The joys of Cyanobacteria

[skywatcher]

Good day all,
For about a Month now I have had a running battle with Red Slime in my Reef tank and have tried two different products (None of which worked) and siphoning the *$#& off of the rocks and substrate. I have just read something that said that cyano can be removed from corals by soaking them in fresh water for one minute. This statement was only referring to Gorgonians but I was wondering if anyone has tried this with other corals? We are also open to any other tips you may have used in your battle with red slime.
Thanks.

 

[btuck]

Just do a search on Cyanobacteria and you will get lots of other threads with people asking the exact same question. Or I'm sure you could just wait until NaH2O comes on and she'll bomb you with links on the stuff.

 

[Krish]

Sorry to hear about your troubles...I've been there with my old setup about a year and a half ago and it wasn't fun! One thing I figured I'd throw out there which has helped me with my new setup is, I made conditions better for algae to grow in my sump rather than the tank which meant, as my tank cycled, the algae grew in the sump (rather than in the tank) and every week, I'd just vaccum most of it out. That continued for a while, but it didn't bother me at all because it wasn't in the main display which I was most concerned about. Eventually it got to a point where it hardly grows anything at all. So what I am getting at is some people harvest algae out of their tank, and use it at their advantage in their sump. Once all available nutrients are used up, the algae would subside. About dipping the corals, I couldn't say. I'm sure someone with more experience will chime in soon. I wish you all the best

 

[mojoreef]

skywatcher that may kill the cyano (and stress the corals) but its not going to stop it from coming right back again. You need to go after the source of it, control that and it should go away for ever.

here are a couple of questions.
What kind of salt mix do you use?
how is the flow in the areas that have the cyano.
Where exactly is the cyano in the tank?
How old are your lights??


Mike

 

[skywatcher]

skywatcher that may kill the cyano (and stress the corals) but its not going to stop it from coming right back again. You need to go after the source of it, control that and it should go away for ever.

here are a couple of questions.
What kind of salt mix do you use?
Coralife scientific grade
how is the flow in the areas that have the cyano.
Quite heavy at the top of the reef and moderate to low on the substrate.
Where exactly is the cyano in the tank?
Just about every level and place.
How old are your lights??
Less than six Months.

Seems as though siphoning is the answer to keeping the stuff down at this point but it's somewhat difficult to remove it from the crevices in the rock.

 

[jsmkmavity]

try turning your lites off for a day or two! sounds too simple i know but just try it! then test for nitrates and work on export of existing N and limiting import of N in the future by finding the source. if you have a canister filter or any othe type of filter that is always in the system that may be a big source. for a couple weeks blow off your rocks and vac your gravel every day but not too deep and change your filters and see your N drop. this will help "clean" the system of existing excess nutrients and not keeping filters in for weeks at a time will help in the future. and as mentioned find the source- water, salt mix, additives, food, or over feeding, over population, or lack of maintainance.

 

[mojoreef]

Cyano will form because their is an abundance of available nitrogen for it. Now cyano doesnt need much as it can fix its own. If you have cyano forming on your corals in would mean that, that part is dead, so hopefully that is not the case. If you have tested for nutrients such as nitrates, nitrites, phosphates and so on and get zero balances then one could assume that you have some nitrogen being exspelled by the substraight its forming on (ex: sand/Lr). This will probibly continue until you have burned off what ever ammount is in their. Cyano is great at binding available N so the syphoning is a good form of exporting.

Got any pictures by chance??


MIke

 

[lebloom]

Just how big of part do your lights play with cyano? I have been fitting this stuff for about 3 or 4 months now. I have used this Red Slime Remover but it keeps coming back in my 75gal tank.

