cotton28
Member
dhnguyen, yes you are absolutely correct i did get taken to the cleaners with this product. freedom filters are a poor design,
All-Flo Freedom filter???Any thoughts
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Boca Kris
Member
I love all the experts in here that have opinions based on zero experience with the product.
Not everyones situation is the same. Some things work for some people, while maybe not for others. The real experts in this hobby, and the people I admire, are the ones that do things they are told 'cant' or 'shouldnt' be done cause they wont work.
Not those who read the textbook and do everything exactly like everyone else tells them they should.
Maybe this thing isnt set up for the demands of a 225 gallon reef system. I cant imagine it being able to keep up. But I can tell you based on my experience, that it has worked flawlessly. I have had absolutely NO ISSUES whatsoever. My tank is over 10 months old, and I have never had any nitrates (so much for the nitrate factory theory I hear from all the experts), nitrites, ammonia, and all my other levels are perfect. I have several fish...some clowns, chromis, a mandarin...several inverts...crabs, shrimp, snails....ricordea, brain coral...sun coral.....everything is 100% perfect. I have to empty the skimmer every other day or so...more so if I feed alot. I usually turn it off when I feed cyclopeeze or mysis, etc.
I have a 55g setup, with no other means of filtration/skimming.
I bought this unit in Boca also, and found everyone there to be nice & helpful. I would recommend it for anyone looking to do a smaller setup 55 - 75 (maybe even 90) with not a crazy bioload.
I think it works great.
Not everyones situation is the same. Some things work for some people, while maybe not for others. The real experts in this hobby, and the people I admire, are the ones that do things they are told 'cant' or 'shouldnt' be done cause they wont work.
Not those who read the textbook and do everything exactly like everyone else tells them they should.
Maybe this thing isnt set up for the demands of a 225 gallon reef system. I cant imagine it being able to keep up. But I can tell you based on my experience, that it has worked flawlessly. I have had absolutely NO ISSUES whatsoever. My tank is over 10 months old, and I have never had any nitrates (so much for the nitrate factory theory I hear from all the experts), nitrites, ammonia, and all my other levels are perfect. I have several fish...some clowns, chromis, a mandarin...several inverts...crabs, shrimp, snails....ricordea, brain coral...sun coral.....everything is 100% perfect. I have to empty the skimmer every other day or so...more so if I feed alot. I usually turn it off when I feed cyclopeeze or mysis, etc.
I have a 55g setup, with no other means of filtration/skimming.
I bought this unit in Boca also, and found everyone there to be nice & helpful. I would recommend it for anyone looking to do a smaller setup 55 - 75 (maybe even 90) with not a crazy bioload.
I think it works great.
dhnguyen
Pain In The Arse
Did it ever occur to you to think that just maybe I actually know what the heck I am talking about? Just maybe that I have a lot of experience using, testing, modding, and building skimmers to know what is a good design and what isn't?
Honestly you must have never used a real skimmer before if you think this thing works great
The design of this thing does not lend itself to be a good skimmer no matter how hard one tries to justify it. The tiny reaction chamber or lack there of is a major flaw for one and doesn't allow for any dwell time at all. The fact that it's a venturi skimmer (or a poor excuse for one) also tells me it's nothing to be wow'd about either.Can your "freedom" skimmer do this?
This is after 12 hours for a cheapo $30 JEBO 180 HOB skimmer. And this I considered a POS skimmer.
Boca Kris
Member
Hmmm....a little on the defensive side, eh?
While Im sure youre an expert, you just might not be exactly the type of person I was talking about.
But, cheer up...Im sure plenty of people here appreciate your genius.
Forgive me.
While Im sure youre an expert, you just might not be exactly the type of person I was talking about.
But, cheer up...Im sure plenty of people here appreciate your genius.
Forgive me.
dhnguyen
Pain In The Arse
Well considering your own remark "I love all the experts in here that have opinions based on zero experience with the product."
And I only see 2 people on this thread you could possibly be referring to either myself or skimmerwhisperer who also seems to know a thing or 2 about skimmer designs and how they work.
