One Bad apple...Dolphin vs Sequence Saga returns..

[Ed Hahn]

My IAP 90 went up Sunday thanks to Phillip, Zul and AngelsCRX. I monitored my temp and my temp got up to 86 degrees. I figured out through the process of elimation it was my Sequence Stingray Pump.

I wanted more evidence of what happened. I borrowed a laser temperature sensor from a Friend. I found out my Sequence Stingray Pump registered 123 degrees on the outside casing. My Dolphin registered 81 degrees constantly.
I spoke with People at Sequence. They were very, very understanding. I had looked at Kevins Sequence 1000 series pumps in His store. I wanted a Sequence 1000 series pump like Kevins.
I was told the Stingray is a 1000 series pump. I wondered why the noise and heat. I was assured I had a bad Apple. I was asked to send my pump to Sequence. I was told my pump would be repaired the same day and returned same day.
If this does not work I will upgrade to another pump by Sequence. The Sequence people definitely back their product.
Again the Dolphin pretty much word for word told me the Same thing.
They are both definitely good people backing thier products 100%
I hope this helps
Ed

 

[reedman]

Glad you had good experiences with the Ed. Thanks for sharing.

 

[Ed Hahn]

I will test the temperature on another Dolphin External Pump on Friday at the Kennewick Club Meeting. I may visit other people close by to compare all external pumps temperatures. This will hopefully be a chance to compare heat from Dolphin pumps and other pumps around locally. I will let you know as I do it.

 

[DonW]

Ed,
If you want I can check both of mine a 2100 and a 3000. They are both actually cool to the touch. The Iwaki on the other hand is fairly warm. Are you thinking 81 is to hot for the Dolphin?

Don

 

[Ed Hahn]

Don,
My Dolphin 2100 was 81.5 at the hottest. I would think your 2100 would be the same. I had to adjust my heaters today because my temperature went down so much. My Tank temp is reading 78- 79 degrees with out Sequence Stingray going.
The locals have mostly Dolphin pumps going. I think 81 is normal. I think anytime a pump gets as warm as 123 degrees it is going to effect the life of pump and possibly things associated with it. Don, you probably have the same temperature reading device in your shop for looking at Rotars, wheel bearings, air conditioning compressors, alternators, etc. My wife thinks I am insane. I like playing with this tool.
Ed

 

[DonW]

Don,
My Dolphin 2100 was 81.5 at the hottest. I would think your 2100 would be the same. I had to adjust my heaters today because my temperature went down so much. My Tank temp is reading 78- 79 degrees with out Sequence Stingray going.
The locals have mostly Dolphin pumps going. I think 81 is normal. I think anytime a pump gets as warm as 123 degrees it is going to effect the life of pump and possibly things associated with it. Don, you probably have the same temperature reading device in your shop for looking at Rotars, wheel bearings, air conditioning compressors, alternators, etc. My wife thinks I am insane. I like playing with this tool.
Ed

Its not insanity, thats just what men do. I can see I'm going to have a small heat issue. My tank is running at 81 but I havent installed the fans or third halide yet.

Don

 

[Ed Hahn]

Don,
I tested another Dolphin pump on Friday. The temperature of the pump I tested was in the mid 70's. I am certain yours would be the same. I will send my Sequence Pump into Sequence Factory on Monday, November 15th by way of mail. I will see how fast the turnaround actually is. The Public Relations is excellent. I will wait for their reply.
Ed

 

[Ed Hahn]

Sequence recieved my pump yesterday. I have confirmation of delivery on PC.

The way I identified I had a pump delivering heat to my tank was..I turned everything off until I found the heat source. I have a digital thermometer on my tank. I plugged in the Sequence Stingray pump I had and watched my temperature rise with in 10 minutes and continue to climb. I am dissapointed in the coral I lost. But it could have been worst. If you believe your pump is your problem I would consider doing this. I complained to Sequence people that I had heard some of their pumps run and that sold me on them. The Sequence pumps I heard were almost silent. I was told my pump would be pretty quiet when they were done.

If you think your pump is noisey....Here are some things to consider..
Is your pump mounted with a rubber pad?
Is your pump mounted to thick insulation and board?
Is your pump mounted solid to something?
Is your pump being restricted by a gate valve, ball valve, or is it cavitating (have air in the line), hose collapsing,or a blockage in one of the lines?

Dolphin and Sequence people have been very cooperative with me. I am asking you to maintain your emotions and ask them questions if you have a issue.
I asked if I had to pay shipping both ways to get my pump repaired. I was told if they found a problem with my pump that They would pay for shipping on return. The cost of shipping my pump was $15 dollars from Washington to Colorado Springs, Co. I packed that sucker good. The box I used was way too big with over 2 inches of foam all around it.
Ed

 

[dgasmd]

Ed:

I was talking to mojoreef today and I was telling him how angry I was that I bought these 2 sequence pumps for close loops in my 750g SPS tank an they turned the tank into a boiling pot. The tanks does not even have lights on yet and it is open inside my air conditioned house and the temp is 86F!!! He goes to tell m about this thread, so I am glad I found it. I was just going to do the same as you and buy a pair of sequence 1000, but after reading the above, I think I will call them monday and see what they are willing to do.

