Let's Talk About ~Reefkeeping Dangers~

[NaH2O]

Thanks Playa and Kevin for contributing! I never realized the dangers of zoanthids until I read a thread on RC (charlie mentioned) about a dog that ingested a fatal amount. It was an eye opener....especially considering I have a very young child in the house.

Originally posted by Scooterman
I've read about this once, I've heard many ideas, treatments but when fish get sick, it isn't easy getting them back to good health.

You're right, Scott. It appears that the tried methods of treatment haven't worked out very well. After reading on this bacteria, if there is a fish suspected to be infected, the best thing to do is either quarantine, or euthanize. In a quarantine situation, the tank and parts would need to be washed out with a bleach solution, as this particular bacteria has been shown to survive through even a dry tank. The article I've linked below suggests after a fish dies from M. marinum it (the fish) should be treated in a bleach solution and thrown away - instead of being flushed. This way it will reduce the risk of spreading a strain that may be really strong, and resistant to antibiotics.

In order to reduce the risk.....keep your fish disease free. Quarantine your new arrivals. WASH YOUR HANDS after having them in the tank (while washing sing "Happy Birthday" twice.....that way you know you've washed for an effective amount of time). Wear gloves...especially if you have a wound on your hand or arm. Use aquarium tongs, magnet cleaners, long handled algae scrapers.

The following link is to an informative article:

Mycobacterium marinum: The Fish Disease You Could Catch

**Just to warn those that might be a bit squeemish - there are some pictures of an infected finger.

 

[piercho]

I have long grabbers (doesn't everybody?) that keep me from touching the water in many cases when I need to work in the tank. But it's innevitable that you will periodically have to dive in.

I wear thin, disposable latex gloves when I handle corals and other "soft" organisms. When I'm doing heavy service in the tank, like lifting encrusted rock, I wear the heavier latex gloves. When I'm just in the water, say to siphon, I don't wear anything. Regardless, I wash with soap religously before and after any skin that is getting wet.

IMO allergic reactions and bacterial infections are a greater day-to-day risk when working in the tank than coral toxins. I've had hard swellings develop in skin that got abraded against rocks while working in the tank. These swellings persisted for several days. I don't know why I haven't just bought some of the to-the-armpit gloves so I can avoid contact with the tank water altogether. Careless, lazy, or rationalizing that contact with the water alone isn't that dangerous. Maybe this thread will motivate me to get some.

That working with any coral with you bare hands is reckless should be obvious. The palyotixins from Zoanthus are one threat. But all coral are coated with a bacteria-rich mucous slime that can contain infectious agents - like vibrio sp bacteria - that are a threat to your health. Repeated exposure to a coral's nematocysts raise your chance that you will eventually develop a toxic reaction to it. Thin latex gloves are cheap when you get them in hundred-lots from the painting section of the hardware. The thicker gloves are re-usable and can be bought in dozen-packs from Costco for a few bucks.

I'm glad someone mentioned about wearing safety glasses. I haven't thought to bother in the past. The eyes are an obvious entry point (skin is pretty good protection), and even when I went after a Favid with a hammer and chisel a couple of weeks back I don't think I stopped to reach for the glasses that were within arms reach on my bench. A very good point.

 

[Curtswearing]

I'm glad you mentioned the allergies. I'm highly allergic to numerous corals in my tank. I actually have scars on my forearms that are from touching various corals while working in my tank without gloves.

You can slowly build up hypersensitivities to many things in our tanks so don't assume that because you aren't allergic to something today, you won't be allergic to it tommorrow. A nurse explained it to me in this way......."it takes a while for our bodies to build up histamines to the allergen (histamines cause allergic symptoms)".

Beyond the gloves, I recommend keeping a good antihistamine around (like Benadryl).

If you have been told to keep an Epi-Pen around for allergic reactions to bee stings, ant stings, etc. make sure you keep it close to your tank and make sure it hasn't expired. People have had anaphylactic shock before from coral reef inhabitants and you want your Epi-Pen within reach.

I know of people who can touch everything in their tank, I know someone who can't touch anything, and I know people who can touch certain things but not others. Wearing gloves only makes sense to me.

Does anyone else have allergies that you know of?