I never claimed to be a genius in any sense but I do actually have a lot of experience with skimmers and other equipments. I also hate to see a fellow hobbiest (especially the beginners) get taken advantage of by the snake oil products out there (and there are a ton of them in this hobby)
Lets just say I have learned what I know through experience and have spent hundreds if not thousands on sub-par (if not useless) products that were supposedly the "best" of the "best" All because I listened to some very bad advices when I first started out.
And I only see 2 people on this thread you could possibly be referring to either myself or skimmerwhisperer who also seems to know a thing or 2 about skimmer designs and how they work.
I never claimed to be a genius in any sense but I do actually have a lot of experience with skimmers and other equipments. I also hate to see a fellow hobbiest (especially the beginners) get taken advantage of by the snake oil products out there (and there are a ton of them in this hobby)
Lets just say I have learned what I know through experience and have spent hundreds if not thousands on sub-par (if not useless) products that were supposedly the "best" of the "best" All because I listened to some very bad advices when I first started out.
Scooterman
Well-known member
Ok enough jabbing & lets get this thread back on track, let it go guys, these are all just opinions.
cotton28
Member
The future of saltwater filtration is doom.... " No thanks to freedom filter!!"
i felt compelled to make a response,because the comments that were made by some individual could not go unchallenged, First i do have experience with this flawed,design deficient freedom filter equipment.
It's such a coincidence that the individual so vigorously defending this product and their salespeople just happen to be in the same location that this product is produce, sounds more like an employee. Or who knows? Since we can not really tell from the web.
This product does not operate like it cliams, and anyone using it i recommend getting a skimmer for it, i would bet that this person with the 55 gallon does not have only the freedom filter , they have additional filtration that they are not revealing.
We never made cliams in this forum of being experts, but no one has to be to know if something is working proficient.when you have seen one at work before. This forum is for educating, informing, and advising the saltwater community.
I know that anyone considering getting into the saltwater hobby, is not going to be foolish and not seek out any information. After all we are dealing with living organism, which some could get a little expensive.
i felt compelled to make a response,because the comments that were made by some individual could not go unchallenged, First i do have experience with this flawed,design deficient freedom filter equipment.
It's such a coincidence that the individual so vigorously defending this product and their salespeople just happen to be in the same location that this product is produce, sounds more like an employee. Or who knows? Since we can not really tell from the web.
This product does not operate like it cliams, and anyone using it i recommend getting a skimmer for it, i would bet that this person with the 55 gallon does not have only the freedom filter , they have additional filtration that they are not revealing.
We never made cliams in this forum of being experts, but no one has to be to know if something is working proficient.when you have seen one at work before. This forum is for educating, informing, and advising the saltwater community.
I know that anyone considering getting into the saltwater hobby, is not going to be foolish and not seek out any information. After all we are dealing with living organism, which some could get a little expensive.
bbehring
Well-known member
Well Cotton28, if you are taking about me, which I'm sure you are? I have nothing to do with this company period. I also have no idea where they are located and really don't care. I still stand by my posted comments and would attribute your "tank of doom" to your own matinenance practice or lack there of for that matter rather than blaming a piece of equipment. Actually people do operate reef tanks with many different equipment combinations and are successful at it. Actually there is success without runing skimmers (I personally wouldn't try this) but there are people out there that have and are very successful. I also noted your comment "This product does not operate like it cliams, and anyone using it i recommend getting a skimmer for it, i would bet that this person with the 55 gallon does not have only the freedom filter , they have additional filtration that they are not revealing". This I have already indicated earlier in this post if you would just read it? I do have a sump, in sump urchin skimmer (and over 90lbs of live rock, which last time I checked is an actual important filter). Like I said I never discounted your actual experience, I was simply giving my thoughts/opnion on the MFR, it's claims and the equipment itself. Like I've said, the unit is a good option for 65 gal tanks and under that have limited options and are sumpless. Do I think this is the future or the ultimate solution for the saltwater industry, no I don't.
cotton28
Member
no i was not refering to you. you are under enormous misconception. regardless of size a skimmer should skim. go back to my prior post and you will know what i'm using. i also have approximately 200 lbs of live rock, and a 40 gal for refugium. i do my daily, weekly, monthly maintenance. which i document all in a logbook. if i would not have implemented a skimmer in my system, which started skimming immediately then i would have a doom tank , thank you very much.
bbehring
Well-known member
oops my bad cotton28. Keep up the grate work!
