be sure he was healthy and able to stand up to other fish in main tank before adding him.

Thanks for you input, maybe if he makes it till tomarrow I'll try and get some pictures.


I forgot, last water change was 3 days ago,I did 5gal with same water I did 25gals in main tank.

 

[Scooterman]

I had one that when it grew to about that size, my 5ft 100g tank was getting small, if it is fish is circling or swimming rapidly end to end restless he may be too big. Otherwise he may actually be sick, mine ate much kelp, spectrum pellets & everything else lol. I saw one thing from reading about these, they need lots of room, they are made to continuously move & fast. Hopefully steve can figure this out for you worst case but good for it, would be fine a large home.

 

[steve-s]

I do have large concerns about the fish in this tank size but I am even more concerned about the redness you mention. It could be from self injury but I am wondering if it's the cause of the behavior and not the result of.

Have a look at the pics in this thread and see if it comes close....
Need Advice On Quarantine Tank!

Cheers
Steve

 

[Ohgee]

Steve,
I've tried to watch himallday and be able to get a photo of him but he isn't cooperating. The photo Isawon that link showed more of a red spot, My tang actually has no spots but looks almost tinted on the back half of him.

You might be right in the tank size causing it as well as the redness coming from his selfabuse, Only thing that worries me is he was doing wonderful up till last 2 days. He showed no sign of stress and ate wonderfully. Now is there is no way I can add him to main tank is his current state. The other fish would have him dead in minutes.

He actually seems a little better in the way he's swimming today but his state of health worries me. He hasn't eaten and has stayed hid most the day. I have kept the lights low and wonder if that is actually helping or not.

anyway thanks for your help and advice, hopefully I can get him back to health enough to get him moved in couple days.

Duane

 

[steve-s]

The photo Isawon that link showed more of a red spot, My tang actually has no spots but looks almost tinted on the back half of him.

If it was like someone lightly dusted the tang with red/pink spray paint, Vibrio is stil a good possibility. Any sign of scale loss/oddities?

Can you do a few large water changes today and tomorrow? Might actually be pH related given your difficulty with the test kit. Please be sure you test the new SW to be sure the chemitry is correct first and it has already mixed a day ahead. Do a 55-30% water change today and one tomorrow unless you need new water made. Then do one tomorrow and one Monday, don't use newly mixed water.

You might be right in the tank size causing it as well as the redness coming from his selfabuse, Only thing that worries me is he was doing wonderful up till last 2 days. He showed no sign of stress and ate wonderfully. Now is there is no way I can add him to main tank is his current state. The other fish would have him dead in minutes.

You've confused me here, is this a QT tank or a display tank the tangs in?

Cheers
Steve

 

[Ohgee]

Sorry for the confusion Steve,

It isn't a Q tank, I started it as a softy tank then saw this fish at LPS, I wasn't ever going to put fish in it but I thought it would be a good place to start himout and then move to 150gal later.

The painted description you gave almost perfectly discribes what I've been trying to get you to understand.

As far as the water changes, I was one step ahead of you. Already got water made and am doing a 20gal tonight and prob another 20 tomarrow. thank god I have an RO/DI system

I'll try and keep you posted on process

Thanks again Steve
Duane

 

[steve-s]

If after the water changes you see no improvement, you should transfer to a proper QT and treat as a Vibrio infection. Since there are no lesions (?) present, either the PARA mentioned in the thread above or formalin dips will be needed. If lesions (bloody sores) are present, you will need to opt for Nitrofurazone. Post back on Tuesday after the two water changes are done with any improvements or not. Sooner if it gets worse.

Cheers
Steve

 

[Ohgee]

For what ever reason He seems tobe coming around. Actually out again and eating. The redness has deminished and he is eating again.

I just completed the second water change,which tells me it probably had something to do with the last water change. Only thing I can't explain is why nothing showed in other tank.

I'll keepan eye on things next couple days as I don't have to work, and keepyou posted on any changes.

Thanks again for you assistance
Duane

 

[Scooterman]

Keep hitting the wc's if it is helping you may have some problems not showing up on your test kits, this is good news for sure.

 

[NaH2O]

Great news!

 

[steve-s]

Good news, yes. Definately keep up the water changes. Please also post some water test results. Did you get the pH test sorted out?

Cheers
Steve

 

[steve-s]

Update :?:

Cheers
Steve

 

[Ohgee]

Sorry it has taken me so long to get back to an update for you all.

He is getting much better without any real signs that anything was wrong expect maybe stress. So I got him calmed down and the redness gone and he's even eating like he used to. Still no signs of actual sores or leasons, so I figure to move him in a couple days to the 150gal.

Thanks for your assistance, I would have thought at his size he would have done fine in a 4' tank, guess we all have to learn from time to time.

Duane