Salt the question, once again!

[cwcross]

One more question on this mix. I was just looking at a small container of Kent Marine pH buffer and it mentions borate salts. What are they and where does this fit into the mixture.

MINIATUS :?:

Borate is frequently added to commercial Alk boosters. It will contribute to total alk, but is not used much by marine animals. Borate is added to buffer more effectively in the 8.1-8.4 range when mixed with carbonate/bi-carbonate buffer systems. In natural sea water Borate is very small in concentration to carbonates but contributes very largely to total alk because of its strength as a buffer. Carbonate/Bicarbonate buffers by themselves do not exhibit the correct pKa to provide the strongest buffering power in the range we need them. Adding borate to the mixture adjusts the sweet spot of maximum buffering to the 8.1-8.4 range if added in the correct proportion.

I am not an advocate of borate based buffering systems, other than the borate naturally present in the salt via WC's. If you add an alk booster containing borate, because it is not used by corals at the same rate (much slower if at all) than carbonate/bi-carbonate, it will gradually become a dominate factor in your total alk, which you don't want. This is because the carbonate is constantly consumed but the borate isn't. Several commercial 2-part additives do not contain borate. I would suggest one of them, or stick with the homeade baking soda/washing soda mixture, which I believe is best. Just let WC's give you the borate and that will keep your tanks ratio of Borate to Carb/bicarb where it should be and then just add BS/WS to maintain between WC's...Collin

 

[mojoreef]

Great post Collin. Sorry I missed your question min I was ouot of town. I have toured a few companys that are the leaders in additives for the aquarium market, you would be surprised at the A&H stock piled to the ceiling in thier warehouses, lol


MIke

 

[wrightme43]

SO I had just better start making my own. Thanks you guys. I still don't understand why there is problem with IO. Am I missing something. Is it just low on calcium? It always dissolves fine for me. I buy the industrial 200 gal boxed not for resale kind. Is it any different, I dont think it should be. If there is a better way I am intersted. As it stand now I just add 5 teaspoons of turbo calcium and 1 table spoon of superbuffer dkh to every 30 gals of fresh salt water. I know its not perfect, but it works. Help me out here, I would love to learn more. STEVE

 

[MINIATUS]

Someone clear something up for me will ya. Someone has stated on another board that baking soda when baked becomes washing soda. WTF is he taking about as i thought both products where two separete thing.

MINIATUS :?:

 

[cwcross]

Someone clear something up for me will ya. Someone has stated on another board that baking soda when baked becomes washing soda. WTF is he taking about as i thought both products where two separete thing.

MINIATUS :?:

Yes this is true. It just must be heated to about 50-100C. Following is the chemical relationship:

2 NaHCO3(s) + heat = CO2(g) + H2O(g) + Na2CO3(s)

 

[MINIATUS]

OK, so 100c = 212 F. Then why even add the washing soda to the mix. Im really getting confused on this whole thing.If baking it changes its properties than when I bake a cake Im eating washing soda yeeck.

MINIATUS

 

[cwcross]

OK, so 100c = 212 F. Then why even add the washing soda to the mix. Im really getting confused on this whole thing.If baking it changes its properties than when I bake a cake Im eating washing soda yeeck.

MINIATUS

Well, baking soda and washing soda are really just two forms of the same thing related by acidity. For instance washing soda can be acidified by one equivalent to become baking soda and baking soda can be further acidified by another equivalent to carbonic acid. They are all really the same thing, just metal salts of carbonic acid if various states of acidity.

When considering alkalinity of your aquarium, it doesn't really matter what you add...either baking soda or washing soda. Both will equilibrate in the presence of CO2 from your air. Washing soda is a stronger base so you will get a larger initial pH increase but then this will pull in CO2 from your air until the carbonate and bicarbonate equilibrate. Adding the appropriate amount of either will get you to the same alkalinity and pH point...just through slightly different paths. You would add different amounts of each because the molecular weights are different. As long as you add them slowly, say using a dripper, it won't matter which one you add and making a mixture is just an extra time step. I would just add baking soda through a drip over a day and forget the washing soda. There are some nice articles by RHF in the resources section explaining this in detail.

Collin

 

[MINIATUS]

Thanks for the repy, I think I understand it now. Sinse Ive already bought and opened the washing soda I may as well make me up a batch.
Wish I had listened in Chemistry instead of trying to burn the hair of the girl beside me with a bunsen burner.

MINIATUS :badgrin: