Table Recession

[mojoreef]

SPS type corals use nutrient for the building a tissue, in the case of a SPS that is very little. With the coral rtning, the possible use of nutrients might give it a bit of a chance although I laos have never heard of this technique. I am of the school frag it and save what you can. But this is worth a try.

Anthony got a couple of questions for ya,

Imagine, if you will, that you have perfect lighting, whatever that means. Most popular corals that we keep are only sustained by the products of photosynthesis in the 70-85% range. The best we can hope for is just over 90%... in fact, I'm not sure that anyone can definitively say which if any coral is wholly zooxanthellate-autotrophic.

In the wild photo accounts for about 98% of food intake (by most studies). It only takes a split second to activate a photo cycle, so again in the wild corals are used to intence light broken up constantly with clouds. I would guess to say we are pretty close to that intencity if the average is taken into play. But I agree that it does not meet the total budjet required.
Since SPS type corals dont have a developed nematocyst capturing prey is kind of useless, thus they have developed the means to slime net capture bacteria and to absorb nutrients through thier tissue. If we take this into account and then add the fact that our tanks are full of bacteria and detritus (which is taken by almost all corals) why would we need to add anymore food to feed these types of corals. If the sps coral gets between say 90 to 98% of its total energy requirements from photo, and the balance is more then taken care of by slime netting and absorbtion wouldn the addition of extra food just fertilize the zoo population?? the coral will shut down zoo production just as easy for to much food as quick as it would from photo.

Mike

 

[Anthony Calfo]

very good points/comments Mike.

Hmm... some very neat places to go with this thread. First of all, I have read data that runs the gamut on derivations of nutrition by cnidarians. As posted above, I clearly lean towards the school of thought that most corals are not even close to being fully autotrophic. I believe this from practical experience and observations... but not scientific trials to be sure. From some papers presented by Alf Nilsen, the Germans got the notion to experiment with nitrate solutions... and they found appreciable and consistent results (improvements in color and growth).

And just as Mike has pointed out - there is such a thing as "too much" of a good thing. Excessive doses of nitrate solutions "overfertilized" zooxanthellae.

How does this translate to our aquaria? Its tough to say. What kind of aquarium do you keep? A bare-bottomed display with aggressive skimming and zero detectable nitrates? That doesnt sound good to me. Or how about a DSB display with inadequate water flow and very high DOC levels? Yikes... that sounds bad too But if both such systems suffer from "starving corals" and symptoms we might like to ascribe to attrition, will the addition of a nitrate solution help both similarly? Probably not. Its a much bigger issue here.

I'm still not sold on the ability of artificial light to come close enough to par with natural sunlight. And I think that most every reef aquarium needs some sort of supplemenmtal feeding. Whether thats attained by sand stirring (dubious but helpful to some), nitrates (lingering or dosed), experimental slurries (weak for most corals) or some other means is still a wide open field. I sure dont have the answer. I have methodologies that I've used for years that work well for me (largely based on deep, staic DSBs, huge refugia and low bioloads)... but they certainly are not the only means/way to a successful display.

I've been waiting for years for the educated masses of aquarists to ease up on the excessive debates about the "best" artifical reef lighting and focus some of that energy on feeding studies.

Mike... I volunteer you to quit your day job and begin work on this immediately. Dont worry about paying your bills: I'm going to start selling my body buy the pound for hire as the worlds shortest male exotioc dancer. I hope you like eating PB&J sandwhiches

No worries... its all for a greater good.

Anthony

 

[mojoreef]

Ok well that thought sure could change the topic at any debate. lol
Anthony I dont think aquarium lighting really takes care of all the nutritional needs of a coral either. I always refer folks to look at the ammount of the tissue on the coral to really tell what kind of additional food it requires. The more the tissue the more the requirement. In the case of a SPS thier is very little tissue and the requirement is low, BUT still thier. On these particular corals I believe that bacteria capture through sliming and nutrient absorbing does the job more then enough.
As one keeps corals that have a higher demand for an external source of nutrition one should begin to look towards direct feeding. I just hate to see folks put extra food in thier tanks when thier is already so much available.

I tell ya what, I will keep my day job and you keep your cloths on, lol


Mike

 

[Anthony Calfo]

[I tell ya what, I will keep my day job and you keep your cloths on, lol]

drat! Now what am I going to do with this sequin "Reef Frontiers" thong that Chuck sent me? Oh, wait... I think I have a visit to Seattle coming soon... I'll wear it at my next presentation for y'all

Ewwww... I think I just grossed myself out

 

[NaH2O]

LOLOLOL - you may not be the only one grossed out. The funny and ultimately scarey thing is Chuck sent the sequined item . Chuck has been holding out on us!

If you don that apparel to the meeting, you may have only a few people in attendance.....however, this may make a nice photo for your biography.

 

[CarlaW]

The last few posts in this thread sure lend a new meaning to table recession, don't they.

 

[mojoreef]

Man I am really surprised Chuck gave that puppy up, now he doesnt have the complete set anymore, lol
Anthony why dont you take a shot and then you can have your picture in the back of the book just like Eric???? rofl


Mike

 

[Anthony Calfo]

Mike... thats wrong... just wrong

 

[FishyinKy]

Much more of a visual guys than I needed. OMG

 

[MtnDewMan]

[I tell ya what, I will keep my day job and you keep your cloths on, lol]

drat! Now what am I going to do with this sequin "Reef Frontiers" thong that Chuck sent me? Oh, wait... I think I have a visit to Seattle coming soon... I'll wear it at my next presentation for y'all

Ewwww... I think I just grossed myself out

Didn't you get the note that came with that package?

From Mojoreef's Private Collection

 

[Curtswearing]

Hey!!! I thought it was agreed, "What happened in Boston, stays in Boston".

 

[mojoreef]

Oh man I was wondering how long it would be until Chuck found this thread..I smell a rat!!!!....Nikki!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Lol




Mike

 

[MtnDewMan]

I have informants around the world, not just in Indiana