1st Reef Tank help needed

[DolphinLVR]

Hello all,

I am finally beginning to setup my Oceanic 140RR tank. I would like to be able to keep any type of coral as well as clams. I have already got a skimmer and an RO/DI unit and am now looking to get my flow all setup. I am contiplating a closed loop manifold for the majority of water movement within the tank, just not sure how many X's turnover I will need for this as well as the sixe of return pump. As far as lighting, I am planning on 2-250 watt MH as well as some atenics. The tank dimensions are 48x24x28 and has overflows in each corner.

Any help/suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks,

Jeff

 

[reedman]

You really need to decide on weather it will be an SPS dedicated tank, a softie or LPS tank, or a mixed garden. With an SPS tank you need a lot of random, chaotic flow (seaswirls, motorized ball valves, ocean motions, etc.) and high turnover rate. On the other hand, in a softie tank you don't want that much flow, but random is still prefered. With clams you don't want very high flow as they will not expand all the way in high flow. You can create areas of lower flow in an SPS tank to keep clams and such, but it adds to the complication.

Since this is your first tank I would recommend finding another tank that you would like your tank to look similar too in the end. Determine the species that are in that tank and make a list of their requirements. At that point we can get you a good plan for the flow in your tank.

 

[wrightme43]

Ok like Reed said corals have differing requirements. It is possible to keep sps, lps, clams and softies in the same tank. It is not easy and the problem is that if it is perfect for one it is marginal to bad for another. Usually if it is your first reef a lps or softie tank is a good start. There is just something about a bunch of lps that looks great. I have in my tank sps, lps, softies, anemone, and a clam. The tank is actually better suited to lps, clams and zoos than anything else. I am able through crossing flow patterns to keep some sps corals. They are doing well but would have much more color and growth under mh lighting and with higher flow in my tank. I am flowing about 1000 gph thru a home made adjustable spray bar with lok lines and have 4x 96 watt p.c. bulbs. It is not the best tank in the world but it does look nice and I am happy with the results from it. When you said reef ready set up, what do you mean. Protien skimmer behind the tank wall, what all does it have with it for filtration? Like Reed said. Tell all about your tank. As much info as you can. The more you share the better the answer. Look thru the photo gallery. If you see a tank you like pm the person and ask for specs. Most are very happy to share and will even tell you of thier mistakes so you dont have to make them. HTH Steve

 

[DolphinLVR]

Thank you for your comments and suggestions! After thinking about it more in depth, I would have to say that I would like to be able to keep mostly soft corals as well as clamsand some anenomies. As far as my tank is concerned, it is an oceanic RR tanks, meaning that it has been pre-drilled for the overflows and came with a sump. I hope that further explanation as far as specifics to the tank has helped. So with all of that said, I am in need of how to set this tank up in regards to flow and possibly even lighting.

Again, thank you for your responses and I look forward to gaining more and more knowledge everyday that will help me be successful in reef keeping.

Jeff

 

[NaH2O]

Welcome to Reef Frontiers!!! Are there any budget constraints? Sea swirls are really nice and provide a sweeping motion. There are also the Tunze streams, which can also be set-up on a Multicontroller or single controller. The Tunze streams seem pretty nice - they even have magnet holders for them, which makes placement easy.

What kind of substrate are you going to have, if any?

 

[DolphinLVR]

Welcome to Reef Frontiers!!! Are there any budget constraints? Sea swirls are really nice and provide a sweeping motion. There are also the Tunze streams, which can also be set-up on a Multicontroller or single controller. The Tunze streams seem pretty nice - they even have magnet holders for them, which makes placement easy.

What kind of substrate are you going to have, if any?

Thank you for the welcome!

I am on a pretty tight budget, thus i was figuring on some type of closed loop for water movement within the tank. I am planning on a 3 - 4 inch sand bed using fiji pink sand and ~150 lbs of live rock.

