Fish Moving Time Please!

[parajack]

Hi Steve,
The Hagen Ammonia test kit doesn't seem to give that specific info...It says it's a "Indophenol Method Modified" - When phenol is combined with hypochlorite it reacts in the presence of ammonia to create indophenol blue. The intensity of color is proportional to the amount of total ammonia present

I'm going to be in Seattle over the next few days... heaven help me, my 16 yr old is going to be caretaking the tank I'm going to find another Ammonia test kit to supplement what I have and build some confidence. When I threw away the old kit and started using a new one yesterday, I did start showing .4 to .5 (very subjective reading the color) mg/L. According to the chart given with their kit, the red, yellow and green scales with corresponding ph vs. mg/l columns don't even provide data for anything below 1.2 mg/L. What I'm taking from what is being written for me is that I'm in good shape. However, I don't believe this for a second, and need to achieve more confidence on this NO3 front. My fish seem great, and the PB today looks like he has had the world lifted off his shoulders. I know, this is no time to relax.. infact, this is when I need to turn up my control parameters a notch and be really careful.

>>You are best keeping pH relative to a proper marine environment and dealing with the ammonia itself. Any reading above 0.1 mg/l should prompt an immediate water change.<<

I'm not sure If I'm flirting with disaster and just don't know it :shock: Nitrites are undetectable, NO3 is definitely present at some level. I'm doing min once daily wc at 20%. Fish seem great to me, but I can only imagine how uneducated and subjective that statement truly is.....As you say, the tank is not even close to being truly cycled. How many weeks do you think it will take to start seeing some nitrifying work out of the two double sponge filters I put in at start up? I did purchase a PURA Filtration Pad 710 which I believe is similar or superior to the Polyfilter (if this strikes a nerve or something plz tell me :badgrin: ) Should I cut it to fit inside my hot magnum and get it going?

<<Do you have easy access to an Ammonia alert Badge (Seachem>>

Sure I have one...... been in the tank for a few days now... can't say as it's telling me anything at all. All 4 quadrants seem the same? What is an easy way to test it to see if it actually works?

<<If the ammonia is low-undetectable, there is no reason not to keep a normal pH value (8.1-8.3). >>

I hope I didn't mislead you on this... I clearly have NO3 in the water.. question is how much. I think you are trying to tell me that no matter what my double bio-wheel does, with 7 fish in a mostly uncycled 22 gal, the reality is that I've got NO3 and better do 1 or 2 wcs a day or I'm probably going to kill fish... If this is what you are really thinking in the back of your mind, plz don't keep that feeling to yourself. Intuition is a good thing - especially yours right now - not mine

I probably need to be really careful how much faith I put in how the fish look and how "I feel" they are doing.. Is there a 'mainstay' ammonia test kit/brand that you swear by? If so, plz let me know. There are a couple of Marine specific shops in the Seattle area I will be visiting on monday....In the mean time, I'll try another wc now, and see If I can get a detectable drop in NO3 test reading...

Thanks,
Jack

 

[steve-s]

Just so we are both on the same page and clear here, NO3= nitrate, NH3= ammonia. The measurements your indicating above sound like NH4+ readings, ammonium? May also indicate this is a Nessler kit suitable only for freshwater?

The biowheel should process ammonia and nitrite quite efficiently. Since it was well seeded from the get go, I would not expect much in the way of spikes really. If anything, they will be short lived. As far as the nitrate is concerned, anything below 20 ppm would be decent considering the lack of denitrifying capabilities. Still good to do the water changes and keep that relatively low. Nitrates would need to be very high to actually be the sole cause of fish death.

Cheers
Steve

 

[steve-s]

Oh sorry, as far as the Ammonia badge, it will not register until after free ammonia gets to/above 0.02 mg/l (free ammonia = NH3-)

From Seachem's website...

INTERPRETATION: As little as 0.02 mg/L of free ammonia will produce a greenish hue on the detector surface. This corresponds to a total ammonia (both ionized and free ammonia) of 0.25 mg/L in marine water at pH 8.3. In freshwater at pH 7.0, this corresponds to 3.6 mg/L total ammonia. Free ammonia is much more toxic than ionized ammonia. As free ammonia, the ALERT color corresponds to about 0.05 mg/L, ALARM to about 0.2 mg/L, and TOXIC to about 0.5 mg/L. The ALERT concentration is tolerated for several days, ALARM for a few days, and TOXIC is rapidly harmful. This product is not recommended for use at acid pH

For maximum sensitivity, the unit should be read under natural daylight or daylight simulating light. Red enhancing light minimizes green and blue hues, decreasing the apparent sensitivity of the unit. The response of the unit may be checked by holding it briefly over the mouth of an ammonia bottle: color should develop rapidly.

