Who's got the recipe for interceptor

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class clown

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I'm looking to treat my entire tank for red bugs. I've lived with them for so long it's almost sad to see them go, but I'm curious to see if I'll see any improvement in corals polyp extension if I nuke 'em. :)

I know there is a thread with a formula and details of the procedure, but I can't seem to find it. Can anyone point me in the right direction por favor.

I have a 55 g display & a 45 gallon sump which I'd say is half full = ~75 gallons of H20?

thanks!
Ben
 
I didnt use the recipe that is posted. I use the 1 big per 100g. So my tank was 1.5 pills. I dissolved it in 2 quarts of hot rodi water. I prep for a 50% WC. I drip the two qts into my tank overnight and did a waterchange after I got up the next morning. I then prep for another 50% wc and do it when the water is ready. It works first time.

Don
 
I didnt use the recipe that is posted. I use the 1 big per 100g. So my tank was 1.5 pills. I dissolved it in 2 quarts of hot rodi water. I prep for a 50% WC. I drip the two qts into my tank overnight and did a waterchange after I got up the next morning. I then prep for another 50% wc and do it when the water is ready. It works first time.

Don

Don -- Holy macral... 50% water change in 1 day.. then another 50% water change shorthly there after? man oh man. that seems like a lot. I get nervous when doing more than 10% at a time. Seriously, i do.

So, what If I did 4 25% water changes over say a weeks time? same effect?

Don -any die off of corals or inverts when you did it this way?



Looking to learn from other people's experiences too. Lesson's learned, words of caution, recomended dosages... I'd like to here your experiences.
 
I think I found it... http://www.reefs.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?p=439155#439155

have others followed this formula?



excerpt from the article at the link above:

"The medication is a DOG heartworm medication called Interceptor, it is only available from a veterinarian with a prescription. The tablets used in the initial treatments were for large dogs, 51-100lbs. These tablets are just under 1 gram each and contain 23mg of Milbemycin Oxime, the rest of it is a lovely smelling beef flavor. This chemical is active against Nematodes (Heartworms in dogs) and select arthropods (some types of Mange in dogs). Luckily, our red bugs are one of those select arthropods. The tablets come 6 to a box.

Here is the official information from Novartis on the medication.
http://www.ah.novartis.com/products/en/cab/interceptor.shtml

Refer to this thread and read the whole thing before you begin the treatment.
http://reefs.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=43945




The dosage used in an aquarium to kill redbugs is 25mg (0.025 grams) per 10 gallons of actual tank water . That is 25mg of the entire tablet. Each tablet in the pack of 6 will treat about 380 gallons. The tablets are ground with a mortar and pestle into a fine powder.

Do your very best to calculate your actual water volume. Take into consideration your sump, oversized plumbing and things like that. All of the initial tests were done with the estimated volume of live rock and live sand subtracted from the total gallons. You need to make sure that every part of the system that’s capable of holding water is treated. This means your refugium, the water inside your calcium reactor, the water inside your skimmer while it is not foaming.

Measure out the Interceptor on a very accurate scale that is capable of reading down to 0.001 grams. Remember, the dosage is 0.025grams per 10 gallons. For safety’s sake get as close as you possibly can. It has been pointed out that it may not be necessary to get down to the 1/1000th of a gram point when we are guessing on the actual water volume. This is an excellent point, however, since we are pretty much guessing our water volume, we should do our very best to make sure that we treat that guess accurately. We don’t want to over treat an over estimate.

Before adding the medication to your tank, turn off your skimmer (water needs to run through it, but you do not want it producing any bubbles. Remove any mechanical filtration if present. Remove any carbon if present. Turn off UV sterilizers and ozone generators.

Remove any shrimp or crabs that you want to save. They will have to stay out of the system for the duration of the treatment. Remember, that when you add them back to your tank, there is a slight chance that you will re-introduce the red bugs to your tank.

