To cycle, or not to cycle.

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How long did you cycle your tank?

  • Not at all

    Votes: 3 13.6%
  • One Day

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • One Week

    Votes: 2 9.1%
  • Two Weeks

    Votes: 2 9.1%
  • One Month

    Votes: 5 22.7%
  • Until all test results read zero (ammonia and nitrite)

    Votes: 10 45.5%

  • Total voters
    22

trido

Fish Tank Freak
Joined
Sep 28, 2006
Messages
3,524
Location
Lynnwood
Once again, today I heard (or was told) that I had to cycle my tank for a month before adding any livestock. Everyone always says it, but IM wondering how many people actually do it. Over the years, Ive set up a 15, 30, 120, 65/40 propegation system, 210, and now another 30. In most cases, Ive never had a noticable cycle and have almost always started adding livestock within a week. Sometimes in one day.
Im wondering how many people actually wait a month. If you did, was it because your readings wouldnt hit zero, or was it because you were told to.
 
I guess I should add, most of my LR was store bought cured. In the case where it was fresh from fiji etc. It was not full of life, most of the fresh LR Ive ever seen is pretty bare except a few sponges and a few forminiferians. There always seems to be very little organic matter that is decaying or dying off.
 
I setup up 2 maybe 3 tanks from scratch using uncured rock and I did wait out the cycle. If I remember correctly it tool about 6-7 weeks. But that was 20 years ago.
Since then I've setup several, but used completely cured rock and did not wait. I did test to make sure.
 
trido said:
Once again, today I heard (or was told) that I had to cycle my tank for a month before adding any livestock. Everyone always says it, but IM wondering how many people actually do it. Over the years, Ive set up a 15, 30, 120, 65/40 propegation system, 210, and now another 30. In most cases, Ive never had a noticable cycle and have almost always started adding livestock within a week. Sometimes in one day.
Im wondering how many people actually wait a month. If you did, was it because your readings wouldnt hit zero, or was it because you were told to.

I've always waited until the test kits told me I was good to go rather than go by a particular "time frame" people said it would take. I'd wait for ammonia to go up then drop off then nitrite go up then drop off and once that happened, I usually let it run for a few more days just to make sure and if both ammonia and nitrite remain undetectable after this, then I went ahead and did what I needed to do. This is going on initial setups though. If i ever upgraded or changed tanks, then it was just a swap over and continued where I left off. It's only when I start from fresh, I go through the whole waiting period by using test kits as my guide. Sometimes it doesn't even take a month and then sometimes it takes even longer which is why I don't believe in giving people time frames. Test kits will be your guide. :)
 
Btw, I didn't vote because I didn't see an option for those that wait until test kits say it is good to go which could be any time frame. :)
 
I setup up 2 maybe 3 tanks from scratch using uncured rock and I did wait out the cycle. If I remember correctly it tool about 6-7 weeks. But that was 20 years ago.
Since then I've setup several, but used completely cured rock and did not wait. I did test to make sure.

Ya, years ago from what I hear, LR was teaming with life ranging from corals, snails, crabs, worms, nudi's and the list goes on. Loads of exciting hitchhikers with every order. Every piece of LR I've ever seen (with the exception of farmed Carribean) is stripped naked of everything so it can be sold rather than inclulded with LR.
 
Btw, I didn't vote because I didn't see an option for those that wait until test kits say it is good to go which could be any time frame. :)

Good idea. It should be added.
I guess I took that for granted that everyone was testing for ammonia, nitrite and nitrate. To go further into detail, and possibley defense, The tanks that I didnt wait at all on were using LR from other systems. In the case where I waited a week it was only after testing and testing and nothing ever happened. FWIW, I use salifert test kits for everything
 
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I guess I should add, most of my LR was store bought cured. In the case where it was fresh from fiji etc. It was not full of life, most of the fresh LR Ive ever seen is pretty bare except a few sponges and a few forminiferians. There always seems to be very little organic matter that is decaying or dying off.