 

[Pyxis]

Well,

Most know me from RS, and have heard about my experience with LTA's. I had just gotten my LTA and was placing him in my tank when the curent got his tenticles swaying around and got the back of my hand up to my wrist. I had a instant burning then numbness in my hand and forearm which also had created intense pain in my shoulder as well.

After being pursueded to go to the ER. (PLAYA Thanks again) I soon went into anaflactic shock. I got to spend the evening in the ER while being treated for this. For those of you who dont know about anaflactic's is the alergies to insect stings. (Bee's, Scorpion's and yes Jellies)

I had burn marks across my hand and wrist from this little guy and went thru some pretty intence pain from the burning sensation. Needless to say I now wear gloves when i handle my tank and i also have an epi pen.

If you are anaflactic I would suggest having some gloves and keep your epi pen close to your tank.

Hope this helps

 

[NaH2O]

Pyxis - Welcome!! Thanks for coming over and contributing to this thread. Your story (along with Playa and Kevin) may help someone in the future.

When looking at the inhabitants in our tanks....our physical contact is limited prior to owning a tank (unless you live or visit reefs often and touch corals)....so when we finally have first contact - we may become sensitive to the coral or anemone. Then, each time we expose ourselves to them - we can become more and more sensitive over time.....leading to an allergic response. For those that are allergic to stings, use caution when working in your tank. Keep your Epi-pen in an easy to reach place, and PLEASE make sure it hasn't EXPIRED! Curt, also brings a good point in talking about his own arms having scars from corals in his tank. Even if you don't get anaphylactic shock, you could have a severe localized reaction.

For more information on anaphylactic shock: Anaphylaxis - Life-threating allergy

Here is another good link on marine stings: All Stings Considered

 

[Curtswearing]

I took this quote out of your link Nikki.....

"one man's meat is another man's poison".

We really don't know if we are susceptible to a particular allergen until we find out the hard way. Nor do we know how many exposures are required to build up enough histamines to trigger a minor localized reaction or a major anaphylactic shock reaction from something that was fine before.

I'm glad that everyone who has had issues is doing just fine now. However, as someone who has had anaphylactic shock (my throat started closing up and I couldn't breathe), I want to remind everyone to wear gloves (and sometimes goggles) and wash EVERY time you work with your tank.

 

[NaH2O]

Thanks, Curt. It is important to keep in mind that you really don't know when anaphylaxis will occur. One time you get hives and swelling, and the next could be anaphylaxis. Everyone responds differently.

The next toxin I want to cover is conotoxins - the venom from Cone Snails. If you should happen to encounter a cone snail in your tank as a hitchhiker (most cone snails live in the Indo-Pacific region), use caution when removing. Cone Snails aren't the most agile creatures, so in order for their prey to be captured, venom is injected that causes paralysis. There have been documented cases of human envenomation - some fatal, however, they don't deliberately try to sting humans unless bothered. Cone Snail venom is a neurotoxin that is diverse and potent depending on species. In fact, the cone snail itself changes the make-up of its toxin as needed. The various neurotoxins have different modes of action. For example, three classes affect neuronal communication, but by different targets (i.e. sodium channels and nerve receptors).

One note I've come across....if you ever happen to be envenomated by a cone snail, it is important to take note of what the shell looked like or bring it along to the ER.

For more information on Conotoxins and their modes of action: Cone Snail Neurotoxins

Here are 3 interesting videos of a cone snail and prey: Envenomation by a Cone Snail - this one shows the prey after it has been envenomated.
Predator - the movie clip
The Predator strikes again

The conotoxins have been studied for use on humans that have acute and chronic pain (i.e. terminally ill patients). For more on this research see:Painkiller from the Sea
I also found palytoxin has been studied for cancer research.

 

[NaH2O]

I thought I'd mention the Blue Ring Octopus, since its bite is deadly. The following quote is taken from: Dangers on the Reef....Blue Ring Octopus

The bite might be painless, but this octopus injects a neuromuscular paralysing venom. The venom contains some maculotoxin, a poison more violent than any found on land animals. The blue-ringed octopus is the size of a golf ball but its poison is powerful enough to kill an adult human in minutes.

The venom is found in the saliva of the octopus:

The poison is not injected but is contained in the octopus's saliva, which comes from two glands each as big as its brain. Poison from the one is used on its main prey, crabs, and is relatively harmless to humans. Poison from the other gland serves as defense against predators. The blue-ringed octopus either secretes the poison in the vicinity of its prey, waits until it is immobile and then devours it, or it jumps out and envelops the prey in its 8 tentacles and bites it.