All Flo Freedom Filter Pro
I just bought a new 70 gallon 48x13x25" tall aquarium and after reading all the posts here have decided to purchase the Freedom Filter Pro for this tank. Here is a better picture of the unit that shows arrows for the water flow: http://www.marineandreef.com/shoppro/filters_freedomfilter2.htm. I paid $250 for the filter, with pump installed - no sales tax and free shipping.
This is a larger version of what has been discussed here so far, up-sized to clean 75 to 125 gallon fish tanks with a flow rate of 950 gallons per hour. With 20" of its length under water, it still displaces only 3 gallons of my volume and will hang about one inch above my substrate on the far end of the tank. There's ample room next to it for my submersible heater and some bubble wall camouflage.
Though this Freedom Filter design is a controversial choice here, I have decided to try it out because 1) I have no room for a secondary external tank. 2) I don't want to risk flooding my living room from power outages. 3) I don't want any plumbing to deal with. 4) I can fill the inside chamber with any brand of bio-balls or activated carbon packs. 5) The interior is self-cleaning so scum from the filters and bio-balls gets flushed and skimmed out. 6) With such a high turnover rate a 'flow-past' filtration scheme like this can perform well. 7) The 'Pro' model increases the flow, upgrades the protein skimmer, enlarges the chamber and adds more carbon pads and reticulated foam.
To address the impact of having the intake water enter through vents low on the housing I plan to use the technique described by the manufacturer, whereby you lift out and remove the protein skimmer for a few minutes. This opens the unit at the top and allows surface waters to flow into the housing and then back out - into the lower tank for later removal.
This is the only filtration I plan to use for my aquarium so I think this will make a good test overall of the manufacturer's claim that this is all you need. By upsizing to a Pro I am giving this promising design every chance to live up to its billing.. and I won't pull any punches if it fails me!
Nice to meet you all.
Regards, Reeferboy.
I just bought a new 70 gallon 48x13x25" tall aquarium and after reading all the posts here have decided to purchase the Freedom Filter Pro for this tank. Here is a better picture of the unit that shows arrows for the water flow: http://www.marineandreef.com/shoppro/filters_freedomfilter2.htm. I paid $250 for the filter, with pump installed - no sales tax and free shipping.
This is a larger version of what has been discussed here so far, up-sized to clean 75 to 125 gallon fish tanks with a flow rate of 950 gallons per hour. With 20" of its length under water, it still displaces only 3 gallons of my volume and will hang about one inch above my substrate on the far end of the tank. There's ample room next to it for my submersible heater and some bubble wall camouflage.
Though this Freedom Filter design is a controversial choice here, I have decided to try it out because 1) I have no room for a secondary external tank. 2) I don't want to risk flooding my living room from power outages. 3) I don't want any plumbing to deal with. 4) I can fill the inside chamber with any brand of bio-balls or activated carbon packs. 5) The interior is self-cleaning so scum from the filters and bio-balls gets flushed and skimmed out. 6) With such a high turnover rate a 'flow-past' filtration scheme like this can perform well. 7) The 'Pro' model increases the flow, upgrades the protein skimmer, enlarges the chamber and adds more carbon pads and reticulated foam.
To address the impact of having the intake water enter through vents low on the housing I plan to use the technique described by the manufacturer, whereby you lift out and remove the protein skimmer for a few minutes. This opens the unit at the top and allows surface waters to flow into the housing and then back out - into the lower tank for later removal.
This is the only filtration I plan to use for my aquarium so I think this will make a good test overall of the manufacturer's claim that this is all you need. By upsizing to a Pro I am giving this promising design every chance to live up to its billing.. and I won't pull any punches if it fails me!
Nice to meet you all.
Regards, Reeferboy.
dhnguyen
Pain In The Arse
:lol: nice... First post ever and it's about this. Sales pitch anyone?
