New 40 Breeder setup

[jinoue]

I'm taking my old freshwater 40 breeder and making it into a FOWLR tank.

I've got a eheim pro II canister filter currently with bio media rated for 97 gallons, but I'm thinking about just putting live rock into the filter, and the tank to provide filtration.

A couple of questions:

1) Should I drill out my tank and hard plumb the send/return lines? Why would I do this versus just using the intake and spray bars?
2) I have an eheim jager temp 125w from the freshwater, is this enough for the saltwater?
3) I'm thinking about investing in an apex jr controller to monitor and run the temp, run the lights, and monitor PH. Good idea?
4) How many pounds of live rock should I be looking at? Would the live rock in the filter be enough filtration, or is using it for aquascaping as well as in the filter the best idea.

ANy other general things I haven't thought about? Eheim sells a surface skimming intake for my filter, I'm wondering if that will be adequate to keep the film from forming on the surface.

Also I'm picking up a 30 gallon setup on sunday, and i'm going to turn that into a freshwater, I'm hoping the sump/fuge/skimmer is enough to run the 40 on and then I don't have to use the canister.

Also how long should I run the tank before I think about sticking a fish in there?

 

[Terrance]

1. No. Don't drill the tank for the canister. Wait until you want to install a sump.
2. Yes its enough
3. You can't go wrong with a good controller
4. 50lbs of base rocks + some live rocks sounds good for filtering the water and aquascaping.

Once your rocks is reading 0 ammonia and nitrite, then add it to your tank and add fish afterwards. QTing is golden. Perhaps you could QT in the 40g while cycling the rocks in another vessel with a powerhead and heater.

 

[jinoue]

So how much actual live rock do I need to provide the filtration? When you say Base rock, is that dry rock?

 

[Terrance]

Once the rocks is cycled, then it will provide all the necessary filtration you need. After getting the 50lb base rocks (also called dry rocks), then buy as much live rocks as you would like.

 

[jinoue]

Do I need to dose/test calcium if I do live rock?

 

[Peppie]

Do I need to dose/test calcium if I do live rock?

No, dont dose anything until you understand what needs to happen in the system.


IMO if you are doing a fish with live rock dont do any drilling of the tank yet. Get a HOB skimmer, and a HOB power filter. Some cheap lights, A couple med size power heads. and a heater.

You can run this system successfully with good mait. and regular WC.

When you get enough cash for a sump, wait a little longer save a bit more cash and buy a reef ready larger tank.

Good luck.

Welcome to RF

Pics are required

 

[jinoue]

I'm not trying to dose, I'm trying to plan out my budget, and I need to know if I need to worry about setting aside for money for it.

 

[senji]

+1 peppie. a good water change schedule is all u will need for a fowler system. calcium is mostly used by coral and coraline algae. for young tanks water changes is more than enough. dosing is required by well stocked mature systems when there is a large demand by corals. most REEF keepers don't start dosing until 1yr after the cycle and depends on type of coral kept. like sps will use more calcium and magnesium than most soft corals will use. hope this helps any questions just pm and ill help too what my knowledge will allow. a good book to get and read is "the conscientious marine aquarist" the author is Robert m fenner

 

[Terrance]

if you ever get hard corals, then you will need calcium. for now just worry about nitrate, phosphate, and nutrient export for controlling both levels. keep salt mix and a mixing station ready for premixing your water.

its less work if you take your time researching and planning your tank. if you have a plan, then wait a few weeks and do some research. if your plans dont change in that time period, then proceed with it. if you change your plans, then start all over with the waiting period.

 

[senji]

the best first things to invest in is. a good skimmer. a member skimmy can direct u in best bang for your buck. just don't go cheap on this. then get good testing equipment like safilert or digital hanna checkers. then decent salt mix most of us use instant ocean quality for cheap. then get an aquarium controller like a reefkeeper or an apex unit. makes life easy and a major fail safe on the aquarium. we spend allot of money on these tanks and this can and will prevent allot of problems or warn you of a potential problem. just my 2 cents.