Cheers
Steve

 

[parajack]

Ok Steve, thanks. NH3/NH4 is what I'm testing for in addition to Nitrite. The Nutrafin ammonia test kit specifies for fresh & salt water. Sorry for the (spelled my) confusion. I'll leave the Seachem tester in the tank.... Maybe it's accurate and the tank hasn't produced enough NH3, or just maybe, a real stretch here, I didn't know how to read it and was waiting for the outer area to turn color. Now that I look at it, the center indicator portion is showing between safe and alert... not really one color or the other but leaning toward safe. After 20% wc, a new NH3 test is showing 3-4 mg/L at ph 3.10, 14ppt, and undetectable Nitrites...

Also, if you need a quick laugh at my expense, the tank is a 29g... Would you believe I fly airplanes for a living? Anything I can do to boost the confidence of the traveling public...
Later,
Jack

 

[steve-s]

The Nutrafin ammonia test kit specifies for fresh & salt water. Sorry for the (spelled my) confusion.

No worries, just be sure you are not reading total ammonia, just the NH3.

Now that I look at it, the center indicator portion is showing between safe and alert... not really one color or the other but leaning toward safe. After 20% wc, a new NH3 test is showing 3-4 mg/L at ph 3.10, 14ppt, and undetectable Nitrites...

One of the two is misreading then or the test is being performed incorrectly. If truely 3+ mg/l NH3-, the alert badge should be showing toxic. Safe would be yellow or slightly green.

Also, if you need a quick laugh at my expense, the tank is a 29g... Would you believe I fly airplanes for a living? Anything I can do to boost the confidence of the traveling public...

I would never...

To be fair though, I can't fly a plane so I guess that makes us even..

Cheers
Steve

 

[parajack]

"Attention to detail" I'm always crying out to my 16yr old....After studying the fine print on the various pages of the test guide, I think I'm starting to understand through the various tidbits of info that are in English. Not the easiest concept to grasp. So the initial test results off the color chart are in total NH3 and NH4 mg/L. I've been consistently in the 0.3-0.6 range of total ammonia. My earlier comment on how relating the ph level of 8.0 to test result didn't even get me into the results chart window now make perfect sense. The highest test result I've shown is 0.5. If you divide this by 1.22 to get NH3, the result is .41. However, this result is not adjusted for ph. The closest chart column reading given is for a test result of 1.2 total NH3-NH4. The NH3 value for this reading with a ph of 8.0 is 0.06, which is in the yellow zone (green,yellow,red). If the spread sheet went to lower initial color test values, a reading of 0.6 total would yield a NH3 amount of .03 at a ph of 8.0. This would be slightly elevated but Green if you believe the Hagen chart. I have yet to achieve a NH3 level which is 0.6 on the initial, total NH3-NH4 color test. I've been close. Anyway, how am I doing so far....

The ph of the water is very critical and is one of the major factors that determines the ratio of NH3 and NH4. According to the Hagen booklet "When the pH is high, the ammonia is in its toxic form. Toxic ammonia will increase exponentially with increasing pH levels and temperature. A pH value of over 8.0 causes a corresponding rapid increase in the toxic ammonia component."

If I were to believe the Hagen spread sheet chart, If I were maintaining my pH at 8.3 right now, instead of 8.0-8.05, I would clearly be in a much more difficult NH3 state, and might have to double my daily water changes. If I were sloppy with pH control, and was running at higher temperatures... like maybe trying to speed up the ick cycle....I could really have my hands full :badgrin:

<<No worries, just be sure you are not reading total ammonia, just the NH3>>

Thanks for getting me to dig deeper..... :exclaim:

I think the Seachem badge is agreeing with my test now....I believe a 20% change and minimal feeding should keep me safe until the tank cycles completely. With the digital temp control, and digital pH readout, it doesn't seem too difficult to keep the pH at 8.0, and hopefully the NH3 at safe levels.

Thanks again,
Jack
PB is really improving. I'll be able to start the 'spot free' clock in a few days I think...

 

[aquariumdebacle]

Go see Ronnie at the Jewell Lake Bowl. He can give you personal one-on-one advice for all you are going through. Tell him some nutcase in Seatown sent you, you will have a friend for life.