We've heard a couple of incidents with fish. I know that lionfish, rabbitfish, stone, and Marine Catfish, can give you a good stick. Anyone know of any others? I think it is important if you keep any of these fish, and you need to get into the tank, keep an eye on the fish at all times.

 

[Scooterman]

WOW, that is a good idea, to have a place to look up any dangers like this, great job Nikki!

 

[tomz]

There is a relevant article in this months (May) Smithsonian titled “Medicine From The Sea” that is interesting.

 

[NaH2O]

Thanks, tom! Are there a couple of points worth mentioning here? (or anyone that has it)

 

[tomz]

Hi Nikki,

There are but I'll need to have access to the article (which is at home) to relay the points. I'll post later today... if I remember



Tom

 

[Al G.]

Here's something relative.

bioactive agents in corals

 

[NaH2O]

Al - awesome link! There appears to be some potential for new cancer fighting drugs in the marine environment. I watched my mom go through many different chemotherapies, and it will be nice if the ones mentioned in the article make it to FDA approval.

I wanted to mention about bristleworms....I know they may be cute, but petting one of these fuzzy guys will give you a good sting in the finger.

Here is an article on Lionfish Envenomations and the Aquarist

Another article I'll point out is on Venomous Corals: The Fire Corals Here is a quote:

Although it can be quite painful, a sting from Fire coral is rarely dangerous unless accompanied by an allergic reaction or anaphylactic shock. In fact, the most serious effects seen after extensive stings are possible nausea and vomiting for two to three hours afterwards. The sting caused by these animals is a result of the injection of a water-soluble, heat affected, proteinaceous toxin. The discharged nematocysts cause small welts on the skin with red lesions around the raised areas. Swelling, blisters, and pus-filled encystations may occur soon after being stung. However, all symptoms generally disappear after 24 hours. If stung, treatment consists of a breakdown of the protein by soaking the affected area in hot water, swabbing the welts with vinegar, or applying a paste of meat tenderizer. After initial treatment, topical anesthetics may be applied to ease the burning sensation. It may also ease suffering to repeatedly issue forth numerous expletives in a loud voice.

 

[NaH2O]

Stomatopods are gaining in popularity for species tanks, and I thought I'd mention them here. Mantis species come in either Spearer and Smasher variety. Either one can really hurt your fingers and/or hand (plus the potential of a secondary bacterial infection) if you disturb them.

The following quotes are taken from: Secrets of the Stomatopod - Raptorial Appendages. There is a picture showing the difference in the different appendages.

The earliest stomatopods with raptorial appendages (“raps”) were “spearers,” with sharp barbs on their raps used to impale fish, shrimp, or other soft-bodied prey. Spearers are lightning-fast: it takes only two milliseconds (2/1000 of a second) for a spearer to extend its rap! In contrast, the blink of an eye is 100 milliseconds. The strike is similar to that of the insect praying mantis, which earned the stomatopods their common name of mantis shrimp, but the stomatopod strike is at least 10 times faster.

If a smasher were the size of a human, the force of its “punch” would be equivalent to a small caliber gun!

 

[mattj206]

The cone snails look like conch's. Scary

 

[Al G.]

I don't if you guys are old enough to remember Hawaii 5-O, you still can catch in syndication, in one episode the killer uses a cone snail to kill his victims. He takes them out of the fish tank, commits his crime and then returns it to the fish tank, therefor hiding the murder weapon, or so he thought.
No one fools McGarrett. Book'em Danno!

 

[NaH2O]

NO WAY!!! I don't remember the show, but wow!

 

[Curtswearing]

LOL....I never thought of that. I've alway used blue-ring octopus.

 

[Curtswearing]

There are a lot of different things that could be covered in this thread......lionfish, rabbitfish, stonefish, boxfish, etc. The list goes on and on and should be discussed.

However, there is one particular danger that is a little different from what we have been discussing so far. A lot of reefers don't take enough precautions regarding the fact that WATER AND ELECTRICITY IS A BAD COMBO!!!!

I wanted to point out a great thread I found here on ELECTRICAL ISSUES

Here is some ELECTRICAL INFO