 

[Peppie]

Just one more thing to add to your list. IMO a RO/DI filter system is one of the most important pieces of equipment you can by for the saltwater hobby.
I would buy the RO/DI before I bought a skimmer.

Also but dry dead rock. You will get more for your money

 

[senji]

i meant to add that but he knows its best to use ro/di nuthing crazy for a fowler tank just a 3 stage will do just fine and sure u can find 1 very cheap 70 dollars or less of some1 here has 1 for sale or borrow till ur able to get one.

 

[jinoue]

I'm picking up a sump/fuge setup with a skimmer (I'll have to wait till tomorrow to see what the skimmer is, but it came from the guy who runs the fish department at dennys pet world). I'm looking to get an Apex, I'm looking for temp probe, salinity, and ph for now.

I currently have an eheim pro 2 2026 (267GPH, 97 gallon capacity).

The sump comes with a 30 that I'm converting into a freshwater to keep our current fish for my fiance. I am hoping the sump/fuge/skimmer is big enough to support the 40 breeder, then I can throw the canister on the 30 gallon and run fresh water.

I looked at a few 90 gallon reef setups, but frankly I just don't care about corals at all, and I'm unwilling to do any of the work. I'm only using the live rock because everyone seems to be saying that using bio media (like the bio balls) is less effective than using live rock and base rock.

 

[senji]

stay away from canisters on a marine aquarium. high oxygenated areas and trapped detritus = nitrate factory. ideally u want ammonia nitrite and nitrate ans phosphate at 0.

 

[jinoue]

I want to drill the 40 because it's clean, but I guess I can't do anything until I see that sump tomorrow.

My plan is to gut/clean the 30 gallon, and assuming the sump/fuge will work for the 40, stick the canister on the 30 and get it up and running and put all the freshwater fish in it. Then I can start working on the 40 breeder. Cleaning it out, drilling it, plumb the lines for the sump/return.

I know I need a magfloat, a saltwater master test kit (does the API kit not do a good job? I have always trusted them), a refractometer (any recs?), I have a heater, two thermometers, all the nets and such. I'm looking for a RO unit now.

I am seriously considering investing in an Apex Jr, Temp, Salinity, PH testing. I refuse to use any controller that doesn't have the web interface. Also Apex recommends a second temp probe for the salinity testing unit, is that really necessary?

 

[jinoue]

I have been told by many people the canister is perfectly fine for FO or FOWLR. Especially if I retain my current bi-weekly canister clean out.

 

[Peppie]

I'm picking up a sump/fuge setup with a skimmer (I'll have to wait till tomorrow to see what the skimmer is, but it came from the guy who runs the fish department at dennys pet world). I'm looking to get an Apex, I'm looking for temp probe, salinity, and ph for now.

I currently have an eheim pro 2 2026 (267GPH, 97 gallon capacity).

The sump comes with a 30 that I'm converting into a freshwater to keep our current fish for my fiance. I am hoping the sump/fuge/skimmer is big enough to support the 40 breeder, then I can throw the canister on the 30 gallon and run fresh water.

I looked at a few 90 gallon reef setups, but frankly I just don't care about corals at all, and I'm unwilling to do any of the work. I'm only using the live rock because everyone seems to be saying that using bio media (like the bio balls) is less effective than using live rock and base rock.

What makes you think that a FOWLR tank wont require any work?

 

[senji]

api is not verry reliable/accurate and go bad fast. i use hanna checkers. digital no matching colors very nice. but for vial testing safilert or elos. if u do the math on the cost of these kits hanna isn't so bad as u only replace the reagents which is dirt cheap.so in the long run hanna is cheaper.

 

[jinoue]

I'm not saying that it won't take any work, I'm not interested in doing the extra work required to keep corals. no need for the jackass response.

 

[senji]

all im saying is dont short yourself like using canisters and bio balls they are nitrate factories and a good filtration makes or breaks an marine aquarium. think long run not how can i get this system running fast. nothing happens fast in a marine aquarium other than failures and crashes and money getting spent because of this. so if u spent a lil extra now for good equipment it will save u money later and the headache of a system failure. just my 2 cents and am out good night all.