Increasing O2

[pyton]

We took the water to be tested. lights on for 5 1/2 hours pH is at 8.6/8.7 in the tank. We quit using the ca reactor because chamber reading very high all the time. Higher than the tank so we did not want to get too much CO2 in tank.
The only thing that die in tank are some of the SPS coral. Once at a time, never more than one.
One acan look good the other tightly closed.

 

[returnofsid]

I don't know for sure, but it seems like, if you bag up water, or put water in any enclosed container, and then transport it to a LFS for testing, the oxygen level of that water is going to drop, in transit.

Your pH level is actually slightly high, which, to me, indicates that you don't have a low oxygen level. I could be wrong, but I'm almost sure that a low oxygen level, would also create a low pH level.

Shall we move this to Boomer's chemistry forum, for his input?

 

[pyton]

sure if it helps shed some light on this issue

 

[returnofsid]

Ohhh Boomer...we need your expertise!!

 

[pyton]

Would Chemipads work to remove things we do not want in my tank? It was suggested by a local fish store yesterday. Just not sure that would solve this issue. does anyone use Chemipads?

 

[DonW]

I dont have a clue how your measuring o2 content but its probably not accurate. You stated your ph is 8.6 / 8.7 if your o2 was low your co2 would be elevated and ph would fall accordingly or your ph would just be low. In the future if you develop low ph issues look for areas mentioned earlier in the thread but IMO more importantly is nutrient levels. Nutrient levels can be deceptive. People concentrate on that 0 they see on the test kit instead of understanding the combination of measurements needs to be looked at as a whole.

Don

 

[mcvicker]

Solubility of oxygen in saltwater at our tanks temps (78 to 80) is about 6.5, so it is impossible to get over 7. Solubility in freshwater is around 10 and it is recommended to keep oxygen at 70% saturation (so over 7). I don't think oxygen is your problem, it sounds like you are doing everything right. I know some people have their calcium reactor empty into a small container with an air stone to drive out the CO2 prior to spilling over into the sump to keep the oxygen (and consequently pH) up at a good level. I hope this helps.

 

[Maxx]

Krish, photosyth is exactly what Bourneman was referring to.

Pyton, I seriously doubt that zoanthids will provide enough O2 from photosynthesis to raise O2 levels in the tank.

I have to agree w/ other posters regarding your O2 levels most likely not being low, but rather due to your test kit being off.
If your losing acros check your tank parameters about an hour or two after lights go out. Compare them with the parameters from before.

 

[pyton]

Update:
Today we got the Apex controller we order. also a friend bring his controller, DA I think. We set up to montior the tank and both controllers were very close. My temp of my tank was high, we was using a heater that had it own controller. we had it set to 79 max. the tank was 86 and heater was on still. Also pH was ok a bit high for ca reactor but not off the chart. We will go talk to Barbie or Kevin tomorrow, maybe one of them will be able to test water and see what we need to do.

Thank you everyone who try to help..

 

[Maxx]

Prolonged high temps will stress out acros and causes losses.

 

[Gordonious]

Water parameters and testing them are important however there is a couple things no one asked about(may I missed it and maybe everyone here knows from another thread), but they are critically important.

Having a power head near the surface does not mean you have enough flow and will get enough oxygenation. A MaxiJet 600 in a 400g tank is close to worthless. So what size is your tank and what are you using for flow?

Measuring pH, and temp 24/7 with a controller can be critical. If you are opening a window during the day and closing things off at night there could be a significant change night to day.

Have you been meaning to say that your pH is too low for calcium reactor? You said it was a bit high, do you mean the pH in the calcium reactor?
What is the pH in your calcium reactor?
What is the highest your pH reaches in your tank?
What is the lowest your pH drops in your tank?
High and low temps?

All important information that perhaps I missed somewhere. It seems like people are trying to help by over-analyzing, but missing the basics.

 

[pyton]

The window is only crack open to get fresh air in. We do not make it full open.

We bought this entire set up from a guy who is moving and gave us a great deal on it since we took everything.

Tank is 240 with a high pressure return pump and a 7 magum power head at top of tank.
The bottom of the tank drilled using two 4 way valve and snapper pumps for close loop.

pH in cal reactor would read 8 to 10 all the time so we quit using it. we boguht new probe and calibrate it. It still read the same, found out yesterday it required grounding probe to read right.

pH in tank would be 8.4 to 8.7 depending on time of day.

The temp controller we had was to turn fan on if got to 79 and turn off at 78.
High and low temps?
If the tank got 77 or below the heater was to turn on until 78.

This is what we have done in the last few days which seemed to have helped.
Added Aqua Controller with
pH probe for tank and cal reactor
auto top off with float switches
temp probe
outlet box controlled by the aqua controller to keep things stable.