 

[steve-s]

If I were to believe the Hagen spread sheet chart, If I were maintaining my pH at 8.3 right now, instead of 8.0-8.05, I would clearly be in a much more difficult NH3 state, and might have to double my daily water changes. If I were sloppy with pH control, and was running at higher temperatures... like maybe trying to speed up the ick cycle....I could really have my hands full

At a pH of 8.0 and a reading of 0.5 mg/l total ammonia (at your highest), the relative NH3 would be 0.0264 mg/l. At 8.3 the same total ammonia should read 0.05 mg/l NH3. Although double, still not deadly really as long as water changes are maintained.

You might find this chart a litte easier for your calculations. It doesn't go as high as 78° but gives you a good idea.

http://www.novalek.com/kpd66.htm

PB is really improving. I'll be able to start the 'spot free' clock in a few days I think...

Excellent news.

Cheers
Steve

 

[parajack]

Thanks Steve,
Vast improvement of the PB. A couple of other fish showed a bit of infestation for a couple of days due I'm sure to the major explosion which was occurring in the display about the time I moved all the fish to the qt.

Thanks again for your help and feedback... getting back each day and seeing me through the critical time was invaluable. I apologize for stumbling on the NH3-NH4 issue... I guess I just didn't look close enough, and caused myself a bunch of extra grief in the process.

I'm so very glad I chose the hyposalinity treatment instead of getting sucked down some other path. I've been doing allot of reading, read allot of threads, and formulated my own strong opinion that garlic and ginger and other more 'subjective' treatments out there are certainly not to be ignored. Quite the contrary. It kind of reminds me of a time years ago when I got caught up in some amazing natural products distributed by a mlm company. Results were instantaneous in some people, un-noticed in others. Some folks were so 'open' to the fact that it might help them, that I believe that they believed it really was... Other people were so against the idea that a a mlm could actually produce and distribute a viable product that they were certain the product wasn't helping them, even though it clearly was. With the hypo treatment, I feel like I had control and was dealing with a known quantity. Not subjective and is working as advertised. Maybe its a bit premature for my to jump to any conclusions, but that is my opinion at this point. Garlic or ginger are probably beneficial in the same sense that any good food supplement is beneficial to you or me.... I really hesitate to take it further...
Jack

 

[steve-s]

Garlic or ginger are probably beneficial in the same sense that any good food supplement is beneficial to you or me.... I really hesitate to take it further...

Best way to look at it really. I can't comment on the ginger as I've never used it but I do doubt it's usefulness in any regard to the hobby. As far as the garlic though, don't dismiss it completely. Although I would never suggest it's use as a cure, it is a great antioxidant and has proven to be at least a beneficial immune booster.

Glad to hear all is well with the tang.

Cheers
Steve

 

[parajack]

Hi Steve,
Things are going great in the QT. PB looks as good as when I brought him home from lfs. My son had no problems with the wcs and testing. PH has settled down. This means that nitrifing bacteria are getting established, and tank is starting to cycle? Or something else? Not having to buffer near as much as I did in the beginning...
Jack

 

[steve-s]

As far as the pH, it just means it's finally stabalized. As I said, it's usually the largest concern in the beginning with the innitial salinity drop/diluted chemistry. You will still need some buffer additions but not near as much, keep checking daily though.

As far as the nitrogens, you never really had a big issue with that (?) but the biofilter should get a bit stronger now.

Cheers
Steve

 

[NaH2O]

Jack - I may have missed it, or perhaps I have forgotten if I read it....How long are you going to do the hyposalinity treatment? How many days has your salinity been in the target range now?

 

[parajack]

Hi Steve,
Thought I'd post a bit of an update. Things were sparkling. I went out of town for a couple of days and came back to the Powder Blue looking like he'd just dropped some tophonts (sp) into the water. He was showing the same darker blue "post ick" spots on his body. Not a big deal big any means, and maybe 25 spots or so altogether that were visible. Sure enough, my son commented that the PB had several white spots showing the night before. He seems pretty clean this eve. Anyway, the QT hit 14ppt on Oct 12th. The display went fallow on the 10th. We have been diligent about keeping it well below 16ppt.....

