Advise Please on 280 gallon stand

[Ichthys]

I am in the planning stage of putting a 280 gallon tank in wall. It will be in the garage with an opening in the wall to the bedroom. There is an existing NON load bearing wall that i will cut the hole in and am trying to figure out the stand. I wanted to go with 4x4 legs however what i have read say they are green (not kiln dried) and susceptible to warpage and twisting. I believe a better plan is to take 2 2x4's and glue/screw them together to make a 4x4 and use these as uprights. They will sit on a 2x4 base plate and will be attached to the base with some sort of Simpson tie. The top plate will be a 4x6 that is notched to receive my home made 4x4's. One of these assemblies will be built in the wall, the other will be under the back side of the tank. The two assemblies will be tied together with either 2x6's strung between them on joist hangers, or something else which i haven’t figured yet. Please take a look at my very crude drawings and offer advice. Oh tank footprint is 72x30.

The drawing is not to scale and is just to get a rough idea of what i am trying to accomplish.

Thanks
Ichthys

 

[Ichthys]

PS I posted this in the 300 and over forum, I know my tank is only 280 but you guys have the expertise i need for this.

 

[07FocusST]

I could give you a rough idea of a skeletal design. I see you tank is 72"x30".. about how high do you want the stand or overall height to be? Also how many doors? I can draw up something on google sketch that will give you an idea. I built my 180G stand with my template from google sketchup i made a couple years ago with the help of King Neptune.... It was 72"x24"x48" (stand).

 

[Ichthys]

I could give you a rough idea of a skeletal design. I see you tank is 72"x30".. about how high do you want the stand or overall height to be? Also how many doors? I can draw up something on google sketch that will give you an idea. I built my 180G stand with my template from google sketchup i made a couple years ago with the help of King Neptune.... It was 72"x24"x48" (stand).

that would be cool. The stand has to be 40 inches tall. Also any ideas on how to dado out those 4x6's? I dont own a radial arm saw, just a chop saw.

 

[Peppie]

You do not need to use a 4 X 6 for the " Top Plate ", as long as you use the double 2x4s as the supports you can use a single 2x4 for the Top Plate.

IMO you dont even need to double up the 2x4s you are using for supports.
A single 2x4 can handle a tremendous amount of weight. Someone here may know how much, but I am willing to bet it is more than 10 Xs the amount of weight you will be placing on it.

 

[07FocusST]

You do not need to use a 4 X 6 for the " Top Plate ", as long as you use the double 2x4s as the supports you can use a single 2x4 for the Top Plate.

IMO you dont even need to double up the 2x4s you are using for supports.
A single 2x4 can handle a tremendous amount of weight. Someone here may know how much, but I am willing to bet it is more than 10 Xs the amount of weight you will be placing on it.

I agree with Peppie, 2x4s are extremely strong and with strategic placement can work together to perform weight holding to a whole new level. I am sure that anyone that seen my last stand I built knows that it would support a full size truck easily with only a couple vertical 2x4's (12 to be exaclt all around) on a 180 tank.

Also my 3d drawing is cool and all but dont expect much from it... also how many doors do you want in the front?

 

[Ichthys]

The stand is in the garage, so i do not want any doors or sheathing or anything on it. Just stick frame. Unfortunately I understand that a lot of a stands rigidity comes from the sheathing or "skin" which helps to lock all the uprights together. Mine will have none. I may do some cross bracing or something to compensate. Just so we are clear, I need a stand that is 72x30 and 40" high that can hold up 2500 pounds and be stable as a rock.

 

[DonW]

Are you wanting the tank to sit flush with the wall on the inside of your house, meaning tank sitting on the wall, Or will it be behind the wall? Where do you want to put your sump and other gear, under or next to the stand?

Don

 

[Ichthys]

The tank will sit flush with the sheetrock in the bedroom. So the plywood that is screwed into the top of the skeleton that the tank sits on will actually jut out from the support the width of the sheetrock. Does that make sense.

 

[DonW]

The tank will sit flush with the sheetrock in the bedroom. So the plywood that is screwed into the top of the skeleton that the tank sits on will actually jut out from the support the width of the sheetrock. Does that make sense.

