Our 1st Reef Tank build ever - 70 gal AGA tall

[eww]

I'm pretty sure I'm at the proper gph for the tank hitting right on the 3-5x the volume. I don't have an issue slowing down the drain. It just seems the valves all have to be tweaked so slightly to maintain the balance between the drain and the pump that if anything got in the way or changed we could have a huge mess on our hands. I did jump the pipe diameter from 3/4" to 1" just below where the herbie drain comes together. Is that maybe causing an extra hard pull and creating problems? Should I have left it all 3/4" top to bottom on the drain?

 

[eww]

Sorry. Also if thats the case then all the water your return is capable of pushing should go to the display and not the fuge. I would just use the fuge line for water changes. Looks nice and clean btw

Thanks for the compliments. I do have the return running full bore to the DT now and found the balance with the drain valve. I guess I'm just nervous of an overflow.

 

[MGDMIRAGE]

Probably not understanding correctly but are you throttling down your drains? Always leave them full bore and only throttle down the return pump. If that is what you were doing, just putting it out there.

You have done an absolutely amazing job for a first timer, or even a second or third timer!

It's very clean and just looks plain great! props.

 

[MGDMIRAGE]

Also is there some sort of check valve on the return line? how close does it come to floading the sump if power is cut from the backsiphon?

 

[eww]

Yes MGD, that's exactly what I'm doing. If I don't throttle back the drain it make a horrible noise, even with the vent like (the diagonal one). It sounds like a constant toilet flushing. Also if I open it up all the way the return pump doesn't keep up. It's a Rio 2100 so it should have plenty or return. I figure using an online calc that it should be running 286 gph at my head height with my piping configuration. The drain flow is calc at .7 diameter pipe and 4" overflow size. My overflow is 28" wide. Maybe it should have been smaller??? Maybe like I said it might be the increase from 3/4" dia to 1" dia below where the drain and vent lines meet?

 

[eww]

Also is there some sort of check valve on the return line? how close does it come to floading the sump if power is cut from the backsiphon?

No there is no check valve. I pulled the plug on the pump and there is plenty of room in the sump for what drains so I am good there.

 

[eww]

OK. I think I have figured out what I need to change. The tank has been running all evening in the garage absolutely silent but I can definitely see where a clog could create a major problem. I need to change my set up to where the line that is running diagonally goes into the sump instead of joining the other main drain line. (I now get what you were telling me earlier Chase) The water in the secondary drain would only fight with any water in the main drain and would probably back up and allow the DT to overflow. I am just trying to figure out how I will do this without totally scraping all the plumbing that is in place now. This sched 80 stuff isn't cheap but then what is in this hobby???

 

[iroll253]

Yes MGD, that's exactly what I'm doing. If I don't throttle back the drain it make a horrible noise

Hence why you need more flow.

There is not a maximum flow limit as long as everything is healthy.

Ive seen 29's running 3000 gph

Just a suggestion.

1. Over size pump
2. Return ball valved as necessary
3. Full open drain.

 

[iroll253]

OK. I think I have figured out what I need to change. The tank has been running all evening in the garage absolutely silent but I can definitely see where a clog could create a major problem. I need to change my set up to where the line that is running diagonally goes into the sump instead of joining the other main drain line. (I now get what you were telling me earlier Chase) The water in the secondary drain would only fight with any water in the main drain and would probably back up and allow the DT to overflow. I am just trying to figure out how I will do this without totally scraping all the plumbing that is in place now. This sched 80 stuff isn't cheap but then what is in this hobby???

Cut the main drop at the t and cap it. Then because your joints are so close together you will probably have to redo your safety line. But i would suggest that along with the above post.

Good luck. Like i said pm me if you need anything

 

[Chichas01]

Are you using a ball valve on your drain to the sump? If so, that;'s part of the issue. The Herbie method uses gate valves to tune the overflow into the silent state you are looking for. If your return pump is sized correctly (able to provide 3X-5X tank volume at whatever head preassure you have) then you should be able to have your return pump running pretty much wide open. Just because your overflow can handle more flow, does not mean you have to provide it the maximum it will handle. Start out with the gate valve on the drain wide open and then close it off little by little until you don't hear the slurping anymore.
You also have the right idea on splitting off that saftey drain. It shouldn't tie into your main. It needs to be a sperate path to the sump.

 

[eww]

Are you using a ball valve on your drain to the sump? If so, that;'s part of the issue. The Herbie method uses gate valves to tune the overflow into the silent state you are looking for. If your return pump is sized correctly (able to provide 3X-5X tank volume at whatever head preassure you have) then you should be able to have your return pump running pretty much wide open. Just because your overflow can handle more flow, does not mean you have to provide it the maximum it will handle. Start out with the gate valve on the drain wide open and then close it off little by little until you don't hear the slurping anymore.
You also have the right idea on splitting off that saftey drain. It shouldn't tie into your main. It needs to be a sperate path to the sump.