Jeff

 

[NaH2O]

Here is a pic of a simple closed loop design for over the top of a tank. Single Post - closed loop. This is for a much smaller tank, but could be modified to fit a larger tank and pump. I also don't know if a SCWD would be a good choice....depending on the pump, I suppose. Do you know what kind of pump you will have for your return? Anyone have ideas on a closed loop pump?

 

[DolphinLVR]

Here is a pic of a simple closed loop design for over the top of a tank. Single Post - closed loop. This is for a much smaller tank, but could be modified to fit a larger tank and pump. I also don't know if a SCWD would be a good choice....depending on the pump, I suppose. Do you know what kind of pump you will have for your return? Anyone have ideas on a closed loop pump?

I dont have a clue yet as to what size return pump is needed nor the closed loop pump! I will be keeping LPS,ZOO's and clams. Thats why I posted here to see what kind of pumps I would need? Do I do 10x tank size from sump or do I go about 300 - 500 from sump and make up the rest via a closed loop using lok lines (if so, what size pump?)

Jeff

 

[DolphinLVR]

So if I wanted to have a LPS,Zoo's, Clam and anemone's in my tank.....what kind of flow do u all suggest? I am figuring on running ~2500 gph from the sump. Any one have any thoughts?

Jeff

 

[wrightme43]

If you have a 140 gallon tank and 2500 gph from the sump returns you will be fine with lps, clams anemone and zoos. Thats over 17 times a hour. I have 75 with 1000 from the sump in four locklines. Thats 13 times a hour and I keep lps, sps, softies, zoos, clams, anemone, and whatever I want. Now the question, is that the rated flow of that pump at zero head or are you taking into account bends and return hieght. My pump is rated at 1506 gph and I figured it down to 1000 from using only 45degree fittings and large diameter tube. Now for the sps I have to place them carefully where they are downstream of two crossing flows from the lockline so they get some random flow. It is not the best way to keep sps. It works great for everything else. HTH Steve

 

[DolphinLVR]

If you have a 140 gallon tank and 2500 gph from the sump returns you will be fine with lps, clams anemone and zoos. Thats over 17 times a hour. I have 75 with 1000 from the sump in four locklines. Thats 13 times a hour and I keep lps, sps, softies, zoos, clams, anemone, and whatever I want. Now the question, is that the rated flow of that pump at zero head or are you taking into account bends and return hieght. My pump is rated at 1506 gph and I figured it down to 1000 from using only 45degree fittings and large diameter tube. Now for the sps I have to place them carefully where they are downstream of two crossing flows from the lockline so they get some random flow. It is not the best way to keep sps. It works great for everything else. HTH Steve

Thanks alot Steve!

The ~2500 gph that I had stated was what I am thinking of Running. Oceanic had told me that each of my Overflows/returns (I have 2) were rated at 7-10 x per overflow. So that is how I came up with that figure. I am going to look for a pump taking head loss into consideration. I am figuring I will have about 6ft of head loss....not exactly sure I right on with that figure. So you think I will be fine just running a pump that size from my sump and not having to add any other flow to the tank?

Jeff

 

[ahenson]

You could go with less flow from the sump and use the Seio powerheads. If budget is really tight I think that would work fine. I think your skimmer might work better because with less overflow you would be skimming a thinner layer off the top.
Andy

 

[DolphinLVR]

You could go with less flow from the sump and use the Seio powerheads. If budget is really tight I think that would work fine. I think your skimmer might work better because with less overflow you would be skimming a thinner layer off the top.
Andy

I have thought about going with less flow....lets say ~800 gph and then make up the rest via a closed loop or a closed loop manifold. I am not very keen on wanting power heads in the tank.

