Lets Talk about ~Algae~

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Alright, I did a bit more research and I will retract several of my statements that Mike had rebuttals for. All of the images of reefs that I have seen have visible algae, but I guess they are all in decline (I was born too late to see the pristine reefs ;)).

On the shrimps...I have no scientific evidence, but I have observed cleaner shrimp in tanks that appear much happier in a stand of macro algae than on the rocks.


If you grow macros to export and then allow fish to graze it, well no export. Also I think thier alot of alturnative sources of food you could find that would be far more nutritional.
I agree. I would never use macros as an export because I wouldn't want the maintainence. I was thinking purely of a natural food source. Many fishes naturally graze, and providing an alternate food source that allows grazing might be difficult.


I found the following info on a NOAA site:
Functional algal groups

Tropical reef algae can be divided into three key functional algal groups: crustose coralline algae, algal turfs, and macroalgae. Using a functional grouping approach is useful for understanding broader generalizations on the ecology of algae as well as predicting changes in algal community structure. Crustose coralline algae are often calcified, usually pink in color and adhere to the substrate; although some species have different characteristics. Algal turfs consist mostly of tiny filaments with canopy heights of less than 10 mm. Macroalgae are usually larger, canopy-formers, including brown algae (Dictyota, Sargassum), red algae (Gracilaria, Laurencia); green algae (Caulerpa, Microdictyon) and can be either fleshy (e.g., Lobophora) or calcareous (e.g., Halimeda).


Crustose coralline
Crustose corallines are calcified, often encrusting algae usually pink to dark burgundy in color (e.g., Porolithon, Peyssonnelia, Lithophyllum). Crustose coralline algae play two important roles in the coral reef community, first by contributing calcium carbonate to reef structure and second by possibly facilitating settlement of coral recruits. The ecology of crustose corallines is complex often interrelated with the presence of macro and turf algae, grazing intensity by herbivores, and productivity.


Turf algae
Turf algae are a multispecific assemblage of diminutive, often filamentous, algae that attain a canopy height of only 1 to 10 mm (see Steneck 1988 for review). These microalgal species have a high diversity (>100 species in western Atlantic), although only 30 to 50 species commonly occur at one time. There is a high turnover of individual turf algal species seasonally and only a few species are able to persist or remain abundant throughout the year. But turf algae, when observed as a functional group, remain relatively stable year round (Steneck and Dethier 1994). They are often able to recovery rapidly after being partially consumed by herbivores. Turfs are capable of trapping ambient sediment and kill corals by gradual encroachment.


Macroalgae

Macroalgae are larger (canopy height usually >10mm) erect algae often with anatomically complex forms. Most macroalgae possess some from of deterrent against herbivory, either through chemical deterrents or structural resistance. Although macroalgae are often more resistant to physical and biological disturbances than corallines and turfs, grazing by certain herbivores and high wave action can inhibit macroalgal growth. High macroalgal biomass can interfere with coral recruitment and reduce coral survival.
 
ok, but really what types do you really want to deal with. I hate the stuff on my rocks, excluding coralline I'd rather keep my tank sterile than have to deal with harvest & associated cleanings, lets face it, this stuff won't ever back down, you slip & it is there!
 
Can someone explain Briopsis to me? I have a patch of Briopsis. I keep hearing a member tell me about how awful it is. I think I keep it just for watching his face when he comes over...lmao...
 
It grows rapidly when conditions in the tank are right (I guess I should say when conditions are wrong). It contains toxins so most herbivores you buy won't touch it. It fragments if you pull it manually in the tank. It can also reproduce sexually.
Asexual reproduction in Bryopsis is known to occur in two ways. The simplest method of asexual reproduction is vegetatively through abscission. Every once in awhile, when a frond or fragment of the plant gets broken off, the base will close itself off (see wound healing in the morphology section) and develop into a rhizoid. The fragment will eventually become a gametophyte, but not all fronds/fragments that break off from the main plant will become gametophytes.
Bryopsis

There are a few critters that are immune to it's toxin. Lettuce nudis or some foxfaces tend to die in our tanks once all of the Bryopsis is gone and a lot of them sold won't even touch it.
In the aquarium trade, lettuce sea slugs are marketed as control agents for Bryopsis, though Delbeek and Sprung (1994) suggest that only certain color forms will feed on Bryopsis (see www.seaslugforum.net for photos of some of the different color forms).
Sunbathing Sea Slugs Most foxfaces won't it either and they come with the added bonus of a poisonous dorsal fin. Sea Hares will ink up your water like an octopus if picked at by other fish. Sea Hare Inking.