Yes I am using a ball valve yet it doesn't seem to be creating any issue. It has run all night completely silent. I understand that I need to break the second drain away from the first now and will do that next. So much for everything being so perty and neat

I there an issue with using ball valves instead of gate valves? it seems they both do the same thing don't they?

 

[Chichas01]

ball valves are more for on or off operation usually. In your application, you want the fine tuning capability that a ball valve does not offer becasue of the way it is designed.

 

[eww]

Here is the new plumbing design. It is not glued up yet but I think this will work and it saved me from having to rebuild almost everything. Please note the horizontal pipe is only there to support the two drops. The were kind of flimsy hanging there independently and when I added this snap on bracket I made it solidified everything up very well. Any input???

 

[DolphinLVR]

ball valves are more for on or off operation usually. In your application, you want the fine tuning capability that a ball valve does not offer becasue of the way it is designed.

+1 I would replace the ball valve with a Gate valve to give you more of a finite adjustment. You can pick up a gate valve at Ace Hardware fairly cheap, I think I paid $16 for my 1 1/2 ince valve although its not schedule 80.

 

[Velamondry]

Your drains are turning into siphons with that set up, which is why your getting a slurping sound, what you need to do is replace the street elbows where the drain starts, put a t in there, and then put a small cap ontop of the T and then drill a small 1/8 hole in it so that way it lets air out, but no sound, it will improve your drain rate, and stop that slurping sound, also I would find some sort of input screens or something for your inputs into those pipes you have for your drain, cause some day you will get snails that will crawl over your overflow through the air and then into the drains, down into the sump and all sorts of problems can occur, or even they block the pipe... I have had snails crawl across my tank then out of it, then over the carpet to die in another room, also seen them clog up other drains in the past, IE turbos.

 

[eww]

Your drains are turning into siphons with that set up, which is why your getting a slurping sound, what you need to do is replace the street elbows where the drain starts, put a t in there, and then put a small cap ontop of the T and then drill a small 1/8 hole in it so that way it lets air out, but no sound, it will improve your drain rate, and stop that slurping sound, also I would find some sort of input screens or something for your inputs into those pipes you have for your drain, cause some day you will get snails that will crawl over your overflow through the air and then into the drains, down into the sump and all sorts of problems can occur, or even they block the pipe... I have had snails crawl across my tank then out of it, then over the carpet to die in another room, also seen them clog up other drains in the past, IE turbos.

It is supposed to be a Herbie system. That means the pipe on the right is supposed to be a true siphon (therefore totally silent) and the pipe on the left has a higher input and is for a just in case scenario, i.e. the primary drain get fully or partially plugged and the water starts to rise. What you are describing is a durso drain. I am planning on putting screens over all the intakes of both drains to keep unwanteds out.

 

[eww]

+1 I would replace the ball valve with a Gate valve to give you more of a finite adjustment. You can pick up a gate valve at Ace Hardware fairly cheap, I think I paid $16 for my 1 1/2 ince valve although its not schedule 80.

Thank you Jeff. I think I will be making the change to a gate valve for sure. The only thing is I need it to be a sched 80 because everything else is and I can't find any locally. I can order one for BRS and I just might end up doing that today.

 

[eww]

Update... We got the plumbing all done and have been running around all weekend picking up all the little stuff to get this baby up and running. We picked up the rest of the T5 lighting parts and pieces for BRA (thanks guys) and that is the next project on the list. I got the adhesive black background on this morning and glued the thin black acrylic to the glass overflow box. All nice and pretty now. BTW E6000 glue sticks to acrylic and glass very well. I am just planning on letting it dry for a while before putting the SW in contact with it. We have about 35 gal of SW in the sump and DT so far with a garbage can of another 40 gal sitting in the dining room right now mixing as we speak (yes I did say the dining room. It was even her idea :shock. It will be added some time tomorrow. Only another 10 or 20 gal to go after that and then some fo the good stuff. We picked up a few pieces of LR today and we are actively looking for more so if any of you have some stuff to get rid of we are interested as long as you aren't at the other end of the earth or wanting gold for it . We have decided to go with new sand instead of risking getting some used stuff and either having problems or going through all the work of washing it clean. I only have one pic tonight as the camera is dead (I forgot to charge it from last time I used it). More will follow tomorrow.

Actually set up in the house and putting SW in for the first time. Whoo Hoo!!!

 

[lvsuckerfish]

looks good depending on return pipe you may T off the return and run your reactor with it did you see under my stand today with all the outlets thats for the equipment to run instead of pumps for each item.

 

[eww]

looks good depending on return pipe you may T off the return and run your reactor with it did you see under my stand today with all the outlets thats for the equipment to run instead of pumps for each item.

Yeah, I saw all kinds of plumbing and fittings all over that 240. That is one large tank. It will be awesome once you get the aquascaping done. So I would put a "T" in the vinyl return hose and attach the Phosban reactor to it? If I do that, what section of the sump do I put the return line from the reactor into? I though it would just pull from the sump and return back into the sump and I was wondering if it makes a difference of what section it pulls from and what section it returns to.