The medication is dissolved into some aquarium water (it is not easily soluble, you will have to stir for a while) and spread evenly across the surface of the water. Your tank should remain perfectly clear and look very normal the entire time. The bugs hang on well into the 4th and 5th hour of the treatment, dont be alarmed. Many of the bugs will hang on for days even after they are dead.

If anything goes wrong during treatment perform a water change ASAP and add a large amount of carbon to your system.

After 6 hours, a 25% MINIMUM water change is performed and as much activated carbon as you can fit should be added to the tank. In the initial tests, crustaceans that were reintroduced to a tank after a 25% water change and carbon were unaffected by the medication.
24 hours later the water should be changed again and the carbon replaced.
There is no maximum for the water changes or carbon, the more you do the better.

The treatment needs to be peformed a MINIMUM of 3 times. We know it kills the bugs, but we don’t know enough about their lifecycle to determine if it kills them at every stage of their life. We have to assume that all of the most of the adults are killed in the first treatment. The goal of the second treatment is to clean up any left over adults, and any juveniles that have hatched out of eggs that might have been unaffected. The third treatment is a “just in case” treatment, its goal is to get any bugs that could have possibly survived the first two. I know that three treatments sounds scary, after the first one you will feel much more comfortable with it though.

The frequency of the treatments has yet to be fully determined. Some of the volunteers in the testing did the first two treatments 7 days apart with the 3rd treatment 14 days after the second. Some did 3 treatments 7 days apart. Personally, I have been doing 2 treatments 24 hours apart every 7 days. I will repeat this 4 times for a total of 8 treatments.

The medication seems to be fairly safe, since we dont know the life cycle of the bug its best to err on the side of caution and treat several times. Pretend its an antibiotic, if your going to use it once, make sure you do the whole treatment process at least 3 times!!!


Refer to this thread and read the whole thing before you begin the treatment.
http://reefs.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=43945


Some things to remember.

1. The ENTIRE system has to be treated. There could be bugs or bug larvae anywhere in your system. Do not take your refugium offline. Do not turn any part of your filtration off that will trap water. For example, if your skimmer is shut off, but has 1/2 gallon of water in it, that water needs to be treated!
2. You will probably kill off a lot of your pods, shrimps and crabs.
3. This medication has not been tested for very long. The bugs might come back. Like anything you put in your tank it could be toxic a year down the road.
4. The pills are for Large dogs, 50-100lbs. The dose is 25mg/10gal/6hrs.
5. If the treatment is not successful and you still have bugs visible after the 1st treatment, make a slight adjustment to your dose and start over again. This was only necessary in 1 out of 7 systems tested. It was a very old, large and intricate system. "
 
I was given the pills that treat small dogs. I believe 25-50lbs. Half of the large dog dose. Good for 190 gallons. I have a 165G system. I used the whole pill. Turned off the skimmer and carbon. I was only able to do a 10% WC after every treatment.I did it every other week for three treatments. After the WC I skimmed wet and ran extra carbon. MY skunk cleaner and a slough of copepods survived, and other that the lack of red bugs I didnt notice any affects of the treatment. To my surprise the fish ate the red bugs as they were dying off. I also notice an increase in coloration of the affected corals within several weeks of hte treatment. If anyone else out there cares, I would quickly treat my system again if it is necessary.
 
Don -- Holy macral... 50% water change in 1 day.. then another 50% water change shorthly there after? man oh man. that seems like a lot. I get nervous when doing more than 10% at a time. Seriously, i do.

So, what If I did 4 25% water changes over say a weeks time? same effect?

Don -any die off of corals or inverts when you did it this way?



Looking to learn from other people's experiences too. Lesson's learned, words of caution, recomended dosages... I'd like to here your experiences.

Its not that bad. If I didnt have clams I'd probably to a 90%.