Give me a break
Give me a break
Skimmy
SKIM FU
i dont know what kind of "freedom" they are talking about, but they must live in russia or pakistan or the like...
mabye they are discussing the "freedom" to destroy life as we all know it in your aquarium...that seems more likely.:idea:
but all this whiny ass bs aside...
the real issue of efficently filtering your aquarium with hang in the tank or on the back equipment to sps quality is a real trip...
octopus's new hob skimmers with single and multiple needle wheel(mesh modable) pumps are the cheapest solution @ $100-$230, and there's room for your heater and whatever filtration media you want like carbon. three models currently, the bh100 (pump in the tank), bh100f(pump in skimmer body), and bh300f (2 pumps in skimmer body, and bubble plate)
tunze doc skimmers(9010, etc) are great in tank skimmers and very inconspicous. deltec hang on the back skimmer are great of coarse but go anywhere from $280 -$500.
there are some new hang on skimmers coming on the market like the ATB cone skimmers...absolutely awesome, and will either hang on the back or go in the sump. i know octopus has a in tank skimmer available in australia, not here yet, but coming soon. as well as a skimmer/refugium combo that is much better than the cpr bakpak version...
on a completely different note,
as for this quote:
"The real experts in this hobby, and the people I admire, are the ones that do things they are told 'cant' or 'shouldnt' be done cause they wont work."
that is the kind of logic i see from people that get p0wn3d by a reef tank after spending a grand or 2 (or worse yet 10g's)on it.
there is a fundamental basic collection of common sense methodology that is at the heart of virtually any LONG TERM sucessfull reef system.
...stick your nose up at that and you are asking for serious trouble, which is precisely what you are suggesting with a statement like that. just what a poor noob looking for real concrete advice needs...
mabye they are discussing the "freedom" to destroy life as we all know it in your aquarium...that seems more likely.:idea:
but all this whiny ass bs aside...
the real issue of efficently filtering your aquarium with hang in the tank or on the back equipment to sps quality is a real trip...
octopus's new hob skimmers with single and multiple needle wheel(mesh modable) pumps are the cheapest solution @ $100-$230, and there's room for your heater and whatever filtration media you want like carbon. three models currently, the bh100 (pump in the tank), bh100f(pump in skimmer body), and bh300f (2 pumps in skimmer body, and bubble plate)
tunze doc skimmers(9010, etc) are great in tank skimmers and very inconspicous. deltec hang on the back skimmer are great of coarse but go anywhere from $280 -$500.
there are some new hang on skimmers coming on the market like the ATB cone skimmers...absolutely awesome, and will either hang on the back or go in the sump. i know octopus has a in tank skimmer available in australia, not here yet, but coming soon. as well as a skimmer/refugium combo that is much better than the cpr bakpak version...
on a completely different note,
as for this quote:
"The real experts in this hobby, and the people I admire, are the ones that do things they are told 'cant' or 'shouldnt' be done cause they wont work."
that is the kind of logic i see from people that get p0wn3d by a reef tank after spending a grand or 2 (or worse yet 10g's)on it.
there is a fundamental basic collection of common sense methodology that is at the heart of virtually any LONG TERM sucessfull reef system.
...stick your nose up at that and you are asking for serious trouble, which is precisely what you are suggesting with a statement like that. just what a poor noob looking for real concrete advice needs...
Boca Kris
Member
Again, I am not going to come on here and pick fights with people, as its not my nature. However, I would like to clarify a few things.
First off, I was accused of having an affiliation with the company because I live in the same area? Until you mentioned that, I had no idea they were from here. I bought this unit from an LFS based on their recommendation. Its an LFS that I have used (and many other people here) from day one. Do they have an affiliation? I have no idea. That point is irrelevant. I have no affiliation whatsoever with the company OR the LFS.
Secondly, people keep mentioning the fact that the skimmer wont work. The filtration isnt enough. The pads wont get cleaned. Water wont pass through the charcoal. It will turn into a nitrate factory. Its a pos unit. Its not worth the salt it skims. Anyone who uses it must be from Russia.
Thats fine. Its ok to put someone down for using something based on someone elses recommendation. I was new to this hobby, and have since learned alot. If I were to do it over again, I would have planned my setup differently and allowed space for plumbing and a sump/refugium. At the time of building the area where my tank would go, I didn't know enough to do that. I just planned on having a tank where it is now.