9 days in full hypo mode... What is the most likely explanation? This was a very minor and short lived (so far) episode. Is it likely that there was another cycle of ick just getting going when the hypo started? The fish went through hell during the week after hypo started. I thought that would be the end of it. I won't ask blind questions here... just want advice on whether or not this is highly unusual, or par for the course at this stage of treatment. I did take a power head out of the display because it's the only one which works for pumping water during changes. I did this about the 15th. I scrubbed it with a brush but didn't bleach it. I've used a ph probe in the display but rinsed it well before returning it to the qt. The fish looked really clean and well before I left on Wed. Now his body looks rough again like he's just dropped a bunch of parasites, but nothing like before. He continues to gain strength and eats stronger than ever....
Your thoughts on this would be appreciated.
Jack

 

[steve-s]

Sorry for the late reply, got caught in the upgrade time yesterday ...

the Powder Blue looking like he'd just dropped some tophonts (sp) into the water. He was showing the same darker blue "post ick" spots on his body. Not a big deal big any means, and maybe 25 spots or so altogether that were visible. Sure enough, my son commented that the PB had several white spots showing the night before. He seems pretty clean this eve. Anyway, the QT hit 14ppt on Oct 12th. The display went fallow on the 10th. We have been diligent about keeping it well below 16ppt.....

9 days in full hypo mode... What is the most likely explanation? This was a very minor and short lived (so far) episode. Is it likely that there was another cycle of ick just getting going when the hypo started?

Possibly another partially cpmpleted life cycle of the parasite (given the info below) but more likely the original trophonts from when the fish was transfered. The depigmentation areas are definately an indicator of the parasites activity.

The fish went through hell during the week after hypo started. I thought that would be the end of it. I won't ask blind questions here... just want advice on whether or not this is highly unusual, or par for the course at this stage of treatment.

Quite common actually given the average time frame for the theront-trophont stages. It's more common than you might think but given the extremely sensitive nature of this particular species and easily "blemished" skin, it just shows up that much better.

I did take a power head out of the display because it's the only one which works for pumping water during changes. I did this about the 15th. I scrubbed it with a brush but didn't bleach it. I've used a ph probe in the display but rinsed it well before returning it to the qt. The fish looked really clean and well before I left on Wed. Now his body looks rough again like he's just dropped a bunch of parasites, but nothing like before.

This is one of the top no-no's in QT procedure. Nothing should be shared between the main and QT. Ideally, you should have two sets of everything (or per QT) so as not to cross contaminate. Some items are easily sterilized but others can be deceptive. The pump for instance has many grooves and small surfaces that can eaily harbor the parasite. It's something to be strictly avoided. If nothing else, use a 10:1 bleach solution for equipment that will not be harmed by it's use. A little extreme but safer than anything else. Just be sure ut's well rinsed in fresh water first and allowed to air dry so the chlorine dissapates.

As for the pH probe, I would simpley leave that with the QT for the time being. It's where it's most needed and the possible fluctuation (need for prescision) on the main are easily dealt with using a common titration kit.

Once the QT process is over it can be properly steralized and returned to the main for it's regular use.

Cheers
Steve

 

[parajack]

Thanks Steve,
So watching the PB go through one heavy infestation, then clean, then another light infestation some days later, and then clean again is not uncommon once in the qt and hypo? From this point on - hypo now for 12 days, I probaby shouldn't see any more infestations, or perhaps another very light infestation may show up in another few days? Despite all the reading I've done, I probably don't have a good grasp on the cycle. I think I need to understand that there were likely several cycles in process, and that each cycle is probably more defined then I had imagined. I've read countless times how the fish will drop the trophonts and then seem great, and then show up with a much worse infestation some days later. Being in hypo, I mistakenly believed that I had interrupted the cycle, when in fact there were two or more cycles on my host PB at the time I moved him into qt and started hypo... Does this sound reasonable to you? Due trophonts 'sense' the negative salinity conditions and lengthen there stay on the host fish to postpone the inevitable? This was something I was considering, and it would make sense to me that the trophonts would delay dropping off al long as possible if conditions wern't optimum, and this would explain the trophonts showing up again well into the hypo course. Has there been any study on this? Also, when the parasite is in the free floating / swiming phase, looking for a host fish, if some did come into 14ppt via the powerhead, how long can they survive while looking for a host? In retrospect, I knew it wasn't the smartest idea to move the powerhead from the display, but I managed to talk myself into it:badgrin: Thinking about it now and looking back at the dates, I tore the display and moved all fish out on the 10th. I moved the powerhead out on the 15th. The display and everything in it was probably loaded with parasites around the 15th, given the fact that the PB looked like he'd just been rolled in salt around that time...I guess I didn't realize that parasites introduced into a qt tank in hypo could find a host just as easily...
Thanks,
Jack

