loss of water?

[cobyb]

hello i'v been slowly learning how all this works, but i just made a diy sump, old 55 gal, and i seem to need to add 4 gallons of ro every 5-6 days. i have a 120 gallon dt and the sump holds about 30 gallons. thier is also a small 12 gallon frag tank who shares the same sump. my dt is not a closed loop system with possible bulkhead leaks, and i'v checked for leaks in the tanks, sump, and pluming.
so my big question is could i have that much water evaporate?
i made the big mistake of letting my salinity fluctuate and i lost a couple sps frags.
thanks to all who can help

 

[krisfal]

hello i'v been slowly learning how all this works, but i just made a diy sump, old 55 gal, and i seem to need to add 4 gallons of ro every 5-6 days. i have a 120 gallon dt and the sump holds about 30 gallons. thier is also a small 12 gallon frag tank who shares the same sump. my dt is not a closed loop system with possible bulkhead leaks, and i'v checked for leaks in the tanks, sump, and pluming.
so my big question is could i have that much water evaporate?
i made the big mistake of letting my salinity fluctuate and i lost a couple sps frags.
thanks to all who can help

I have a 425g +/- system running 3-250w MH bulbs and evaporate 4-5 gallons a day, so I think your evaporation rate is not out of line. If you have small leaks in the system they are going to show themselves in time with salt creep. I would recommend setting up an auto top off system, makes keeping your salinity steady much easier.

 

[Krish]

This thread may ease your mind, but evaporation is normal at that rate. No worries. http://www.reeffrontiers.com/forums/f36/how-many-gallons-do-you-lose-week-59181/

 

[cobyb]

wow i thought i was crazy for thing is was evaporation, it just did not seem right. thanks for your help. witch ato do you use, or recommend?

 

[cobyb]

wow krish, perfect thread. thanks, i thought i had somthing going wrong.

 

[Krish]

Haha!!! Some people evaporate over a gallon a day easy. All depends on a number of different factors etc. As for ATO's, I've never used one personally. I just top off with ro/di water as needed.

 

[returnofsid]

Coby, along with the link that Krish supplied, here's another way to ease your mind. Test your salinity after a couple of weeks. IF you're actually leaking saltwater, and replacing it with RO/DI water, your salinity will drop. If you're replacing evaporation, with RO/DI water, your salinity will not fluctuate.

But, as has been mentioned, your water loss rate is actually very minimal. I lose the amount you lose, in our 24 gallon Nano. (1 gallon/day) In our 200, I'm topping off 4 gallons/DAY!

 

[cobyb]

what a relief thank you .

 

[vinny2261]

I would top off more often. As your level drops your splash increases which evaporates more water.

 

[Cobyjf]

I have the exact system you have..... (kinda funny)... and I lose the exact same amount through evaporation lol

 

[psb]

The general rule of thumb for evaporation is one to two percent of water volume per day depending on the temp of the water and humidity of the house. So with a cooler tank you should be losing 1.6 gallons a day. So when you put in 5 gallons every three to 4 days that is exactly in line. I put almost 2 gallons a day in my 120 but i keep the tank warm so i am closer to 2 percent. I really like the idea that you are looking at an ato. At the time i need an ato I didnt have the money so I built my sump and refugium above the tank and I also store my rodi water above the tank and drip it in at 2 gallons a day and that works great.

 

[cobyb]

cobyjf, dude is your name coby, you would the first person i'v met with the same name as i, (except my father) sweet.
psb thanks for the stats, im going to have to figure out how to rig up an ato.
thanks

 

[JoeKnowsReefs.com]

I once had a 20g nano w/ 10g sump that evaporated 1.5-2g/day!!! The lighting rig caused a lot of excess heat, so I had fans into and out of the canopy to reduce heat, but increased evaporation. The first week or two I went nuts trying to find the leak...only to find a dry floor etc. I was finally convinced it was evaporation because my sg stayed the same over a period of time rather than slowly dropping. On such a small system, loss of 1-2g can cause a significant change in salinity!