That being said, my tank is now over a year old. It is in perfect running condition. I have no nitrate issues, or any other levels whatsoever. I test weekly and keep a log of everything I do to my tank. I do a 10% water change every 3 weeks religiously, and I top off regularly with RO. I have livestock in there that is over 10 months old. I have corals and mushrooms and polyps that grow and are very healthy. My skimmer basket needs to be emptied every other day, sooner if I feed more. I am very happy with the appearance and overall health of my tank.
As for the people who say its a pos? I'm not sure why everyone feels the need to bash when it would be just as easy to say you dont think it would work, and give your reasons. Im sure some of you are quite knowledgeable in the area of tanks and equipment, im sure much more so that I. I just know for me, putting someone else down for the methods they use, does nothing to further the hobby, or promote good spirited passing on of knowledge. Especially when the product is working for someone.
I know a few people in my area that have used the product, most with other forms of filtration or skimming, but overall good experiences. I also talked to several people from other boards that have used the product, and almost all of them had good experiences.
Is this product a solution for everyone? No. But it worked for me.
I don't think I'll be posting anymore in the thread because it seems that the purpose changed from discussing the Freedom Filter, to bashing the ignorant people that have chosen to use one.
Good luck to all of you and your tanks! I hope you have a great experiences with whatever equipment you choose!
First off, I was accused of having an affiliation with the company because I live in the same area? Until you mentioned that, I had no idea they were from here. I bought this unit from an LFS based on their recommendation. Its an LFS that I have used (and many other people here) from day one. Do they have an affiliation? I have no idea. That point is irrelevant. I have no affiliation whatsoever with the company OR the LFS.
Secondly, people keep mentioning the fact that the skimmer wont work. The filtration isnt enough. The pads wont get cleaned. Water wont pass through the charcoal. It will turn into a nitrate factory. Its a pos unit. Its not worth the salt it skims. Anyone who uses it must be from Russia.
Thats fine. Its ok to put someone down for using something based on someone elses recommendation. I was new to this hobby, and have since learned alot. If I were to do it over again, I would have planned my setup differently and allowed space for plumbing and a sump/refugium. At the time of building the area where my tank would go, I didn't know enough to do that. I just planned on having a tank where it is now.
That being said, my tank is now over a year old. It is in perfect running condition. I have no nitrate issues, or any other levels whatsoever. I test weekly and keep a log of everything I do to my tank. I do a 10% water change every 3 weeks religiously, and I top off regularly with RO. I have livestock in there that is over 10 months old. I have corals and mushrooms and polyps that grow and are very healthy. My skimmer basket needs to be emptied every other day, sooner if I feed more. I am very happy with the appearance and overall health of my tank.
As for the people who say its a pos? I'm not sure why everyone feels the need to bash when it would be just as easy to say you dont think it would work, and give your reasons. Im sure some of you are quite knowledgeable in the area of tanks and equipment, im sure much more so that I. I just know for me, putting someone else down for the methods they use, does nothing to further the hobby, or promote good spirited passing on of knowledge. Especially when the product is working for someone.
I know a few people in my area that have used the product, most with other forms of filtration or skimming, but overall good experiences. I also talked to several people from other boards that have used the product, and almost all of them had good experiences.
Is this product a solution for everyone? No. But it worked for me.
I don't think I'll be posting anymore in the thread because it seems that the purpose changed from discussing the Freedom Filter, to bashing the ignorant people that have chosen to use one.
Good luck to all of you and your tanks! I hope you have a great experiences with whatever equipment you choose!
cotton28
Member
yes, sales pitch it is, sorry but if the unit was anything the manufactor claims it is why do you have to lift the skimmer up. how can it be the future of filtration. do you think you will do this every day for a few min. highly unlikely. where is the freedom ?? you are adding more maintenance. by you everyday doing what the individual said you are comprimising the water. we make our choices, you already have .
p.s. i used to own two and never had any of the cup holders filled completely in one day, so that tells you about the skimmer flaw. and yes this forum is for discussing to inform, adviced saltwater hobbyist of pros and cons of items.
p.s. i used to own two and never had any of the cup holders filled completely in one day, so that tells you about the skimmer flaw. and yes this forum is for discussing to inform, adviced saltwater hobbyist of pros and cons of items.