Yes makes sense. First I would cut the wall out from floor to ceiling with exception of the top and bottom plates. Next I would frame it in just as if you were installing a window including a real top header with your 2x's on 12" centers, of course the bottom would be 2x matching the wall thickness. Next I would build two short walls for each end, built just like a real wall on 12" centers. Tie these to the house walls just like you would when framing walls, framing nails are fine. Now you have the house supporting the front and the garage slab supporting the two sides. The back is where I would get fancy especially if the sump is under the stand. The back I would make a nice glue lam so that the back can stay completely open. An 8" glue lam made from a sheet of cheap plywood will support the entire length no problem. Just glue together 4 or 5 8" strips of 3/4" plywood The entire remaining width of the tank. All you need to support the glue lam is a single 2x on each end. Think of it as installing a header across the two short side walls. Add some top braces like joist from back to front and screw down your plywood. The plywood is what will finish tying it all together, no need for metal straps of any kind.
Remember do not reference off the garage floor. Build your walls square and use shims and construction adhesive under the side walls. Also add a vapor barrier on the garage side of the walls so they dont sweat and bring mold into your house.

Don

 

[Ichthys]

OK, reworked per dons instructions. Don, I couldnt figure out how to render the two 2x4's for the tops of the side pieces, but my question is, how to attach the glulam across the big opening, if i set it on top of the side walls it will be too high. If i hang it joist hangers it will transfer all the weight to a few nails..

 

[Peppie]

Cut two of the last three studs on the side wall short the same height dimension of the glue lam. Nail all three together. It will act like a "King Stud" nailed to 2 cripples.
Hope that makes sense.

 

[Ichthys]

Cut two of the last three studs on the side wall short the same height dimension of the glue lam. Nail all three together. It will act like a "King Stud" nailed to 2 cripples.
Hope that makes sense.

peppie, you mean like this, excuse the crude drawing im tierd and its late lol. On a separate note i found a guy on craigslist in Graham selling Glulams. he has a 5.25" x 7.25" x 26' for 99 bucks. Would love to find someone who wants part of this and split it with them. 13 feet would be plenty to do a stand for most tanks. And it gets rid of those pesky uprights and allows better access to sump. Any takers?

 

[Ichthys]

The guy in Graham is going to cut off 6 feet of the glulam and sell it to me for 40 bucks. it is a 5.25" x 7.25". Awesome. That will work right Don?

 

[Peppie]

peppie, you mean like this, excuse the crude drawing im tierd and its late lol. On a separate note i found a guy on craigslist in Graham selling Glulams. he has a 5.25" x 7.25" x 26' for 99 bucks. Would love to find someone who wants part of this and split it with them. 13 feet would be plenty to do a stand for most tanks. And it gets rid of those pesky uprights and allows better access to sump. Any takers?

Just like that!! Yes that glue lam will hold the tank at that span without any uprights at midway.

 

[Ichthys]

the guy in graham said he will cut me off a 6 foot piece and sell it to me for 40. WIll go pick up this weekend, if anyone else wants a long span of this let me know,

 

[Spinner]

This will be in a bedroom Are you viewing from a bed, chair/couch, standing/walking? 40" on the stand doesn't that put the top of tank at eye level when standing? Looking up when sitting or on a bed? JUST THINKING


Best of Luck with Your Build!

 

[Ichthys]

A102AC-48B

This will be in a bedroom Are you viewing from a bed, chair/couch, standing/walking? 40" on the stand doesn't that put the top of tank at eye level when standing? Looking up when sitting or on a bed? JUST THINKING


Best of Luck with Your Build!

Yep in the bedroom. The bedroom is actually 2/3rds of the old double garage, its pretty big. When they built it they erected a 2x6 framed wall to divided the space in two and put in a subfloor on top of the cement pad of the garage floor. So end result is that the floor of the bedroom is about 7 inches higher than the floor of garage where tank sits, and that seven inches is really noticeable in the bedroom. So the tank when viewed from bedroom will be at 37 inches bottom and 67 inches top. It will most often be viewed while sitting on edge of bed or watching tv in bed, we also have a sitting couch in the bedroom that will have good line of sight. I would like to put the tank higher but i start to run out of room in the garage between top of tank and ceiling, need room for my MH's. Of course if someone wanted to donate an ACAN A102AC-48 to my build i could do away with the MH and raise the tank higher, just sayin....

 

[DonW]

Sorry for the slow response but yes that will work great.

Have fun
Don

 

[DonW]

I forgot to mention. If your going to go with the pre made glue lam and its made from fir bring a straight edge with you. Make sure its dead flat, if not dont stress out. You can bring it by my place and ill flatten and parallel it for you.

Don