 

[skywatcher]

As of yet I have not done any testing for nitrates or nitrites but I do use Green-X in all of my tanks which seems to do a great job of keeping nitrate, nitrites and phosphates down. I think a test may be in order though. Never gave it a thought that Nitrogen could be expelled by the substrate which is one of the places the cyano seems to love. I had been thinking of removing the crushed aragonite from the front of the reef and replacing it with live sand but I already lose some substrate eveytime I siphon the cyano and would most likely lose even more were it sand as opposed to the larger stuff I have now. The stuff is not growing on my coral but does tend to cover my star and sun polyps in an ugly blood red sheet if I don't keep at it. While it wont grow on live coral directly it seems to have no problem growing on or with some of the green algae in the tank which grows between polyps. That's the reason I had asked if anyone had ever tried a fresh water dip for coral. I would consider leaving the lights off for a few days but then we are back to affecting the corals again not to mention our anemones. I don't have a picture at this time and would have to let it grow without siphoning for a few days to show you the true extent of the stuff which to tell you the truth would make me hang my head in shame. I would also like to take a moment to thank you all for your hekp thus far but keep it coming folks I'm still open to suggestion and hey! after we win this battle you can give my suggestions on how ta kill that monster Bristle Worm lurking under my live rock! *LOL*

 

[NaH2O]

skywatcher - I'm not familiar with Green-X, so I can't comment on its effectiveness for nitrates or phosphates (a quick search showed it is a nitrate and phosphate remover). Until you get to the source of your issue, however, the green-x (or similar products) will only serve to be a bandaid. First, I think some water testing should be done. Let's see what your nitrate levels are, and phosphates, if you have the test. You can do a test on the substraight, as well. Make a pocket in the substraight, and suck out a water sample to test. Larger particle sized substraight, like crushed coral, can trap detritus, which would lead to a nitrate problem. Let's look a little closer at your system (some of these were mentioned eariler, so let's take a peek at them). Can you tell us what size tank? How old is the tank? Do you use RO/DI water? Have you tested your water change water for nitrates? How often and what volume water changes are you performing? What livestock is in the tank? Do you have a skimmer? What and how much are you feeding?

lebloom - old lighting has a shift in spectrum, which can help with algae growth. We had a previous thread that was a little deeper on the subject: Old Bulbs = Algae?

btuck -

 

[Wibbly Pig]

Do you have a picture? Are you sure it's cyano and not dinos? Does it look like this?

If it's more strings of snooty stuff with bubbles in it, then it's dinoflagellates. If it's sheets of stuff then it's cyano.

I had dinos and it finally took bombing the tank with Maracyn to get rid of it.

 

[SWPlantedTank]

I curious to know if you have other desirable algae somewhere in you system? Do you have a sump? I've found algae to be very beneficial to a healthy aquarium, IMO. I think a tank is always going to have some algae, in one way or another. It's Mother Natures Greenex!

 

[payge]

have you tried a "Phosban" reactor?? We had some red slime/cyano algea and after 2 treatments of "chemi-clean" not doing much, we got a Phosban Reactor and it cleared up everything really well

Let us know what goes on

 

[Paul B]

I still get cyano in my reef and it is very old. When this happens as it does every couple of years I have to do a good cleaning with a diatom filter. I could not have a reef with out this filter. I have been using one for almost 40 years (not the same one, I went through four of them) There are too many places in a reef tank where you just really can't clean unless you take some rock out and move the rest around. I take out the rock with the least amount of growth on it and put it in a seperate container along with some corals that I can move easily. That leaves room to move the rest of the corals to one side of the tank. By this point the crystal clear tank looks like a mud storm. I use the diatom filter with a restriction on the outflow hose to create a strong currect then the diatom sucks it out. I repeat it on the other side then I use it in the container where I stored the rock. Of course if you have a DSB you can't do this and I would be at a loss.
In a new tank you don't have to get this crazy but you still have to clean behind the rock. Everything you put in the tank is still there except what comes out with water changes. The solids are for the most part behind and under the rock and needs to be removed at some time. A reef will last forever if this is done periodically. If not, it will fail sooner or later.
I don't necessarilly consider algae or cyano a devastating event to a tank, it is just a sign that some maintenance is overdue. There is a lot of maintenance in this hobby. I can tell my tank is ready for this because I did it about two years ago and I am getting cyano and some growth on the rock that is unsightly. No problem, it will look as good as new with a couple of hours maintenance, which I enjoy anyway.
Good luck.
Paul

 

[KRMNAL1]

Do you have a picture? Are you sure it's cyano and not dinos? Does it look like this?

If it's more strings of snooty stuff with bubbles in it, then it's dinoflagellates. If it's sheets of stuff then it's cyano.