 

[steve-s]

So watching the PB go through one heavy infestation, then clean, then another light infestation some days later, and then clean again is not uncommon once in the qt and hypo? From this point on - hypo now for 12 days, I probaby shouldn't see any more infestations, or perhaps another very light infestation may show up in another few days? Despite all the reading I've done, I probably don't have a good grasp on the cycle. I think I need to understand that there were likely several cycles in process, and that each cycle is probably more defined then I had imagined. I've read countless times how the fish will drop the trophonts and then seem great, and then show up with a much worse infestation some days later. Being in hypo, I mistakenly believed that I had interrupted the cycle, when in fact there were two or more cycles on my host PB at the time I moved him into qt and started hypo... Does this sound reasonable to you?

The main consideration when using hyposalinity is in terms of the tomont. The theront and trophont stages are unafected so they will continue on as normal. Given the average time span for the theront to trophont to "pro" theront stages (about 7-10 days) it is highly likely that what people are seeing is the originally transfered infestation, not necessarily new tomites being released. It really depend on the time frame in which the salinity was lowered. From fish to tomont and then back to tomite can be in as little as 3-4 days. You can still easily enough experience at least one new complete life cycle in the first week. It's not something you would be able to determine effectively in either regard. Hence the need to leave the salinity at treatment level for the 4 full weeks once no further parasite activity is observed.

Do trophonts 'sense' the negative salinity conditions and lengthen there stay on the host fish to postpone the inevitable? This was something I was considering, and it would make sense to me that the trophonts would delay dropping off al long as possible if conditions wern't optimum, and this would explain the trophonts showing up again well into the hypo course. Has there been any study on this?

I am not aware of studies in this regard. Boomer or Terry might have a better response for this one but IME, changes in the parasites environment generally increase actvity not reduce it. It would not be unreasonable to surmize that the parasite may react negatively to less than optimum conditions in terms of the trophont and bury deeper into the epithilium.

Also, when the parasite is in the free floating / swiming phase, looking for a host fish, if some did come into 14ppt via the powerhead, how long can they survive while looking for a host?

The normal timeframe would be unaltered as these stages of the parasite are seemingly unaffected by the lowered salinity. Generally speaking, once the tomite is released, it can suvive upto 48 hours but more commonly about 12.

http://www.petsforum.com/personal/trevor-jones/marineich.html

I guess I didn't realize that parasites introduced into a qt tank in hypo could find a host just as easily...

Not an uncommon mistake, so don't be too dismayed. Try not to do so in future though. The main display will be "infective" for a few more weeks. The tomont can stay inactive for about a month.

Cheers
Steve

 

[parajack]

Hello Steve,
After reviewing the ick life cycle again, when I set up the qt and moved the fish, I brought 3 out of the 4 stages into the qt in mass numbers, using 90% water from the super infected display. The Powder Blue had at least 2 cycles of trophonts - perhaps a third as well. Possibly hundreds of theronts in the infective stage came in with the water. So the way I see it now, there were a couple of days of free swimming time for the theronts to find the PB, and then up to a week for the trophonts to run their course and then disassociate from the host..... and then, because no tomonts reproduced, I would expect several more days for the PB to complete his recovery from the final infestation.This could eat up a couple of weeks no problem....Bringing in a heavily rinsed and scrubbed powerhead could have only introduced tomonts, but I suppose that some tomonts off the powerhead could have hatched because they hadn't been in hypo long enough to cause them any grief.... It's possible that this could have allowed a small cycle to proceed in the qt, adding yet another week or so to the equation. Personally, I don't believe this happened, but it's probably more likely than I care to admit .

I believe this is where I stand right now I am seeing, however, some different looking things on the PB. First of all, he is stronger than ever, and I believe is not enjoying life in the boring qt. I think he plays in the powerhead flow for lack of anything better to do. When I did the wc this eve, he was browsing the back of my hand, and eats garlic soaked algae from my fingers. His color is certainly 'off' somewhat, and he is also showing now what looks like some small flakes of dead skin/tissue falling off. Kind of looks like a few scabs are falling off or something. A few along his belly and a few others scattered around his body. It certainly doesn't look like any kind of infection, and doesn't seem to be bothering him in the least bit, but I'm wondering just the same. I'm thinking that some of the parasitic stage ick may have gotten so embedded and fat on him that they create a deeper 'wound' to the fish. Ultimately the fish may recover differently from one parasite location to another.... Sound reasonable?