Even if you are successful in getting a critter to eat Bryopsis, their mere predation of the algae is spreading it around your tank as mentioned in the paragraph on reproduction.
 
Curt,
Thanks for the information. That does not look exactly like what I have though. I wish I could show you a pix of it. I have pods galore and bristle worms inside it galore. My mandarin just sits outside it waiting for his next meal.
 
There are several species of Bryopsis so maybe you have a different one. It's also possible you have a species of Derbesia.
 
Your always going to have some algae on reefs Reed. Calcerious algaes are a different animal, they use forms of elements in order to grow. Algaes need food to grow, for them its the presence of Nitrogen and phosphates. In the wild these are two things that are really not present in any real quantities. When ever you do see algae see algae on a reef, you know that the enviroment has skewed to where N and P are present. Algae are far more effective at capturing these and thus will out compete corals for the resources, also they are very effective fighters and will will the battle for real estate.


Oh and I love happy shrimp, hehe

Mike
 
Hey Mike.

Yep, I have read that recently about the elevated N & P levels. I understand that all too well.
 
Algae alternatives

So......now we understand that there are bad side effects to algae...not good for SPS as I clearly understand in my own tank now. I also have a protein skimmer but it does not take out all the bad stuff. What else is used to filter out harmful elements and chemicals besides a protein skimmer and algae?
I was using Carbon to filter my water. I read in the "Marine Atlas 1" that we should at use it for 7 days and then off for 14 days. I have read some people in "Ultimate Marine aquariums" run carbon all the time because of the Coral chemical warefare. I use the 7 and 14 approach because my soft corals don't like it when I use carbon for more than one week. I suppose you could use it all the time for an SPS only. I am trying for a variety because I like a variety even though it can be more challenging to keep softies and hard corals together.

So from you experts out there in the deep blue....tank. What are our alternatives?

:)
 
Kyle I dont think thier is a black and white answer to that question. I have been doing this for a bit, and cant think of anything that will be totally effective and removing all of the byproducts of algae and/or soft corals. Its more of a location and proximity type of thing.

Mike
 
This is a great time to discuss How do we get rid of the unwanted Algae.

For real, we need to start simple & then we need to dig deep because we all hate it, unless we're using it purposely.

 
Good direction Scott. For me the bes way to get rid of Algae is to kill its food source. This mean limiting and eliminating nutrients in our tanks. We can talk a bit about the methods used in order to do that to.
One of the big things forget about is LR. Lr naturally produces detritus through bacterial action. this detritus is a favorite of algae and algae will quickly form in crevices and collection points on the LR. Once the algae forms thier, it has a constant supply of nutrients that is hard to interupt. Making sure your rocks are blown clean and this detritus is not allowed to stay thier is critical.


MIke
 
Step One!

I think this is one problem I'm facing with my LR, I need a better way or
maybe a better turkey blaster to clean these rock surface areas. I sometime use a PH but thoes don't seem to
have enough focused water to do an effective job, I've even hooked up a 900GPH pump to blow the LR, I guess I could of tried some modified hose narrowed down to make more pressure. I use to turkey baster, with sharp direct blows I can clean the surface area well, but the problem Is cramping hands & a baster full of water. I'm open to better ways or designs on blowing these rocks. The thing is we need an efficient way of doing it, & a way it is also practical. This would be a major batter on problematic algae's, we need a motor scooter blaster, with a long flexible hose attached that won't spew water all over & is easy to save up until next cleaning.
 
Yup,

Keepin' those rocks clean is definately key. I like turkey basters for spot cleaning but I also like to get most of the detritus off with a powerhead....it just seems faster.

Beyond that, overfeeding is problematic as it loads the system with excess fish waste, uneaten food, etc. That means a corresponding rise in Phosphates and Nitrates. Algae likes both of those things so keeping them down is important. If you have an abundance of those, you're gonna have algae regardless of how many herbivores you put into your tank. We've already discussed how some algae fragments if it is eaten. Some algae spores go right through the digestion track of a critter and spread in that manner.

In my mind, we have to attack algae on several fronts.

Limit Nutrients....take care of the Phosphates in your food and never overfeed.
Keep it clean....Keep your LR clean and don't allow waste to break down in the tank.
Export Nutrients....in spite of limiting the inputs of nutrients, we are adding them every time we feed. Keep your skimmer in tip-top shape to export as many DOCs, Phosphates, detritus, etc.
 

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