60 gallon water change over the last two days because we start to see things on sand that were were told to suck out of tank.


the controller showed the temp of our tank when we first installed was high, we confirmed by using a borrowed reefkeeper which had same temp as our new one.

list of corals lost, forgive us we do not know too many name
all of these were softball size corals except the purple one he say it grows very slow it was almost baseball size

purple arco - forgot name
ora chips
marshal island chips
ora hawkins
ora tri color
becker tort
green hulk arco
large green tort - myogiee I think he called it

if someone have anything on our lost list we would like to replace

 

[Gordonious]

8.0 to 10.0 pH in the calcium reactor? You see CO2 bubbles in the bubble counter? You sure your CO2 tank has CO2?

Yes high and low temps that your tank reaches. Perhaps there is a language barrier here. How cold does your tank actually get and how hot does it get? Not what do you tell it to be, but what does it actually get to. Do you have the Apex hooked to a computer so you can read the charts and graphs?

I find it very odd you have such high pH. Typically most people have trouble getting there pH to 8.2-8.3 from lower. 8.7 is really odd. What chemicals are you adding to the tank? Are you sure the probe is calibrated right?

Can you take a video or pictures of the tank?

Do not replace a single coral yet. If things are dieing it is a very bad idea to add anything else. Not only should you first solve the issue before more corals are harmed, but introducing new animals that are not properly quarantined could introduce more pests and problems and just make things go down hill even faster. On top of that corals that are transfered to your tank from somewhere else are going to be stressed from the transfer and if any corals dies over night there is good odds the new ones will be first to go. Just trying to help.

 

[pyton]

We bought an apex controller with all new probes
We bought new co2 regulator from aquariumplants.com
We bought chiller and new heater set up

pH is now at 6.4 to 6.5 in reactor and 8.2 to 8.4 in tank
temp has been stable at 78.0 to 78.6

lost a few more corals so sending out water to test lab tomorrow

 

[Boomer]

Well, I did read all of this but 99 % of all tanks are not at saturation. Many tanks are in the 5's. Mojo's and Don W post more or less give what is going on. Most low O2 levels are from to much "life-form" in a tank and those with poor maintenance. Very well keep tanks with good circulation and skimming will be the highest, some approaching sat and at times during the day be above sat. Many THINK their tanks are at sat or above and most are not at all. I do not care how a tank is run or what one claims when it comes to O2, only a good test kit like a LaMotte or HACH will tell you what is going on. In most tanks the O2 is not an issue, even at 5 ppm. Some FOT run in the 4's and all fish to fine. However, I would try to keep it above 5, for as a little burp in the system and you will be at dangerous levels. Lastly, I will add, that on some coral reefs at night the O2 is so low it is dangerous. There are chem means for increasing O2 but it is dangerous with out a O2 test kit.



In regards to Eric B. I'm not a fan either but this was a very well done article.


The Need to Breathe, Part 3: Real Tanks and Real Importance by Eric Borneman - Reefkeeping.com

 

[pyton]

Thank you boomer, I guess I was sent on wrong path. After reading and talking to some of my local shops they all agreed I had a form of bacteria that needed to be removed. We did lots of water changes, 10% the first time and 5% each one after that twice a day for the last week. Just when we were about to give up we were sold marine max by a local shop, and as soon as we added it the white spots stopped getting bigger. They are still there but they are not growing and taking out our corals. I just wish we knew what really caused this issue for now we can only guess.

 

[tamarindthai]

from,,crashing water from return in to the sump and breaking water surface in the DP tank should be good to go....

 

[pyton]

The battle continues, Well I ended up doing a 40% water change and the issue was still the same
At night the corals would do worse.
A few nights I would walk by my tank and everything was off. Something was tripping my GFI, I figured it was old and hot so I would unplug it for a bit and plug in my EB8's directly into the wall. The EB8 never tripped the 15amp breaker so I really thought my GFI was going bad. I unplugged everything from the EB8 and plugged into the GFI. The GFI did not trip so I added one piece of equipment at a time. To the plugs they were to go to. As soon as I got to the heater it tripped.

The heater controller (Jalli HT-1000) had a fuse on it and it never blew out so I unplugged the heater tube from the controller and plugged in the controller to the EB8 and it tripped.
Took out the heater controller and the heating tube. Looks like the heater tube exploded inside and blew off part of the end cap so it was no longer water tight.

All of this makes sense now. The corals were not getting worse during the day only at night. It has been two nights now and no new white spots. The Apex controller is reading stable levels now and the tank is getting to look better and better. I just really hope that was the final issue. I am going to do water tests every day for two weeks to make sure nothing is spiking or dipping that I have failed to see.

I know I need to get a heater because I am replacing the closed loop that came with this tank with Tunze 6105's this closed loop pump heats up the water so by replacing it I know I will need that heater.

What is the best 1000W heater out there the 800W just was not enough.

thanks

 

[Maxx]

Buy two 500 watt heatets and program your Apex to turn them off if water temp hits something 84 degrees. I've used visitherm heaters for several years now with no issues. Glad to hear you figured out the cause.

Nick

 

[Boomer]

Yes, glad to see you seem to have fixed the issue.