Technical advice needed

[reef rider]

Can anyone help me with size and positioning spec.for holes to be drilled for overflow and return for 50 gal display tank (glass) and 30 gal refugium tank (glass).From what I've been reading overflow and return should be 300-500gph...but I'm not clear on how to determine exactly where I need to be for this setup. I'm also trying to find out how tall the baffles should be in the fuge.I Know you want to have room for backflow in case of power outage.I guess compartment sizes in the fuge depend on eqipment used in it.First diy and I'd like to get it right,keep cost down.Any instruction would be greatly appreciated. Thanks,Tony

 

[mojoreef]

Hey Reef Rider, jump over to the tank design forum and take a peek at some of the setups, it will give you a little better picture on things. For a 300-500 gph return a 1 inch bulkead would be fine (gives you some room in case you increase down the line) but remember to have the bulkhead Before drilling. On the drain you could go the same or up to 1 1/2 but it depends on how much room you have in the overflow box. On the baffles in the sump take a peek as I mentioned above, so yu get an idea of a design you like, from their we can dial it in.


Mojo

 

[Krish]

I agree...Go with the size Mojo mentioned incase you need to upgrade later. That way, you won't have to re-drill a hole. On the baffles in the sump, it depends on a few things. One being the skimmer. If using one, you will have to find out the height requirement for the skimmer to function properly. This will determine that particular baffle height if you want the skimmer to sit on the base of the sump. If not, then you may have to build a platform to raise the skimmer up if you would rather use higher baffles. Here are two examples of two of my older sumps to give you an idea...


In this shot, you will see my skimmer sitting off to the left. With this skimmer, the gate valve which is the exit point had to be above water level. The skimmer could be used internally or externally and for this application I chose external because I had no choice as the skimmer couldn't physically fit in the first chamber. The sump was designed and built before I had the skimmer so the first chamber was out of the question and then the chamber's baffle was so high that I had to raise the skimmer rather high to function properly. Return section I left the baffles rather low for backsiphon purposes.







With this sump, it was custom built with the same skimmer in mind. I wanted it to sit internally so I had a shelf made for it to sit on in the sump. I knew what height I wanted the baffles to accomodate my needs best and so I knew where the shelf had to sit. With this design, I had plenty of room for back siphon.







Just a few ideas to get you going. It all boils down to what you will be using the sump for. If it will have a fuge and how high you need the water level in there for it or if you are using a skimmer, how where doesn the water level need to be set for it and so on.

 

[reef rider]

Thank you for the input mojoreef and krish.I haven't determined what protien skimmer I'm going to use yet. For now I might put a hang on Aqua Remora C on temporarily.I'm still not sure about using the 30 gal tank for this refugium because of the height,16 3/4" and maintenance that might have to be performed.I'm going for a sump/refugium.I will go with the 1" return and 1 1/2" overflow.I'll make sure I have the bulkheads before drilling. Any suggestions where I should pick them up at? I was thinking Home Depot.My local glass shop will drill the tanks.If I do use this 30 gal tank, I was going to use acrylic baffles.I think you need special glue for acrylic to glass. Krish,what are the measurements of the sump with the skimmer external.I'm going to check out the tank design forum.Thanks again,Tony

 

[Krish]

When I get back on my computer in the morning I'll see if I can find the dimensions for you. That sump actually was smaller than what you see in the picture as I ended up adding another small sump section to it to make it bigger which you can see if you look closely is connected by the white bulkhead by the return chamber. I'll get you some pics tomorrow as well. That sump sat under a 75gal tank and the second sump sat under a 38 gal cube. As for glueing acrylic to glass, all you need is silicone. That will do the trick!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[jrgilles]

Might want to put a bit more thought into what skimmer you are going to use before you assemble the sump... I ended up having to redo part of my sump when I bought my skimmer (freebie I started with was a joke)

I glued acrylic to glass. You want weld-on 40 (I believe that is the number, maybe someone can verify.) It is an epoxy and is thick like syrup. It holds pretty well. Once that dried I also put on some silicone for a bit extra. Really the baffles just need to hold in place, not necessary for them to be watertight.

Here are some pics of my tank construction. 75 DT, 50 sump, 20 fuge.

https://picasaweb.google.com/jrgilles/AquariumConstruction?authuser=0&feat=directlink

The last pic in this album shows you have to glue all your baffles in at once, instead of one at a time

 

[Krish]

Look at post# 4 here http://www.reeffrontiers.com/forums/f14/submit-your-sketches-61726/ . It will give you an idea of what Rob was talking about with the planning ahead. You can see how my wet/dry turned into a sump and then expanded all because I kept changing up things. As for the size you asked about, I can't find that info, but if I remember correctly, I think the sump was 24 inches long x 12 wide, but can't remember the depth. HTH.

 

[reef rider]

Thanks for the pics jrgilles.Nice build.Trying to keep my build simple but reliable and efficient.Not sure I'm going to get as intricate when plumeing the system.May just go with flex tubing or hose.Appreciate the info. Tony

 

[jrgilles]

Thanks, I have a detailed DIY for the stand design also.

I bit the bullet and put two drains on the fuge and display tank. One is not used and is there as a backup for flood protection.

The two drains on the DT let me run a herbie style drain, which is very very quiet, but needs a second backup drain because you run it as a full syphon (no air in the line.) Can google herbie if interested.

In some of those pictures I have 4 baffles. Was way overkill. Ended up knocking one out when the sump sprang a leak. Also has a bubble tower around the drain pipes that flow into the sump.Now going with tower and three baffles to stop bubbles, which is probably still a bit more than I need. Nice and bubble free though

 

[reef rider]

After looking around quite a bit, I've think I found a design for the sump/fuge. Left-input from overflow/protien skimmer, middle-return, right-refugium. I'd split the overflow to feed the left 75% and the right/fuge 25%. Any thoughts on this? Pros and cons?

 

[mojoreef]

Do you have a link??

Mojo

 

[DonW]

You should install your return tube and see where the vent hole will be. Then do the math to figure out how much spare space you need in the sump. Also add the skimmer volume to that space.

Don

 

[reef rider]

Mojo. I'm not sure what you mean. Just an update. I got a great deal on a 65 gal, 36"x19"x24, internal overflow, left rear down through the floor of the tank. This is the tank I'll be working with.It came with all the plumbing, bulkheads and trickle filter sump, which I wasn't going to use. System is about 7 yrs. old, Oceanic. It looks to be in great shape. All seams on tank were in great shape, no visible air bubbles. Leak tested with no problems. The stand has a floor space of 34"x15". From floor to cieling is 28". My door opening space is 24 1/4" wide x 26" high, with no obstructions. I'm trying to design a sump/fuge for this.

 

[reef rider]

Don, I'm very new to this kind of project. Are you saying that the space for the return and skimmer will affect the volume of water to be applied to this area?

 

[jrgilles]

Yea that sounds pretty good. Can put ball or gate valves on then you can dial in the flow to whatever you want

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[mojoreef]

Just wondering if you had a link to the sump you liked


Mojo

 

[reef rider]

jrgilles, That is what I was thinking. A ball valve after the split. I could adjust my flowTo either side. Would also help for any maintenance.

 

[reef rider]

Mojo, I was really impressed with Melevsreef.com. Very complete link for DIY.

 

[jrgilles]

Speaking of maintenance, I teed off of my return line to a 'ball valve-hose barb-1"flexible hose'. Makes water changes very easy, as I can use my return pump to dump water out of my system. I have a big sump though, so guess its ability to run water changes depends on the size of your sump.

Anyway, thought I'd mention it since you are designing a sump. Return pump does a great job of filling up 5 gallon buckets.