It is still pretty disappointing that the first pair of pumps I get from them have to be sent back. However, I will give them the benefit of the doubt. Is there anyone in particular I should talk to there or just anyone in customer service?

 

[Ed Hahn]

Dgasmd,
I would give them a call. I would ask for Brian. Please let me know what happens.
I spoke with Brain at Sequence Friday. He said my pump will be shipped out today.
Good luck, and try to remember they want to be the best. So work with them and explain your issue. They seem like really good people.
Good Luck,
Ed

 

[Ed Hahn]

Another thing we need to remember when talking to a factory representative for a product is that Sequence pumps and Dolphin pumps both carry a warrantee. You may want to pull out your warrantee while explaining your problem. I used a temperature gun to spot check areas of heat transfer. Your pump may run warmer on the outside case. That does not mean the heat is being transferred to your tank. One point I need to pull explain again. I have two pumps. I could shut off one pump and monitor my temps. I did that. I unplugged everything I thought would transfer heat in my tank. I then turned my Sequence pump on and let it run for ten minutes. That is when I saw my temperature raise pretty fast. The people at Sequence worked on my pump and did the same test and explained to me my problem. They watched the temperature for 45 minutes. I am pretty sure my pump will react differently when I receive it. Another thing I need to point out is that Sequence called me on Friday. I did not call them. If someone calls you to follow up on a pump and explain how they tested it or fixed it. Its reassuring to me. That is why I am pretty confident in receiving a good pump in return.

 

[big t]

I think that sequence pumps just make the water hot. I have heard this a lot. Look at DR B's setup thread and you will see that he had the same problem. He had 2 sequences on his 180 and his water was really hot with out even having the lights on. He ended up getting a chiller.

 

[Ed Hahn]

Tom,
Sequence can not defend them selves if they do not have your friends pump to look at. Its up to your friend to send pump back in. Again, I had to put my hand on Kevin Pockwells Sequence 1000 series pumps in his shop to see if they were running. That is what sold me on Sequence.

 

[DonW]

Tom,
Sequence can not defend them selves if they do not have your friends pump to look at. Its up to your friend to send pump back in. Again, I had to put my hand on Kevin Pockwells Sequence 1000 series pumps in his shop to see if they were running. That is what sold me on Sequence.

You need to compare apples to apples. Plumbing make a huge difference when it come to heat. My little Iwaki runs 10 degrees higher if I put nozzles on the locline output. I made it run 20 degrees cooler just by switching to spa flex with no bends. I'm sure if my tank held an extra 150 gallons of water I'd see no heat effect at all.
I'm not sure what type of motor the sequence uses. If its TEFC your going to have heat issues. The fan just recirculates hot air back into the motor. The easy fix for this is to put a fan blowing into the back of the motor. This is good for at least the difference between ambient air temp and motor temp. In my case with the Iwaki about 50 degrees.


Don

 

[Ed Hahn]

You need to compare apples to apples. Plumbing make a huge difference when it come to heat. My little Iwaki runs 10 degrees higher if I put nozzles on the locline output. I made it run 20 degrees cooler just by switching to spa flex with no bends. I'm sure if my tank held an extra 150 gallons of water I'd see no heat effect at all.
I'm not sure what type of motor the sequence uses. If its TEFC your going to have heat issues. The fan just recirculates hot air back into the motor. The easy fix for this is to put a fan blowing into the back of the motor. This is good for at least the difference between ambient air temp and motor temp. In my case with the Iwaki about 50 degrees.


Don

Very good points Don. Excellent Advice. Restrictions can cause heat issues. Air circulation helps reduce confined heat. Maybe we can get Brian or Don to chime in here?

 

[NaH2O]

Reeflo Pumps

 

[dgasmd]

Ed:

I am so glad I saw this. I called Sequence today and made arrangements for me to send back my pumps and get the motors replaced by the 1000 series 5800SEQ. They are only charging me $100 for the motor swap on both pumps as the difference in cost between both pumps. which they claim is far below their real cost. I am sending them out tomorrow and they promised me a same day to next day turn around. I'll update when I get them back.

 

[Ed Hahn]

Dgasmd,
You did the work yourself. I think Brian has been watching this forum and is afraid to speak. I would love to see Sequence and Dolphin on here listening to feed back and both companies explaining like Don W did what could cause heat issues. They both state they want to be the Best. I think people working together make better products and definitely is good for both consumer and manufacturer.

 

[NaH2O]

pssst....Ed, I posted a link a couple of posts back. It gives info on the "hot" pump.

 

[les]

Ed,
Could you please explain what Sequence told you the problem was? Don,
I must say that changing pipe fittings out for spa flex will make a difference on total head loss, but are these pumps really that sensitive? When looking at my flow loss calculator, with 2" PVC at 3800 GPH, you only see a head loss of .5' per 90 ell. If you have many ells, then there will be a problem though. I think that Ed's pump had a bad bearing, at least that what it sounded like to me.
I guess what I'm seeing here only proves my point: I use the industry piping standard for all my sizing requirements on plumbing, I have no heat issues other than needing 1200 watts for winter operation.