Stay on the top off....one of the single most important things is consistency. A tank with a consistent sg of 1.028 would fare better than a tank that fluctuated from 1.023-1.025 every few days...do your best to maintain consistency with all params and water quality.

 

[cobyb]

thats kinda what i was thinking, i going to start looking in to a diy ato

 

[JoeKnowsReefs.com]

thats kinda what i was thinking, i going to start looking in to a diy ato

A very easy and cost effective DIY top off is a reservoir (any food grade plastic container - and should hold at least a couple gallons), some airline tubing, and a gang valve. I've used one on a 75g system for a long time and it keeps my salinity very stable.

Basically keep RO/DI water in the reservoir and drop some airline tubing in it (rubber band it to some dry rock or something to hold it under). Connect the other end of the tubing to a single plastic gang valve (not metal - very important - hehe). Adjust the gang valve to have a continuous drip into the sump. After a little tinkering, you'll have your system constantly being topped off - I've found that this is even BETTER than an ATO system because an ATO depends on a float valve to drop to a certain level, and then water is pumped in. Depending on the size of the sump area, an ATO can pump in a few gallons at once - offsetting salinity rapidly.

With this simple little DIY design, you maintain constant salinity by constantly replacing evap. If you find a large enough container, you will only have to fill it up 1-2x/week

 

[cobyb]

sweet, that sounds like a simple one. perfect for me.
thanks coby

 

[DonW]

A very easy and cost effective DIY top off is a reservoir (any food grade plastic container - and should hold at least a couple gallons), some airline tubing, and a gang valve. I've used one on a 75g system for a long time and it keeps my salinity very stable.

Basically keep RO/DI water in the reservoir and drop some airline tubing in it (rubber band it to some dry rock or something to hold it under). Connect the other end of the tubing to a single plastic gang valve (not metal - very important - hehe). Adjust the gang valve to have a continuous drip into the sump. After a little tinkering, you'll have your system constantly being topped off - I've found that this is even BETTER than an ATO system because an ATO depends on a float valve to drop to a certain level, and then water is pumped in. Depending on the size of the sump area, an ATO can pump in a few gallons at once - offsetting salinity rapidly.

With this simple little DIY design, you maintain constant salinity by constantly replacing evap. If you find a large enough container, you will only have to fill it up 1-2x/week

This I have to disagree with although it is a different method I cant see how its "BETTER". The drip rate is ever changing by the volume of water left in the holding tank. The more water the higher the pressure the faster the drip rate. As the tank drains the drip rate will change. Tank evaporation rate changes throughout the the day so there will be peiods where the rate could not possibly be matched.
A average float switch require .25" of movement to close the contacts. With a 55 galon sump with no return area and no baffles the loss would be .6 gallons before activation. This is an extreme example and most systems would have a loss of many times less prior to contact closure. More accuratly would be closer to .2 gallons or 6/10 of a liter or 2.5 cups in a 12"x12" return area which should have little to no effect on salinity.
The end result is an accurate top off perfectly matched to evaporation rate with no adjustment needed. A holding tank would require occasional readjustment of sump level.

Don

 

[Ichthys]

Hey Coby, if you want to swing by my house in Federal Way you can check out my ATO system, it is pretty simple but extremely effective. I also have an ATO float switch I would be willing to trade for a frag or whatever.. We are both in Fed Way, I am over behind H-Mart off 312th.

 

[jrgilles]

Sounds about normal. This is what I use, its a DIY kit. Has two to three switches, depending which one you buy. The two switch one has one switch to say when to add water, and a backup incase that one gets stuck (so you don't dump the whole RO reservoir into the sump.)

The three switch also has a switch that you run reversed that shuts the system down if the RO reservoir goes empty (so you don't burn up the pump.)

Third really isn't necessary as long as you don't let the reservoir go dry.

auto top-off components

 

[DonW]

The easiest diy electricly operated ATO sytem that requires no 120vac wiring is.

A $20 tunze osmolator replacement pump and two float switches wired to a wall wart. No relays and only requires one electrical outlet. The tunze pump operates on 9vdc but will run just fine on a 12vdc wall wart. The pump is more reliable and can be run dry.

Don