Setup of my 150g tall? not sure what i need?

[the6goat6man6]

It's not just the sump, my main display has the most, well i think we are a little off the original thread! started as setting up my 150, now fixing my40? go figure

I think i may just wait it out and till the 150 is up and runnig

 

[the6goat6man6]

Back to my 150 (if anyone is still there)

I think i want to keep softies and LPS.

I was looking at lighting, and found nice one with:
2-250w 15k Metal halide
4-65w PC actinics
6-lunar LEDs
5-cooling fans
Total 760watts
Still not sure how much flow to have, i was thinking against sand but still not sure. I really like the look of the black sand with all that color behind it(more natural look). I don't mind vacing the sand, thats part of the fun! I don't really do much sand vac now, snails do that part.

Does anyone else have any ideas on using sand, a man i talked to in my area said, once a year he divides his tank into 1/3. One at a time he takes out 1/3, sand and all rocks. Then cleans 1/3, syphone out the sand rinse out debris and puts it all back together. 1/3 one week at a time! again once a year? is that enough time for bac. and such?


And for the rock? Could I put 75-100lbs in to start? I've noticed alot of corals are offered attached to rocks. Not really sure how to attach things under water, beside stacking!

I think i will do a 55gal fuge and a 55gal sump. I am going to put my fuge up, slightly higher than the main display and alow it to be a gravity system, as not to hurt the pods and such entering the display!

Not sure what size return to use i have a 950gph, but think that maybe to small, maybe use it to feed the fuge?

 

[Krish]

Back to my 150 (if anyone is still there)

I think i want to keep softies and LPS.

I was looking at lighting, and found nice one with:
2-250w 15k Metal halide
4-65w PC actinics
6-lunar LEDs
5-cooling fans
Total 760watts
Still not sure how much flow to have, i was thinking against sand but still not sure. I really like the look of the black sand with all that color behind it(more natural look). I don't mind vacing the sand, thats part of the fun! I don't really do much sand vac now, snails do that part.

Does anyone else have any ideas on using sand, a man i talked to in my area said, once a year he divides his tank into 1/3. One at a time he takes out 1/3, sand and all rocks. Then cleans 1/3, syphone out the sand rinse out debris and puts it all back together. 1/3 one week at a time! again once a year? is that enough time for bac. and such?

And for the rock? Could I put 75-100lbs in to start? I've noticed alot of corals are offered attached to rocks. Not really sure how to attach things under water, beside stacking!

I think i will do a 55gal fuge and a 55gal sump. I am going to put my fuge up, slightly higher than the main display and alow it to be a gravity system, as not to hurt the pods and such entering the display!

Not sure what size return to use i have a 950gph, but think that maybe to small, maybe use it to feed the fuge?

Snails won't prevent you from needing to vacuum. Snails will eat some of the crap in the sand, but they do poop as well so they are putting waste right back in the sandbed so vacuuming is essential. As for that guy who says he divides his tank in 1/3, I've never heard of that one before lol. I'd imagine if he is taking the rock out of the tank and cleaning it (the 1/3) each time he does that he will cause a mini cycle from the potential die-off he may experience from the rock being out of the water and scrubbed or whatever he does to it. I'd get more feedback on that but for me personally, I wouldn't try that approach.

On your rock, you can start out with 75-100 lbs if you like. It is totally up to you. The only problem you will encounter is if you decide to add more rock later. Doing this will prolong your cycle as the new rock may experience some die-off and so it will have to go through the cycling process all over again. Usually it's best to get all the rock you want from the get go and let it all cycle together and be done with it. Where the corals are concerned, some people use frag plugs that the coral is attached to that they push in the rock, some people will life a piece of rock out of the tank and superglue it to the rock. That's how I attached all of my coral frags...with glue. It almost instantly cures when it hits that salt water.

Flow, that 950 gph may be sufficient. It all depends on your overflow and if you bump it up from the 600 gph you have now. However as you mentioned, that may not be a bad option for your fuge.

In any event, hopefully a few others will chime in. I'd love for you to get some feedback from others to get more options. These things I am suggesting are just my thoughts which I don't profess to be the right and only way. It would be good to get some ideas from others as well so that you can choose what method you think you like best.

 

[the6goat6man6]

i am worried about the lights, i read that M. halides can raise the temp by 15 deg? I am worried that i will need a chiller, can i run an A.C. in the room that my equipment will be setup. I am building a room to hold all this.

 

[Krish]

i am worried about the lights, i read that M. halides can raise the temp by 15 deg? I am worried that i will need a chiller, can i run an A.C. in the room that my equipment will be setup. I am building a room to hold all this.

Not all people need chillers. On that 75 gal I had with the dual 250 MH's, the fans kept the temperature down or should I say, within the appropriate range. I got the chiller just for the extra piece of mind. It all depends on the room temp, heat from pumps etc. It's something you probably wouldn't know till it was up and running. Another thing I did was remove the backing I had on my stand so the sump could get some cool air. Many things you can do but you wouldn't know till you get it up andvrunning. Now if you keep your room temp at a high temp then of course it will work against you.