Sorta answered your question there, you buy fully cured LR you don't need to, just make sure it is really cured LR. If not you will have some spikes but most probably not that bad. These days most people get cured LR and don't need to complete the cycle longer than maybe a few days. If you have lots of new unseeded sand, uncured LR and new tank then you would have issues if you tried to short cycle the tank.
In some reefs there are areas that LR sits exposed for several hours, I guess with so much water volume you have no noticeable issues, and probably a smaller tank would make it more important also. Testing many times throughout the day to see if you catch any spikes is the most difficult thing to do, it is so easy to actually miss it, (I'm talking after the initial cycle you do read on test kits). So there was a time people wanted to make sure you got most of that out the way. A reef tank will always cycle some, it has to adjust to the conditions in a closed box, limited water resources so it can't be as good as an open reef.
So the true answers have lots of conditions that have to be met in order to install an instant reef!

Make sense?
 
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well, for me, i like to wait my 35 days...
even if you are using cured live rock and water from another system,
bacteria and microfauna STILL have to populate any new sand, and interior surfaces of everything in the display tank and sump, and that simply takes time...
granted, you can speed up this procedure now with a few different bacteria stains or combinations of bacterias...
but we all know patience is key.
 
The first tank i setup I wanted to wait a month, I lasted a week.

Honestly I think it just comes with experience. I like to let a system run for a few days to a week to get an idea of what the temperature is going to do and such, but I have added fish the same or next day and haven't had a problem. It really just depends. On the ones where I added the same/next day I already had established live rock that I was transferring.

On the other side of things I just moved all my stuff over from my 150g tank (say 240 total system volume) over to my new system (about 800 gallon total system volume), same amount of rock, same amount of fish/bioload and I'm noticing a lot of diatoms in the high flow areas of my reef tanks. Phosphates are reading 0. Used an RO machine with new filters and high quality salt. Kind of goofy.

Nothing bad can come from waiting but if you know what you are doing you shouldn't have any problems. It still think its good advice for the inexperienced, go as slowly as possible. They are going to make mistakes, going slow will minimize the impact of those learning experiences :).
 
My thoughts??? You can read all you want and listen to everyone, BUT you can rush in as a NEWBEE and make the errors with just knowledge or as an OLD SKHOOLER with wisdom and wait. There are several test than can ran that helps you to decide what you will do with your tank. For myself i have learned to READ, LISTEN, then CHOOSE how i'm will manage my tank. There's Pro and Con's but Wisdom from doing it you way. Two things for sure:
1) you make an error and come here RF(humble) ang learn and adjust you process
2) you can gain knowledge (reading and research) and make a informed dicision on your process and make less errors

Either way you not going to make a 100% correct choice (trust me i know) but (to me) this hobbie is also about life not death simple because i can afford to purchase more fish or coral or LR doesnt mean that they are expandable to me (not saying that's anyones thinking). To me it's about seeing the delicate balance of life and in my very small 75gal tank can imitate the BIG picture that's outside my door.

You asked I answered. I waited 30 days tested and and started adding but tested to watch my load and adjusted when needed. That's my 4cents
 
Their are lots of different cycles that go on when some one cycles a tank, and alot of variables that are also at play. So its tough to put an exact route or time frame on it as what you use pertains a good deal. So the cycle everyone usually refers to is the Nitrogen cycle or baiscally the fixation of Nitrogen based products by bacteria.

The first part of this cycle is pretty simple and it wouldnt mattered if you used cured Lr or raw Lr. Its an aerobic (done in well oxigenated water) process where bacteria reduce ammonia to Nitrite and then further reduce it to nitrate.

The second process is where different strains of bacteria further reduce the Nitrate down to ammonium, which then basically recycles to the top of the cycle once more. This process only occurs in anaerobic (without the presence of air) areas as the bacteria fix the nitrogen instead of the oxygen. This process will already be occuring in Lr but will take some time for it to be established in new sand (or even LS newly introduced).