Thats an update, anyway. Having never cycled a tank (this 55 was actually abandoned by some neighbors years ago when they up and left town), I'm really wondering when I should expect to see some changes in the qt biology. Water parameters seem to remain unchanged from day to day. NH3 hangs around .02 -.03. Nitrites, Nitrates, and Phosphates are undetectable. Ph 8.0-8.10. 15 - 20% wc every day since the beginning. Steady at 78deg. The tank is still squeaky clean with maybe a tiny bit of algae starting to show up on the pvc fitting internal seems in just a couple of spots. The tank walls, floor, the pvc fittings - everything is squeaky clean with no algae film or anything, and the PB hasn't shown the least bit interest in browsing anything other than my hand. Both double sponge filter setups still look like new. Does this seem normal to you? It's been more than two weeks and I'm starting to wonder. The double bio-wheel came from a tank with live rock and dsb and a couple of shrimp, but NO FISH. I'm wondering if maybe the bio-wheels wern't as cycled as I thought they were, even though that tank had been running for 6 months or longer. It was certainly growing plenty of algae on the tank walls and had housed fish earlier....

Any suggestions for spicing up life for the PB in the qt? There really isn't any place for him to hide out. There are a couple of 2" pvc 90s, but the rest of the fittings are smaller. Should I find something big enough for him to hide in?

Thanks again,
Jack

 

[steve-s]

I'm thinking that some of the parasitic stage ick may have gotten so embedded and fat on him that they create a deeper 'wound' to the fish. Ultimately the fish may recover differently from one parasite location to another.... Sound reasonable?

More than possible, yes. This part concerns me somewhat though....

His color is certainly 'off' somewhat, and he is also showing now what looks like some small flakes of dead skin/tissue falling off. Kind of looks like a few scabs are falling off or something. A few along his belly and a few others scattered around his body. It certainly doesn't look like any kind of infection, and doesn't seem to be bothering him in the least bit, but I'm wondering just the same.

Keep careful watch on this to ensure it does not progress in size or become red in any way. The main concern being bacterial infection. What have you been feeding the tang and are you adding anything other than garlic? Can you post a decent pic of these areas?

Both double sponge filter setups still look like new. Does this seem normal to you? It's been more than two weeks and I'm starting to wonder. The double bio-wheel came from a tank with live rock and dsb and a couple of shrimp, but NO FISH. I'm wondering if maybe the bio-wheels wern't as cycled as I thought they were, even though that tank had been running for 6 months or longer. It was certainly growing plenty of algae on the tank walls and had housed fish earlier....

Signs of algae growth in the QT is actually a good sign. In regards to the biowheel though, it was most likely not as much help after all reading this. The bacterial levels of any system are strictly dependant on the food sources available. In a fishless tank, depending on what it's fed and how often, will have much smaller amount than one that contained fish. A fish system having a constant supply of waste and ammonia will have a much higher bacterial count. The biowheel did do some good though, don't discredit it. The readings you've had thus far are actually better than normal for an uncycled QT.

Any suggestions for spicing up life for the PB in the qt? There really isn't any place for him to hide out. There are a couple of 2" pvc 90s, but the rest of the fittings are smaller. Should I find something big enough for him to hide in?

Larger pieces of PVC would definately be a help. The color loss on the fish could be in part from stress and lack of a proper space to conceal itself.

Cheers
Steve

 

[NaH2O]

The double bio-wheel came from a tank with live rock and dsb and a couple of shrimp, but NO FISH. I'm wondering if maybe the bio-wheels wern't as cycled as I thought they were, even though that tank had been running for 6 months or longer. It was certainly growing plenty of algae on the tank walls and had housed fish earlier....

Any suggestions for spicing up life for the PB in the qt? There really isn't any place for him to hide out. There are a couple of 2" pvc 90s, but the rest of the fittings are smaller. Should I find something big enough for him to hide in?

I'll toss in my 2¢. It is possible that the tank the bio-wheel came from just didn't see the bioload (very low) that the QT is seeing (large fish with very little filtration). The bacterial populations would need to catch up a bit.

For entertainment, you can toss in a large plastic drinking glass or a pitcher for a hiding spot, and some larger PVC pieces.

edit: I see steve beat me to it