Don
 
Large volume water changes are far better than doing a bunch of smaller changes, I've always had good results changing out lots of water at once.
 
for my 120g tank and 30g sump I used 1 entire tab of the 11.5mg tab which is for up to 180g. I did this a while back but I too my skimmer cup off and kept the skimmer running for oxygenation. I did a 20g wc afterwards and added fresh carbon. Thankfully I have not had to retreat.
 
Thanks guys for the replies!

Hey, so here's what I'm confused about...

Duane, Don, Sue - you guys have all posted that you've had success with lower the dose recomended in the excerpt above. (posted recomended dose is 25mg per 10 gallons/6 hrs).

  • Duane - sounds like you did 11.5mg for 165 gallons = 1mg per 14.34 gallons
  • Don - 34.5 mg for 150 gallons = 1mg per 4.35gallons
  • Sue - 11.5 mg for 150 gallons = 1mg per 13.04 gallons

recomended dosage in the article however = 1 mg per 0.4 gallons.

is the recomended dosage from the excerpt above wrong?

:?:
 
one more question - if my pod population takes a hit, how's my mandarin going to survive? it won't, will it?:cry: should I get rid of my buddy before doing this or risk it possibly not having enough food?

It does not seem to get too excited when i put mysis or anything in the tank unforutnately. maybe it would if it was forced to??????
 
Ben, I have gone by the recipe that Dustin Dorton used and was posted on RC. His was 23mg for 380g tank volumn, 11.5mg for 180g, 5.75mg for 90g and 2.3mg for 38g. I used the 11.5mg and used the entire tab due to someone saying that the strength of the tablet is not the same throughout the tablet. I did not loose all my pods. I did see some floating through the tank. My mandarin does eat frozen so I'm not sure what to suggest you do with regards to him/her.
 
Ben, I have gone by the recipe that Dustin Dorton used and was posted on RC. His was 23mg for 380g tank volumn, 11.5mg for 180g, 5.75mg for 90g and 2.3mg for 38g. I used the 11.5mg and used the entire tab due to someone saying that the strength of the tablet is not the same throughout the tablet. I did not loose all my pods. I did see some floating through the tank. My mandarin does eat frozen so I'm not sure what to suggest you do with regards to him/her.

Yeah.. that's who I quoted above... http://reefs.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=45859&highlight=redbugs

he says "25mg (0.025 grams) per 10 gallons" hmmmmm?
 
Yeah.. that's who I quoted above... http://reefs.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=45859&highlight=redbugs

he says "25mg (0.025 grams) per 10 gallons" hmmmmm?

Thats 25mg cut off a tablet. According to the formula I dose enough to dose more than 2000 gallons of water. I dont know where the numbers actually came from. I also dont think its all that important to stick to them. It also states to disolve in saltwater yet the active ingredient is nearly insoluable in salt water. We know it works but I cant really justify sticking to one paricular recipe.

Don
 
Thats 25mg cut off a tablet. According to the formula I dose enough to dose more than 2000 gallons of water. I dont know where the numbers actually came from. I also dont think its all that important to stick to them. It also states to disolve in saltwater yet the active ingredient is nearly insoluable in salt water. We know it works but I cant really justify sticking to one paricular recipe.

Don

I am sitting here laughing at myself scratching my head b/c I can't figure this out. literally laughing at myself. Isn't a 23mg tablet weigh 23mg whole or shaved? I feel like a big dork for not being able to figure this out, but i literally don't get it.

I see 25 mg per 10 gallons - to me that means I'd need more than 7 23 mg pills for 70 gallons of water.

then I read 1 tab treats 380 gallons - huh? so I'd really only need less than a quarter of a tab?

someone please smack me and set me striaght :D


Here is Dustin's article: http://www.reefs.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?p=439155#439155
 
something else to consider is that it's been said that cutting a tablet is not recommended as the medication is not consistent throughtout the entire tablet. It may be the way the manufacturers made it, I don't know. So whatever dose you use I'd use a whole tablet and not cut it as you may not get enough of the medication to be of any use. When I treated my tank I used 1 entire 11.5mg which was for a 180g water volumn.
 

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