 

[the6goat6man6]

I mentioned before that i was building an addition to my place and was putting a room in to hold everything, 48inx24 aquarium "in the wall", everything else wil be in this room with no real encloser. I will not be putting any heat in this room, i am also considering putting a small A/C unit in. There will also be air vent to the outside to allow fresh air in (I had a problem with ph once and found out it was just a matter of CO2). I am hopping that with fresh air vents and A/C unit will compisate for the M. halides. You think the
2-250wMH will be enough for LPS?

 

[NWDiver]

I've been ghosting along as Krish is doing a great job!
That is plenty of light for lps Start them low in the tank and move them up until they, and hopefully you, are happy.
Getting rid of the moisture as well as bringing fresh air in is a great plan.
I run 2 250HQI and 2 96w supp over a 120. I have never exceeded 81F. My lights turn off if the tank temp goes above 81. Last summer The lights turned off twice in a non air conditioned room.
If you are cooling the room and you have fans over the system you should have no issues.

 

[the6goat6man6]

how are you turning the lights off when the temp is too high?

I've been ghosting along as Krish is doing a great job!
That is plenty of light for lps Start them low in the tank and move them up until they, and hopefully you, are happy.
Getting rid of the moisture as well as bringing fresh air in is a great plan.
I run 2 250HQI and 2 96w supp over a 120. I have never exceeded 81F. My lights turn off if the tank temp goes above 81. Last summer The lights turned off twice in a non air conditioned room.
If you are cooling the room and you have fans over the system you should have no issues.

 

[NWDiver]

Using an Apex controller, spiffy bit of hardware.
How ironic that I had a return pump problem tonight. The Apex sent me an email every few minutes to tell me that the water was too cold, but I was not watching my phone. GRRRRRRRRR!
I dropped to 74.1 then back to 79 in very short order. I guess we will see how tough my corals are :-(

 

[chastjw71]

How ironic is that Todd, while your at my house helping me replace my hot water heater, you have heat problems in your tank??? HUMMMM, ok sorry for hijacking, continue on.

Also I'm tagging along as I am building this exact tank, I just drilled the back wall for the overflow and returns, the bottom IS temperd, but the walls ARE NOT. 1" overflows on each side of tank. and 3/4" returns, one on inside of each overflow box. I'll be using a mag 9.5 as a return, with powerheads as supplemental flow. I'm using a breeder 40 (36X18) as my sump with a reef octopus nwp200 as my skimmer, with a built in refuge for chateo. I'll be starting a build thread as I get a little further along. My lighting will be duel MH 250 watt with T-5 atinic all on icecap ballast (already have em)

 

[the6goat6man6]

I wasreading up on flow, i read the fuge only needs3-4x, and berlin sump(only skimmer) needs only what the skimmer can handle, the rest is made up with wave makers or a closed loop system. I was thinking of usin my mag 9.5 for the fuge, whitch will be on it's own loop. Sump and slimmer will be seperate loop also. Thought of doing a 2 part fuge, one for macro and the other for DSB? not sure yet, don't really want to put alot of sand in the display.

 

[Krish]

I wasreading up on flow, i read the fuge only needs3-4x, and berlin sump(only skimmer) needs only what the skimmer can handle, the rest is made up with wave makers or a closed loop system. I was thinking of usin my mag 9.5 for the fuge, whitch will be on it's own loop. Sump and slimmer will be seperate loop also. Thought of doing a 2 part fuge, one for macro and the other for DSB? not sure yet, don't really want to put alot of sand in the display.

Yea, you can go pretty much in any direction with a sump and fuge. It kinda depends on what you are trying to achieve with either. One thing I see a lot of people try to do is use their return coming from their sump have as much flow as possible to make up for flow in the tank, but isn't always the best idea especially if you have a skimmer etc in your sump. You don't just want water whizzing by your skimmer and it not get a good chance at grabbing some of the passing nasty water. With fuges, I've read that chaeto for example, loves to be tumbling so it would need sufficient flow to accomplish this, then if you go with a fuge where you want to harvest pods and so forth, too much flow may send them everywhere, but where you want them LOL! So it's a toss up. Glad you are planning this thing out slowly though and discussing all of your concerns. It will make for less stress down the road.

Not sure if you've browsed this before as I know I sent you a link to here on the over the top closed loop, but if you are looking for some sump/fuge ideas (as in how to design one that will suit you best) take a look here and go to the left column where it says "Varied sumps" and check out a few of them. Some really nice ideas. Melevsreef.com | Acrylic Sumps & Refugiums

 

[the6goat6man6]

would a sand bed work the same with shallow water? I know it's prob a DUMB question, i think it will. I am thinking of dividing the fuge in two. One half for macro and the other half for sand bed. I am also going to put the fuge up high, above the display, so the critters don't get sent throught a blender (could this be a source of nitrates, i have alot of critters in my fuge) or skimmed. I am going to use the sump Berlin style.

ok so:
200 gph pump-fuge (approx 4x turn over)
? 300ghp sump (skimmer only)( approx 6x turn over)
looking @ 4-1400gph koralias (switching only 2 on at once)
& 2-1400gph koralias behind rock work

6100gph total flow=40.6667gph turn over for the display, is this too much for softies and LPS, or even the sand should I tone it down? smaller koralias?