Jeff

 

[wrightme43]

Yeah That would be fine to. You can use power heads in the tank and use hydor rotating flow devices on them, 12.99 each. Or you can just make a spray bar with say 6 or 7 locklines and go like that. Help me to understand. When you 7-10x per overflow, I take that to mean 700-1000 gph per overflow. Is that what you mean. Most people do not flow as high thru the sump as I do. I am weird in that regard. If all your overflows can handle is 2000 gph at most a 2500 gph pump at 6 foot head with all the fittings and bends and locklines should not over flow the tank. My over flow is a cpr 102 it flows 1200 gph. My pump at zero head 1506 gph. See what I mean? The real trick is getting chaotic flow. Its like this. If your a coral and one side of you is blasted all day and night by flow and one side is just sheltered, you wouldnt be happy. If one side gets flow and then the other and back and forth its cool. You can go with much less flow when its chaotic. How I do that is crossing currents. They send off little eddys and when you stir stuff up you can see it good. Another thing is there really are few hard and fast rules for this stuff. Sometimes you can study and plan and all that and it not work, and sometimes you can just guess and try and have it work good. Try to put your mind in the corals shoes and give it a go. The most difficult things you have chosen are clams and anemone. Use care in placement of the clams and the anemone will pretty much pick thier own spot. I hope my rambling post has helped some what.

 

[wrightme43]

Photos of my tank and such. Steve

 

[reedman]

I think Steve is giving you great advice on this. With what you want to keep you can go with the flow you are talking about. You could add a SCWD or a seaswirl later to add to the randomness of the flow. Make sure your sump can handle the higher flow without putting micro bubbles into the display tank. You have to have anough baffles to dissipate the bubbles before the return pump.

 

[DolphinLVR]

Yeah That would be fine to. You can use power heads in the tank and use hydor rotating flow devices on them, 12.99 each. Or you can just make a spray bar with say 6 or 7 locklines and go like that. Help me to understand. When you 7-10x per overflow, I take that to mean 700-1000 gph per overflow. Is that what you mean. Most people do not flow as high thru the sump as I do. I am weird in that regard. If all your overflows can handle is 2000 gph at most a 2500 gph pump at 6 foot head with all the fittings and bends and locklines should not over flow the tank. My over flow is a cpr 102 it flows 1200 gph. My pump at zero head 1506 gph. See what I mean? The real trick is getting chaotic flow. Its like this. If your a coral and one side of you is blasted all day and night by flow and one side is just sheltered, you wouldnt be happy. If one side gets flow and then the other and back and forth its cool. You can go with much less flow when its chaotic. How I do that is crossing currents. They send off little eddys and when you stir stuff up you can see it good. Another thing is there really are few hard and fast rules for this stuff. Sometimes you can study and plan and all that and it not work, and sometimes you can just guess and try and have it work good. Try to put your mind in the corals shoes and give it a go. The most difficult things you have chosen are clams and anemone. Use care in placement of the clams and the anemone will pretty much pick thier own spot. I hope my rambling post has helped some what.

Great info Steve!

Let me explain what I mean by 7-10x. When I say 7-10x. I am beaning 7-10 times tank size. So having that said, each of my overflows/returns can handle about 1400 gph for a total of 2800 gph. Great pictures Steve! In fact I was thinking about doing something similar to your sray bar, except mine would go all the way around the tank (Manifold). I was thinking of about having 8 3/4" outlets using Lok line and if I needed to, then I could cap off whatever outlets not needed.

I hope i was able to make sense there in my explanations. I undersatand that everyone has their own way of doing things and that there are no hard and fast rules, but what my goal is, is to try and do all my planning and slowly get this tank setup, that way, I dont just go out there haphazardly and just set up the tank. The flow has been the hardest part of the planning thus far and I want to make sure that I am doing the best that I can for the inhabitants that I plan on keeping.

 

[DolphinLVR]

I think Steve is giving you great advice on this. With what you want to keep you can go with the flow you are talking about. You could add a SCWD or a seaswirl later to add to the randomness of the flow. Make sure your sump can handle the higher flow without putting micro bubbles into the display tank. You have to have anough baffles to dissipate the bubbles before the return pump.

Thanks Reedman......I have thought about the SCWD and incorporating it into the manifold i was thinking of using.

Jeff

 

[wrightme43]

Your doing good. It might be time to start drawing and measuring.

 

[DolphinLVR]

Your doing good. It might be time to start drawing and measuring.

Appreciate the Kudo's Steve.......I was just thinking the same thing about doing a drawing, I will post it when I have it completed.

Jeff