I had dinos and it finally took bombing the tank with Maracyn to get rid of it.

I;m not trying to hijack but I just noticed a rock yesterday with something similar and thought it was a bad bad case of bubble algae, what is yhis stuff and how to get rid of it ??

 

[Wibbly Pig]

Mine was dinoflagellates. You can try a kalk drip to raise the pH (24/7 for 4 or 5 days straight), a dark tank for 3 or 4 day and a few others. I tried them all but none worked. I was ready to tear it down and go with those little South American thingies I can't think of right now. I finally bombed the tank with Maracyn and kept it dark for 3 days. The skimmer went nuts but it worked.

If you only have it on one rock, remove the rock and leave it for a few days in a bucket in the dark (with an airstone, change the water, etc.) and it should go away.

 

[skywatcher]

First, I think some water testing should be done. Let's see what your nitrate levels are, and phosphates, if you have the test. You can do a test on the substraight, as well. Make a pocket in the substraight, and suck out a water sample to test. Larger particle sized substraight, like crushed coral, can trap detritus, which would lead to a nitrate problem. Let's look a little closer at your system (some of these were mentioned eariler, so let's take a peek at them). Can you tell us what size tank? How old is the tank? Do you use RO/DI water? Have you tested your water change water for nitrates? How often and what volume water changes are you performing? What livestock is in the tank? Do you have a skimmer? What and how much are you feeding?

The system as it stands is about six months old although the tank is older and used to contain African Cichlids until I got tired of watching them tear each other apart. Be that as it may the tank id 40 gallons (And yes it was thoroughly cleaned before conversion to a Reef tank) Although the tank was initially filled with water from my well all water changers since have been with RO water. Water changes are done weekly at a touch better than 10%. As of this morning PH is 7.8 (Will have to bring that up a bit) Phosphate is 0.5 mg/L both in and out of the substrate. Nitrate levels are about 18 mg/L out of the substrate and about 20 mg/L in the substrate. Nitrite is 0.1 mg/L all around. We run a Red Sea Prism skimmer which was added a month or two ago. As for livestock. Yellow Tang, Blue Hippo Tang, Ocellaris Clown, Royal Gramma, Longnose Hawkfish and one small Chromis which started the ball rolling. At a guess I would say about 10 or so Hermit crabs on the clean up crew along with a Brittle Star (I think because we never see it under the live rock) assorted snails, Sea Star, Urchin and of course the Corals. Hope I gave you everything you asked for and as before many thanks for the kind offers of assistance from the fine folk here at Reef Frontiers. I hope some day to be able to offer back any info that be be of service to you all.

 

[KRMNAL1]

When mine was about 2 months old I had cyano so bad I couldn't see the bottom of the tank and I trieds water changes, sucking it out with a cyphon and then Chemi-Clean,the Chemi-Clean helped but didn't rid the problem. What ended up working for me was nearly trippling the flow with a new pump and 2 maxi-jets, reducing the light period to 8 hours and the addition of "Kent Marine Power-Phos" in my sump. It's $25 bucks for only a small container but the guy at Blue Sierra said it would last 3, 3 month does in my 55. BTW I thought a Blue Hippo Tang needed a 100 gallon min tank

WhibblyPig, Thanks for the tip !! I'll put that infected rock in a bucket today

 

[NaH2O]

With 2 tangs in a 40 gallon, you might always have a nutrient battle on your hands. The hippo tang will likely need an upgrade to a much larger system (ideally, the yellow tang also needs at least a 75 gallon). The 2 tangs together will provide a lot of waste in a 40 gallon tank, so part of the nitrate issue may be due to waste, and the substrate is not doing enough denitrification. If you can, test the water change water prior to your next water change for nitrates (test for phosphates, too). This will help rule out the newly made water as an additional source of nitrates and/or phosphates. The fact that you are registering nitrites, makes me wonder if your test kit is good, OR if you had a little mini cycle. How long has the hippo tang been part of your system? Was the addition of the chromis when the cyano started?

The pH does need to be worked on, but what time in the photoperiod did you test it? The beginning of the photoperiod or the end of the day? Also, have you tested your tank for alkalinity? Since I've asked for almost every water parameter ....toss in your salinity, too