Also how big of a heater will i need, I almost forgot that?

 

[Krish]

would a sand bed work the same with shallow water? I know it's prob a DUMB question, i think it will. I am thinking of dividing the fuge in two. One half for macro and the other half for sand bed. I am also going to put the fuge up high, above the display, so the critters don't get sent throught a blender (could this be a source of nitrates, i have alot of critters in my fuge) or skimmed. I am going to use the sump Berlin style.

ok so:
200 gph pump-fuge (approx 4x turn over)
? 300ghp sump (skimmer only)( approx 6x turn over)
looking @ 4-1400gph koralias (switching only 2 on at once)
& 2-1400gph koralias behind rock work

6100gph total flow=40.6667gph turn over for the display, is this too much for softies and LPS, or even the sand should I tone it down? smaller koralias?

Also how big of a heater will i need, I almost forgot that?

Put it like this, if that was my tank knowing how I go, I'd probably have at least 10,000 gph of flow :rofl: You should be more than fine with that flow for softies and LPS's. It will all be about placement. You can have all the flow in the world, but not placed properly and it's pointless. I will hop on the computer in a sec and sketch something for you real quick. Its a really cool way to direct two power heads that gives you some really nice coverage and random flow. Quite a few people arrange their power heads this way.

On the sandbed in the fuge, I don't see how the water level would possibly affect anything. Once the sand is completely submerged, the you should be fine. You just don't want the water level too low as I would imagine it could hinder flow a bit, but other than that, don't see an issue.

Heaters, hmmm....I live in the Bahamas. Heaters are illegal here :lol:. You know never used one for a saltwater setup so don't know a whole lot about them. I did start a thread not too long ago on them when I was planning out an open top nano that I figured would get too cold sitting under an air vent and from what I can remember, I think some sort of temp controller was suggested for a safety precaution in the event the heater stuck open or something. I'll see if I can find that thread real quick for you and also, get you a quick sketch on the powerhead placement.

 

[Krish]

K...Here you go. Thread on the heaters where they discussed the controllers http://www.reeffrontiers.com/forums/f14/heater-small-tank-58215/


And the picture on flow. The idea is to have one powerhead on either side of the tank with them pointed towards the center of the front glass at the same spot. This causes the flow to colide with one another which gives you great random flow and pretty good coverage. Something to try to see how it works in your case. Rockwork etc will all play a factor on how well any placement of flow will work, but something I figured I'd throw out for you as an option to try.





Edit: Realized I had a picture already in this thread with the placement. Here it is again. You can see the position of the the two Tunzes . Another cool thing in that last picture. I don't know if you have OCD as bad as me, but if you look to the top left of the tank, you will see an acrylic blue box. That is my overflow which is really a clear overflow box with black backing (CPR). I wanted it to match the background so it wouldn't be so noticeable so I got some acrylic and made my own cover





Uploaded with ImageShack.us

 

[chastjw71]

If your going to use chateo for your Macro in your fuge then you can also do a sand bed under that as the chateo will float, and like Krish said in a perfect world the chateo does best tumbling, I dont have enough flow through my fuge to do this and my chateo still seems to flourish. So in a since you have two different fuge's in one, lower level with your deep sand bed, with the chateo floating above it, and your "bugs" also do great in here, hiding, living, breading in the chateo so another added on bonus. Also I leave my fuge light on 24hrs, some people just leave it 16hrs on a reverse timing from the display, this helps even out the PH over the 24hr period. most people say 2-3 watts per gallon on the heater. This being said I've gone a little over kill and have an 800 watt with controller for my 150 tall, at the time being it is on a 300 gallon temp tank at NWDiver's shop and seems to be doing good.

 

[Krish]

I just started this poll just now that I figure might interest you. Might want to follow.

http://www.reeffrontiers.com/forums/f36/poll-chaeto-how-you-use-59656/

 

[the6goat6man6]

thanks, i will keep aneye on it. hows your back,hope your felling better, gonna be a long recovery. take it easy and help us newbies, with our little addiction!!LOL

I just started this poll just now that I figure might interest you. Might want to follow.

http://www.reeffrontiers.com/forums/f36/poll-chaeto-how-you-use-59656/

 

[Krish]

thanks, i will keep aneye on it. hows your back,hope your felling better, gonna be a long recovery. take it easy and help us newbies, with our little addiction!!LOL

Haha! Yea, I will be around to help with your little addictions! Too bad it put mine on hold for a bit, but I guess it just gives me more time to plan out what I really want.

 

[the6goat6man6]

yes sir, I'm sure you will wow us

Haha! Yea, I will be around to help with your little addictions! Too bad it put mine on hold for a bit, but I guess it just gives me more time to plan out what I really want.