Personally I think we should all look at this cycling process as a measure of balance and not so much just the set up of bacterias to accomplish the task. Bacteria are limited by the amount of food source in a tank (bac.=food available) so the tank when it is first setup is going to be working towards finding this perfect balance and that can take months to finally come to play and bacteria are but one player in that game.

So as an example you set up a tank with normal sand (or LS) and uncured rock. In this case you have a massive load of dead or dieing material, the first strain of bacteria will rise to meet this food input, as it begins to reduce the material it will begin to emmit a byproduct which will trigger the next strain of bacteria to begin it population increase and so on. But at some point the input (dead/dieing) material begins to lessen, this will cause the bacteria to starve and then themselves begin to die off. From here you will see another smaller cycle and also the presence of algae blooms, as the algae is usally second in line for nutrient uptake when the bacteria are in this stage. From here your going to get swings from bacterial blooms to algae blooms swinging back and forth until the tank hits an equalibrium. This equalibrium is where the population of bacteria is equal to the amount of food available.

In the other example say using cured Lr and ls. All you are doing is reducing the initial food input, so you are saving an ammount of time in the reduction of allot of dead and decaying material. BUT are you in balance?? Nope. Everytime you add a fish, or sprinke in some food you are changing the equation. So when you go this route it is better to go slow, as in add the fish and then allow the tank some time to beef up its bacterial populations, then look to do it again. At some point in time you will hit a stage where the bacteria can handle surges in food intake with out having to alter its population to much.

Anyway from their you still have to complete the moron cycle, ad that cycle can take you a while to get past, trust me, mine took years!!:party:


Mojo
 
Their are lots of different cycles that go on when some one cycles a tank, and alot of variables that are also at play. So its tough to put an exact route or time frame on it as what you use pertains a good deal. So the cycle everyone usually refers to is the Nitrogen cycle or baiscally the fixation of Nitrogen based products by bacteria.

The first part of this cycle is pretty simple and it wouldnt mattered if you used cured Lr or raw Lr. Its an aerobic (done in well oxigenated water) process where bacteria reduce ammonia to Nitrite and then further reduce it to nitrate.

The second process is where different strains of bacteria further reduce the Nitrate down to ammonium, which then basically recycles to the top of the cycle once more. This process only occurs in anaerobic (without the presence of air) areas as the bacteria fix the nitrogen instead of the oxygen. This process will already be occuring in Lr but will take some time for it to be established in new sand (or even LS newly introduced).

Personally I think we should all look at this cycling process as a measure of balance and not so much just the set up of bacterias to accomplish the task. Bacteria are limited by the amount of food source in a tank (bac.=food available) so the tank when it is first setup is going to be working towards finding this perfect balance and that can take months to finally come to play and bacteria are but one player in that game.

So as an example you set up a tank with normal sand (or LS) and uncured rock. In this case you have a massive load of dead or dieing material, the first strain of bacteria will rise to meet this food input, as it begins to reduce the material it will begin to emmit a byproduct which will trigger the next strain of bacteria to begin it population increase and so on. But at some point the input (dead/dieing) material begins to lessen, this will cause the bacteria to starve and then themselves begin to die off. From here you will see another smaller cycle and also the presence of algae blooms, as the algae is usally second in line for nutrient uptake when the bacteria are in this stage. From here your going to get swings from bacterial blooms to algae blooms swinging back and forth until the tank hits an equalibrium. This equalibrium is where the population of bacteria is equal to the amount of food available.

In the other example say using cured Lr and ls. All you are doing is reducing the initial food input, so you are saving an ammount of time in the reduction of allot of dead and decaying material. BUT are you in balance?? Nope. Everytime you add a fish, or sprinke in some food you are changing the equation. So when you go this route it is better to go slow, as in add the fish and then allow the tank some time to beef up its bacterial populations, then look to do it again. At some point in time you will hit a stage where the bacteria can handle surges in food intake with out having to alter its population to much.

Anyway from their you still have to complete the moron cycle, ad that cycle can take you a while to get past, trust me, mine took years!!:party:


Mojo

Showoff! :violin:
 
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