Upcoming Congressional decision could put a stop to our hobby

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The only three type "pets" I saw banned: Piranha, Caiman and alligators, and various threatened birds. The rest was all just empty talk to appease some petitioner. Requires funding to have any new controls and that is in pretty tight supply. Heck, you can still bring in a blue ringed octopus or pet exotic cats and primates.

This really belongs more in the water fountain
 
Actually, this ban would be for ALL non-native animals. Any non-native animal that was already in captivity would not be allowed to be bred, sold, traded or even taken across state lines. All non-native species would be banned unless/until they are added to an "allowed" list. To be put on the "allowed" list would be almost impossible, as it would be up to hobbyists or scientists to spend the money to prove the non-native animal was not a threat. Instead of there being a burden of proof to show that the animal is a threat to native animals, the burden of proof would be on showing that any non-native animals were NOT a threat. Basically, guilty until proven innocent. I believe since this has the potential to be such a threat to our hobby, it belongs in this forum. It's unlikely that this will even get into session...yet. But, if it were to be seen by Congress and passed, it would effectively put a halt to the hobby of reef keeping. It would even severely cripple Freshwater hobbyists, since the majority of those fish are Tropical.
 
Well, look at it this way, all this international commerce that occurs is taxed and the government makes money off it, do you really think they are going to do something that entails them making less money??
...hell no
 
skimerwhisperer said:
Well, look at it this way, all this international commerce that occurs is taxed and the government makes money off it, do you really think they are going to do something that entails them making less money??
...hell no
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I totally agree!! Our government will lose so much money if this was to pass. I doubt this will ever pass. There is too much money involved in the industry.
 
As long as there isn't a special interest group with deep enough coffers to get a politician to back it it will die a quiet death. If they have the money and the ear of a politician watchout. This is a government run by corporations, not of the people and for the people.

I'm trying to stay upbeat about the system, but it seems to have strayed from what our fore fathers had envisioned (at least what I can gather from history's accounts are).
 
reedman said:
I'm trying to stay upbeat about the system, but it seems to have strayed from what our fore fathers had envisioned (at least what I can gather from history's accounts are).
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You talking about those rich slave keeping landholders who we call founding fathers?

Yeah the documents are beyond beautiful in what they envisioned, but it is hard to "practice what we preach"

Still, this beats almost anything else I have seen.
 
Still, this beats almost anything else I have seen.
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Well stated. I've been to many other countries that are great to visit, but very very few would I consider worthy of living for me. I hate some of the perversions our country has had lately, but it is the best place for me. Funny part is the majority of our population seems to want to turn this country into something else (i.e. be more like <fill in your country of choice here>)
 
Reedman, this quote says it all. Although we aren't a true democracy, it still holds true for what we are going through.

"A democracy is always temporary in nature; it simply cannot exist as a permanent form of government. A democracy will continue to exist up until the time that voters discover that they can vote themselves generous gifts from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates who promise the most benefits from the public treasury, with the result that every democracy will finally collapse due to loose fiscal policy, which is always followed by a dictatorship".
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I'll leave it up to you to decide which stage we're in.

Progression of a democracy.
From Bondage to Spiritual Faith
From Spiritual Faith to Great Courage
From Great Courage to Liberty
From Liberty to Abundance
From Abundance to Complacency
From Complacency to Apathy
From Apathy to Dependency
From Dependency back to Bondage
 
skimerwhisperer said:
Well, look at it this way, all this international commerce that occurs is taxed and the government makes money off it, do you really think they are going to do something that entails them making less money??
...hell no
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Yeah, actually they do it all the time. Look at the cigarette taxes they passed to fund health care programs and then wonder why they run out of money as people stop smoking or find ways to buy cigaretts with out the paying the tax. If what you say is true, shouldn't they be encouraging more of us to take up smoking? They pass dumb laws all the time and then try to make up for it with another one.
I wish it weren't true, but I wouldn't underestimate any of this.
 
This is exactly what I was going to say right there ..This happens soo much it isnt funnnny ,I call it the damnit give me the pen and leave me alone method..It works I have read about some past auto laws that were passed in a emissions law that had nothing to do with the actual car safety law Remember no one got to the top in goverment by being morally or rightfully truthfull..This we all know It takes wacking someone or something to get there..:("There has to be sacrafices if we are to make It":( How manytimes we hear that!:badgrin:
returnofsid said:
Reedman, you're absolutely right. All kinds of things get pushed through congress by being tied to another bill, or buried in another bill, that's totally unrelated. For instance, they could write up a bill about tax cuts, with thousands of lines in it. Buried in the middle of it, could be a line outlawing mowing your lawn on Thursdays. Some states have "line item veto power," others don't. So, either that particular line is buried so well that it's passed right over, or the tax cut, which is what the entire bill is about, is voted for and along with it, we have people being arrested for mowing their lawns on Thursdays...lol. Here in Washington, similar bills have already been passed, hidden away in larger bills. I'm not saying that we should be keeping Alligators, but it's now illegal in this state. No one even heard about the bill that made that happen. It was hidden amongst other items and passed right along with them.
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And thus why this discussion belongs at the water fountain.
These type discussions always become more about politics and very little about our reef-keeping hobby
 
Mike, the thread definitely did get off topic. I'd posted it to warn everyone of a possible threat to reef keeping in general. I'd hoped it would stay on topic. I just felt it was too important of a topic to put in the Water Cooler, which is meant for Non-Reef related topics!! This is definitely reef related.
 
And even the politics has been a pleasant conversation. Glad all comments were taken with a grain of salt and rolled off backs like water on a duck (not to mix metaphors :>)
 
As long as Congress does it's homework, it won't, but there's a very strong lobby group pushing it.
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Do you think anyone in Congress actually read the 1000 page bailout plan??. I doubt it..

If they had, they would have not taken away some of the freedoms we as American citizens should have and would have drafted a better plan--but this is another issue altogether....
 
Yeah this bill would be fantastic for our dying economy as well, lets force thousands more out of jobs! Not to mention the fact we've been bringing different species into this country for hundreds of years and only a handful of them have really taken hold and typically those are in the more tropical climates. Snakehead being one of the exceptions. As reefers I believe we are actually contributing more than most, we are preserving species that will undoubtly get wiped out from ocean polution(oil spills etc..), rising acidity and so forth. If this does pass i hope the people will stand up and get it over turned! A goldfish sure won't satisfy me as an aquarium pet i dunno about everyone else though :)
 
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